The Next Genesis Revolution

[Melf]

Nintendo's recent announcement that their soon-to-be-released Revolution console will play both Genesis and Turbo Grafx-16 games has sent shockwaves through the gaming community, but who exactly is to benefit? Will long-time Sega fans line up to pay to play their favorite classics, or will they snub the former hardware rivals? How will the mainstream react? These are all questions that only time will answer, and Sega-16 takes a look at the whole issue in our latest editorial The Next Genesis Revolution (http://www.sega-16.com/2006/04/next-genesis-revolution/).

[Joe Redifer]

Good article. I agree that Sega CD needs to be supported. But my question for TurboGraf-16 CD and Sega CD support is this: Are they downloadable to the Revolution's miniscule 512MB storage, or do they offer native CD support (just put the real game disc ito the Revolution's disc slot), or both? I think downloading CD games is not feasible simply because the extremely limited amount of storage that the Revolution offers. If you have other stuff saved in that space and want to download a 2nd CD game, well forget it. Even if the audio was compressed (BLAH!) you'll still run out of space way too quickly. I demand answers and I demand them now.

[Flash1087]

I'm more excited for the Revolution than I have been for anything in a very long time.

Did anyone read the Game Informer article about Red Steel? I can't wait to get all Lasorda on some guys with a katana. And the virtual console thing? Dear lord! It's the best idea ever!

Who else is getting one with me on launch day?

[Melf]

Did anyone read the Game Informer article about Red Steel? I can't wait to get all Lasorda on some guys with a katana. And the virtual console thing? Dear lord! It's the best idea ever!

Dude, that is so Verytex!

[janus]

So will this emulate TCD Dracula X? Saying they have support for these consoles is one thing, but don't they need to sign up each individual company?

[Kikoskia]

Only if those companies still have copyrights on those games/give a monkeys anymore. They might not right now, but if this is going to be as big as everyone is hyping it to be, then they will do soon.

I myself am not concerned by the Revolution. I didn't have any interest in the last set of consoles and I don't in the next ones. I do appreciate that this will give the megadrive much needed kudos though. However, I just have a horrible feeling that something awful will happen...

Person: Dude, I played Granada on my Rev today! It rocked.
Me: Oh, that was a good megadrive game.
Person: You what? No, noob, it's a Rev game.
Me: ...-_-"

Are the younger generation actually going to CARE where the games originally came from? Are they actually going to know and aprpeciate that it was on the megadrive, or will they just see the game and thank the Revolution for giving it to them?

[David J.]

As cool as this is, I'm going to be sticking with my orignal genesis.

[Demonic Weasel]

I don't know, it's a godsend to be able to use a controller instead of a keyboard.

[Obviously]

Very nice article. I agree that people who already had an active interest in these games have already dove into the rom scene, but I truly believe that there are a lot of console gamers out there who either don't know a whole lot about roms or never cared to get into the classic gaming scene that may be inspired to try out some older games as long as they're on the latest console. It's not like current generation games don't suffer from piracy as well. The Dreamcast lacks any real copy protection and the Playstation 2 is a joke as well. Gamecube is a lot harder, X-Box not so much. It's just a difference of people being more computer savy, patience, and the morality of "if a game is old and not made anymore is it wrong if I download it but if a game is brand new is that a different level of stealing?"

I've been running into more and more young gamers on the internet who say things like "What's Vectorman?" I think Nintendo's plan with the Rev could possibly teach a few kids about gems of the past that they wouldn't have known about otherwise and I'm glad to see a company finally taking a big stance towards preserving classic games on modern systems instead of as overpriced hand-held distractions.

I personally can't decide if this move isn't aimed at the younger generation or if it's aimed at the "hardcore" and "old school" gamer market that Nintendo attracts like the plauge but I hope and believe it will be a tool used to resurrect classics for people who won't look at anything but the newest, latest pieces of hardware and those who weren't old enough/born at the time the original games came out.

There's so many games that are remakes or sequels of classic games and so many younger players who have never played the games they've evolved from. No matter how I cut this or how much of a success or failure it will ultimately be I still see it as a good thing in the end for the Genesis and all other classic systems that will benefit from this treatment.


