What's a good size first run for a Genesis homebrew?

[slobu]

What's a reasonable production run for a Genesis homebrew? If I can't find anyone to make carts I may have to use the cheapest Flash Carts I can find, and that would only be less then 10 at a time. Is that enough?

[Guntz]

Genesis carts are really easy to repro and at least a few people do them regularly. I bet MrMark and BeaglePuss could do a repro run for you, they've done them for other people in the past.

[Anonymouse]

have you made a homebrew game?

[slobu]

Genesis carts are really easy to repro and at least a few people do them regularly. I bet MrMark and BeaglePuss could do a repro run for you, they've done them for other people in the past.

I appreciate the leads! I contacted MrMark (strangely on AtariAge) and am awaiting details on pricing and whatnot. It's been a few months so he must be crazy busy.

But, about the size of the run? What do people usually go for? Or, at least, what have people seen in the past?

[slobu]

have you made a homebrew game?
I'm developing for the Genesis but I've gotten 2 of my Atari 2600 games put on carts. No experience with this side of the fence though.

Nitebear on Sleepystreet (Signed by Freddy Krueger (http://www.atariage.com/forums/topic/169496-nitebear-on-sleepystreet/page__st__25#entry2111752))
http://gbatemp.net/topic/309413-nitebear-on-sleepystreet-9272011/

CandyBar
http://www.panic.com/blog/2010/11/candybar-2600-found/

[SpaceFlea]

I'd say 50.

[slobu]

I'd say 50.

Thanks for the data. What brought you to that number? I think dra600n (of Airwalk Studios) started with 35 for his first run of Hangman SG. I managed to snatch a later run of his work.

[Guntz]

I've seen smaller scale homebrew runs between 25 and 50 units. It wouldn't be a bad idea to gauge interest on forums like here and SegaAge, but I don't know if those forums have enough traffic to get the word out...

One thing I would suggest though, is don't shy away from doing more than one production run. People like multiple runs of a game, be it a hack or a homebrew. It means the game stays in general availability longer.

[BeaglePuss]

Just to chime in here...

I could easily whip up some carts for you if you're interested in doing a run of games. I've helped dra600n with Hangman SG and I made carts for DreamTR when he released Indy Heat. I'm going to be making carts for another Genesis homebrew that is nearing completion at the moment as well. I can't get into any details, but the game is absolutely awesome.

I've made over 1,000 Genesis reproductions at this point, so a small run will take no time at all. I managed to sell over 100 copies of my Blockbuster Championship reproduction, so if the homebrew is good enough I could see you selling a great deal more than 50.

PM me any and all details and I'll do my best to help you out.

[slobu]

I'm going to be making carts for another Genesis homebrew that is nearing completion at the moment as well. I can't get into any details, but the game is absolutely awesome.

PM Sent, thanks BeaglePuss!

[TmEE]

For my SMS game I am making I won't settle for below 500, and for MD game definitely not below 1000

[slobu]

For my SMS game I am making I won't settle for below 500, and for MD game definitely not below 1000

Who makes SMS carts? Or, can you afford that volume because you make your own?

[Christuserloeser]

I think it really depends on the quality of the game. If it's something with nice visuals, sound and packaging it would undoubtedly sell rather well so it would qualify for a larger print run such as TmEE mentioned. If it's something hat looks and plays like Hangman... it probably shouldn't deserve to be published on cartridge at all.

I don't think a game necessarily has to be as complex as Pier Solar or any original licensed 16-bit game to qualify, but you should make sure it's solid in its execution and just fun to play.

Prime examples of games that I think would easily qualify would be Uwol: Quest for Money, Q-Bert, Pringles the Game, Project MD, or Rick Dangerous MD.

Btw, Watermelon already is an established Mega Drive publisher looking for software to release on cart. They already got the infrastructure in place to produce authentic cartridges and cases, so if your software meets above criteria I would definitely try to contact them. I know for certain that they're looking for homebrew games to publish.

[TmEE]

Watermelon is the route I go once the time comes

[slobu]

I think basing production runs on the "quality" of the game is a perspective from the gamers point of view. From the game developers point of view he has to know a cart reproduction service can deliver in a reasonable time frame at a reasonable cost and in the specs that the game needs. He also has to have a clear idea what the licensing agreement is.