Are the younger generation actually going to CARE where the games originally came from? Are they actually going to know and aprpeciate that it was on the megadrive, or will they just see the game and thank the Revolution for giving it to them?

Does it matter as long as they enjoy the games? Kids grow up and usually get less ignorant, but if future generations can get the same magic that I and millions of others felt then I say it's a good thing. If anything this will lead into more people doing some research and learning more about classic games (Of course then they'll discover ROMS and it'll be all over for Nintendo). My only concern is the difficulty level of older games is usually a lot higher than quite a few games games released in recent generations (It bugs the crap out of me when reviewers take points off of a game that is "too hard" when its only mildly frusterating at worst).

[Genesis Knight]

I think that we're going to be holding the short end of the stick when the dust clears. The online market is going to get tighter as a bunch of gushy kids start snatching up everything - that'll make my life even more difficult than it already is. Setting the kiddies on the Genesis on such a large scale is the absolute worst thing that could have possibly happened to us.

Person: Dude, I played "XGranadaX" on my Revvie today! It rocked.
Me: Oh, that was a good Genesis game.
Person: You what? No, noob, it's a Revvie game.
Me: ...-_-

[Slightly edited =P] That sort of thing is going to be commonplace. Gag.

[ary incorparated]

Dude i played Granada x on my revvie today:YAY whats all the exitment for that game just looks so F...cking damn ugly at least the begining of the game,it really hurt my eyes whil even knowing it is genesis.I like to see Herzog zwei aggain i loved that game very much ahead of its time in music then(but ehy Technosoft eh).My uppinion is that granada looks like a full shitted toilet.

[Kikoskia]

Does it matter as long as they enjoy the games? Kids grow up and usually get less ignorant, but if future generations can get the same magic that I and millions of others felt then I say it's a good thing. If anything this will lead into more people doing some research and learning more about classic games (Of course then they'll discover ROMS and it'll be all over for Nintendo). My only concern is the difficulty level of older games is usually a lot higher than quite a few games games released in recent generations (It bugs the crap out of me when reviewers take points off of a game that is "too hard" when its only mildly frusterating at worst).

That is true.

One one hand, as long as they enjoy the games, that is all that matters on that. I am sure many of them will whinge about the difficulty though, so used to being able to coast through games without much of a challenge (Halo springs to mind there...)

But on the other hand...


I think that we're going to be holding the short end of the stick when the dust clears. The online market is going to get tighter as a bunch of gushy kids start snatching up everything - that'll make my life even more difficult than it already is. Setting the kiddies on the Genesis on such a large scale is the absolute worst thing that could have possibly happened to us.

...We may get a lot of people turning up and trying to snatch everything up and not knowing about the prices. This may inflate prices of hard to find games even MORE.

[ary incorparated]

I agree with that very much.Like when youre showing how cool youre yu yu hakusho for the MD is while a friend tells,ahh do you want to have Yu Yu hakusho i already downloaded it.alien soldier now rare then no more Battle mania now rare the no more,its really a big deal like the die hards that buyed it now for the higher prices because they want to have it,getting left behind cause of the revo,why not make good playabol demo,s like some parts really missing like animation with the purpose of still buying the original,why dont they pay the bill good for the real gamers.make Those ports like metal slug 3 on ps2,a bitsy lesser but still playabel.

[Elusive]

I can understand snubbing the 32X, but not the Sega CD.

Oh, give me a break, way to go for a cheap '32X IS STOOPID LOL' joke. Is this a 'classic' SEGA fansite or not?


I think that we're going to be holding the short end of the stick when the dust clears. The online market is going to get tighter as a bunch of gushy kids start snatching up everything - that'll make my life even more difficult than it already is. Setting the kiddies on the Genesis on such a large scale is the absolute worst thing that could have possibly happened to us.

Person: Dude, I played "XGranadaX" on my Revvie today! It rocked.
Me: Oh, that was a good Genesis game.
Person: You what? No, noob, it's a Revvie game.
Me: ...-_-

[Slightly edited =P] That sort of thing is going to be commonplace. Gag.

Why would they buy a hard copy of the game (and possibly a used console to play it on if they don't own one already), when they've already paid for a ROM download? As I've said before, ROM emulation hasn't hurt the price of games in the slightest. Why should it change when the Revolution is released?


I've been running into more and more young gamers on the internet who say things like "What's Vectorman?" etc

OH CHRIST NO NOT VECTORMAN would I expect the average 13-year-old to know about Jet Set Willy? As far as I recall, that was a golden title of its day. Dig Dug? Pitfall Harry? Come on. 'Golden oldie' or whatever is so subjective.

Personally, I think the 'Virtual Console' program is aimed at people who want to play old games. There you go, that covers all bases. Problem solved.

[Melf]

Oh, give me a break, way to go for a cheap '32X IS STOOPID LOL' joke. Is this a 'classic' SEGA fansite or not?
Way to miss the point. It has nothing to do with that at all. The 32X is much more powerful than the stock Genesis, and the Rev's limited memory probably won't be enough to accurately emulate it. Moreover, the 32X has fewer than 40 games. Do you honestly think it would really be worth the effort?

[Kikoskia]

In truth, no one truly knows what impact this is going to have on anything really. Nintendo and possibly Microsoft are taking big risks hoping that people will pay for software they can download free off the internet.

They are also taking a risk in believing that the majority of people in the gaming world still appreciate a good game before good graphics. I have seen slowly over time that people tend to simply look at the latest 3D engine and praise it's virtues and use it as an excuse to say that any game is great, even if it stunk to the high heavens. The people that are fully prepared to play old games (like us) to the extent we do are in a minority. The test for this would be simple; if they had released Halo with Doom graphics, would people have bought it? No, they wouldn't, regardless of HOW good the gameplay was.

[kevinski]

But my question for TurboGraf-16 CD and Sega CD support is this: Are they downloadable to the Revolution's miniscule 512MB storage, or do they offer native CD support (just put the real game disc ito the Revolution's disc slot), or both?

Actually, Miyamoto has stated that Revolution will support most storage devices with a USB interface. In other words, if you have a 300GB external HDD laying around, you probably have nothing to worry about. The downloads would likely contain special information that would only make them playable on the original machine, I would assume.

Still, I hope that Nintendo keeps track of which games have been purchased by each player, as I'd hate to see what would happen otherwise if someone's game downloads became corrupt. I, personally, would rather just see the game content steamed from Nintendo's servers.

[Flash1087]

Dude, that is so Verytex!

HAHAHA!Good one, man.

[Melf]

Still, I hope that Nintendo keeps track of which games have been purchased by each player, as I'd hate to see what would happen otherwise if someone's game downloads became corrupt. I, personally, would rather just see the game content steamed from Nintendo's servers.

I hope they do something like what's on Xbox Live. Once you pay for the download, it tracks it so you can DL it for free again if you should lose the data. That way, you don't end up having to pay twice for the same thing.

[j_factor]

So will this emulate TCD Dracula X?

That is not confirmed. It is possible. Nintendo reached an agreement to get Hudson's Turbografx* games. Seeing as how Konami owns Hudson, it's conceivable that Konami's PCE/Turbo games (which there aren't many of) could be thrown in as well.

However, even if they do get Konami's support, Dracula X may still not be on there. Reason being, they've only confirmed that this service will include hucards and CD-ROM2 games. Dracula X is a Super CD (System 3.0) game, and they haven't stated one way or the other whether Super System (or Arcade System or Supergrafx) games will be supported.

* On a side note, it's also unclear if it'll just be Hudson's Turbografx games, or if you'll also be able to download Hudson's games for NES/Genesis/SNES.

[Joe Redifer]

That'd be great to play Supergrafx games. It'd be trivial to emulate (as would System 3 CD-ROM games and Arcade Card CD-ROM games) after the TurboGrafx-CD is already emulated.

[ary incorparated]

Mega cd would be fine,its hard to emulate but if it is going to be then i like that,Still if i played them on revo ill buy em origenal,the rom is just to see for me how good the game is.Yes elusive youre right roms are already there but not pushed by the media,since it is illigal a bit.so maybe something that always was illegal is now available and pushed by the media,Retro for cheap prices.

[djtwok]

My thoughts:
First - sega cd HAS to be supported.
Second - what price would you be willing to pay ? i would say max. 3€ for a not rare game like sonic 1, max. 9€ for a cd game.
Third - I really hope, that maybe some betas would be released its ok if they cost more. Maybe some producers will make new games for genesis ? That would be faster and cheaper to make than a rev game.

[ary incorparated]

Brilliant idea,up to date genesis games only on revo okay graphics are older,but if people get into that why couldnt they,like the genesis is an individual part of the revo so people want to play more newer and the same kind of games often so why not keeping it up to date in its state,Yeah TF4se or Tf6 released for the revo,in the same state Tf was good in,hell yeah maybe theylle should consider it.

[djtwok]

The absolute best thing would be if the downloaded titles (the cartridge titles) could be transferred to nintendo ds (should have enough power to emulate genesis)or an future portable console.

[ary incorparated]

Yeah that would be great.but keep them up to date like the classic titles,like DK for the gba etc,Ds certainly must have the power to do that,GBA never can compete with the power of the genesis.

[AmyDoesn'tDouche]

Person: Dude, I played Granada on my Rev today! It rocked.
Me: Oh, that was a good megadrive game.
Person: You what? No, noob, it's a Rev game.
Me: ...-_-"

That's hillarious. I joined these forums to say that.


Are the younger generation actually going to CARE where the games originally came from? Are they actually going to know and aprpeciate that it was on the megadrive, or will they just see the game and thank the Revolution for giving it to them?

Does it matter? History will be history, some people will just choose to be ignorant of it. That doesn't mean that history will be erased.

[Obviously]

GBA never can compete with the power of the genesis.

Do you mean "power" as in the selection of games on the GBA or power as in hardware? Hardware wise the GBA is superior though some developers had problems scaling down sprites in certain games which makes a lot of retro ports on the GBA look pretty terrible but games made specifically for the GBA like Gunstar Super Heroes look jaw dropping. Of course now with the DS and PSP the poor old GBA looks pretty ill in comparison.

My roommate and I were also discussing a few days ago how nice it would be if you could transfer the Revolution ROMs to your DS. But hell if you wanted to do that you'd probably be using a GBA flash cart or you bought a PSP strictly for emulation.

[janus]

But does the GBA have BLAST PROCESSING? NO!

[ary incorparated]

What i mean is in the hardware,does GBA have 10 channeld music,dont think so,GBA never can match the clear sound of batman and robin and Thunder force 4,BTW the way the games where made on megadrive is much more impressive,you dont see a photo in the background to compremise other graphics(yup gunstar super heros uses photos)like the stage with that boat,stage 3 i geus youlle see a damn cheap photo in the background.Same as in games GBA is a bit bringin standart snes alike ports and boring tony hawk and need for speed game nothing that is intressting even the graphics are horrible mostly,when trying 3D.GBA 32 Bit,so that means the technologie of 32 bit was brought by nintendo in a handheld in 2001 and that like 6 years or more later,and looks like Trown upp 3D rendered,a few games do look okay like asterix xxl one of the nicest,even 32X surpases it easy if it would.Bits dont say much but ehy when thinking of 32 bit im thinking about PSX and saturn and others,pretty nice 3D and then playing GBA while noticing that it is 32 bit,i dont notice i hate the system a bit.

I dare to say that many saturn games look nicer then DS games,DS games have some ugly polygons,not all but some like DBZ supersonic wariors,and NFS Underground 2,yuck Burnout,come on.Sega rally powns most of em.Why not making some staurn games for the system eh.

[ary incorparated]

BTW Jnus what does blast processing mean,yup not much just a comercial piont,since competing snes.it was like real 16 bit speed aggainst a 8 bus that snes had.7,56 HZ aggainst 3,56 HZ,Dit you know that somethinmes snes had a built in cartridge processor like in SF alpha 2,what a downfall.is more the 16 hZ that the gba has blasting enough?,thats some speed which is requered when trying to do 32 bit.

[Balrog12]

Isn't this really a prime example of why ROM use is illegal? While many game copyrights may not get enforced heavily, rest assured someone still owns the things. They don't really expire anymore (not anytime before most of us will be very old, if not deceased anyway, and thats if they aren't renewed.

I know it won't work, but I wouldn't blame developers who are in on the Revo thing if they started to enforce the old copyrights much more strongly, even against people who don't distribute the things.

The reality is that this is just prrof that gamers have been lying to themselves regarding the ethics of ROM use.

I know it's hard to bite the bullet, but the best policy IMHO is to
1. just look for games that were produced in sufficient quantity that you can still afford to buy them (especially avoiding expensive overblown cult games cough RSgun cough MDYuYuH cough).
2. Play them on a collection or download them legally to something.

I have so many real games to play on the origibal I would be an idiot to steal games......

That said, I doubt I will use the Revo retro functionality all that much, mainly because I already have the games that would be on it, otherwise I'd be thrilled.

And as far as it being able to run the actual discs.... I guess we can pray........

I would especially appreciate the ability to run JP MegaCD games directly (yeah right....but I would appreciate it)

[ary incorparated]

it is possible,same for the 512 Mb storage is more then enough,you can makes zip or rar files Torrents and also cd,and if you have a emulator that can read torrent then tons of games can fit,and the storage is enough,i hope so to that mega cd wil be ported.

[ary incorparated]

check www.Racketboy.com for some info about some new sega console that has the ultimate sega backwards compatibility,i dont know for shure what it is or if its coming on the market.

[Ghaleon]

Has anyone heard anything about the possibility of the (relatively) cheap Wii dev kit including separate packages/sub-kits/whatever to allow developers to program directly for the various virtual consoles the Wii will support? Or about the possibility/probability of Nintendo and/or the owners of the original systems actually licensing--or, more to the point, publishing for online distribution--new games developed for these virtual consoles, especially by independent developers?

[Garlo]

Or about the possibility/probability of Nintendo and/or the owners of the original systems actually licensing--or, more to the point, publishing for online distribution--new games developed for these virtual consoles, especially by independent developers?

It is my understainding that yes, that will happen. I'm guessing that we will see original games for the Wii and original games for the virtual consoles.

[Genesis Knight]

Isn't this really a prime example of why ROM use is illegal? While many game copyrights may not get enforced heavily, rest assured someone still owns the things. They don't really expire anymore (not anytime before most of us will be very old, if not deceased anyway, and thats if they aren't renewed.

I know it won't work, but I wouldn't blame developers who are in on the Revo thing if they started to enforce the old copyrights much more strongly, even against people who don't distribute the things.

The reality is that this is just prrof that gamers have been lying to themselves regarding the ethics of ROM use.

Interesting point, and one I'll concede.

[j_factor]

I don't think that's necessarily a valid point, particularly on the "ethics" issue.

I don't agree with Sonny Bono's copyright act. I don't think it's unethical to violate it. I don't think that every bill Congress passes is necessarily a rule of ethics.

If you want your copyright to last a century, you should have to file for an extension. It shouldn't automatically last that long.

[TidalTempest]

I like how Nintendo are offering access to all these old games. Personally, I'd rather stick with the originals, but it will be good for the newer generation of gamers to see how good these games are. Perhaps they might even start demanding more from current generation games because older gamers are generally much more entertaining and fun. Of course, this is wishful thinking - most are probably more interested in the latest Zelda or Mario game. Still, I'd like to think that some bored Nintendo gamer waiting for the next big release will give some of these classics a go and fall in love with some of these games.

It will also be good for gamers like us, who love the older generations of gamers more, to be able to legally download a ROM of a rare game through this service to be able to try it out without making a huge hole in our wallets.

I like the idea that people will be able to develop new games for the old system's that the Wii is emulating. I wouldn't mind being involved in this, if it's not too difficult to do.

Mega/Sega CD emulation is a must. I can understand not emulating the 32X due to it's small library of games, but the Mega CD has a decent library of games that I would love to try before deciding on whether to purchase the original version or not.

[Kusanagi]

it's a cool addition to have those oldschool games on the nintendo rev, but it can't be compared to the satisfaction you'll have when holding an original black sega controller in your hands and to the beautiness of seeing the cardridge docked in your 16bit console mounted on a megacd with a 32x sticking on top of it:D