I know what my standards are and the quality I can output. The question is what publisher or reproduction service can work best with me to channel that.

dra600n took most of the risk by being his own publisher. It was a labor of love and very much a new experience coding for the Genesis. He and the guy who made the carts were in it to homebrew for the console they grew up with. Even if a release doesn't look like Duke Nukem 3D it IS keeping the dream alive. I made sure to snatch Hangman SG up to support that.

[moon]

Who makes SMS carts?

A bit off-topic as the mentioned creators only do this for fun ( afaik ). But IchigoBankai makes incredible SMS repros .. like this 4-in-1 Alex Kidd multi-cart ( he even made a snazzy brochure containing all of his releases ).

4977 4978 4979

And Sebastian Tomczak created this sexy 32KB EPROM cart.

4975 4976

[slobu]

That is damn sexy! I can't find much info besides his blog entry describing (what sounds like) a one-off EPROM cart.

I could imagine using a port of ZX Basic and this cart to get some homebrew going
http://www.smspower.org/forums/viewtopic.php?t=12902

[Guntz]

dra600n took most of the risk by being his own publisher.

Technically, MrMark/BeaglePuss/The Nolan Bros. published his game...

[slobu]

Technically, MrMark/BeaglePuss/The Nolan Bros. published his game...

No offense meant. As I understand - and I understand very little - I thought BeaglePuss by hand put the carts together and dra600n advertised and sold them using his own paypal account.

When I think publishing I think of someone like RetroUSB who produces and sells carts and gives developers a cut of the profits.

BeaglePuss hand builds cartridges and burns a game onto it and gets paid for his work. He's as much an artist/craftsman as a programmer.

[Guntz]

I don't think it's much of a stretch. If dra600n didn't make his own carts, be it repros or custom made, then he wasn't really the publisher. Somebody else filled that job, which was the Nolan Bros. (I don't know if they do work together or separately)

[dra600n]

Yep, the Nolan Bros. did do the run of Hangman SG games for me, but they agreed to release it under Airwalk Studios, to help me out.

And hey, Hangman SG might not look like the best of game, but quite a few people who said "this game looks like ass" ended up playing for more than 2 hours in 1 sitting :) It also helped to push Affinity:Sorrow along, so don't bitch :P

[Guntz]

I just feel the box and instruction sheet (if there was one) were totally unnecessary. Cart only would have been plenty for a game of that caliber. Do people really like having all their games in boxes?? Every last one? *sigh*... Just didn't make much sense to me. I voted with my wallet, so that's all I really need to say I guess. The game still sold out though, didn't it?

You're gonna wipe your ass on my copy of Affinity: Sorrow, right? :p

[Hidden_Darkness]

A bit off-topic as the mentioned creators only do this for fun ( afaik ). But IchigoBankai makes incredible SMS repros .. like this 4-in-1 Alex Kidd multi-cart ( he even made a snazzy brochure containing all of his releases ).

4977 4978 4979

And Sebastian Tomczak created this sexy 32KB EPROM cart.

4975 4976

does he sell any of the repros he makes? I wouldn't mind having the 4 in 1 cart and some of those releases pictured in the brochure.

[moon]

does he sell any of the repros he makes? I wouldn't mind having the 4 in 1 cart and some of those releases pictured in the brochure.

Not that I know of ... to add insult to injury, check out this video of the cart in action.

BoiE1yxMxSs

[dra600n]

I just feel the box and instruction sheet (if there was one) were totally unnecessary. Cart only would have been plenty for a game of that caliber. Do people really like having all their games in boxes?? Every last one? *sigh*... Just didn't make much sense to me. I voted with my wallet, so that's all I really need to say I guess. The game still sold out though, didn't it?

You're gonna wipe your ass on my copy of Affinity: Sorrow, right? :p

From what I understand, most people love having cases for all their games. Being my first homebrew, I wanted the full experience, and the Nolan's helped create that. Yep, all copies sold out, though I'm just waiting for the labels to come in and I'll have a fresh new batch :P

As for your copy of A:S, it's going to be swapped out for a home made 16 bit version of Smurf Porn haha

[sega16]

Here is a website on how to make your own cartridge
http://www.raphnet.net/electronique/genesis_cart/genesis_cart_en.php
It has the pcb files but one note atmel stepped out of the parallel flash business in 2010 due to terrible lead times up to 52 weeks and it appears that microchip took over making the f040 series 5v 4mbit x8 flash here is the new flash:
http://www.microchip.com/wwwproducts/Devices.aspx?dDocName=en549494
and luckily it is still available in dip package for easy programming but once you go to production it might be better to use the surface mount edition because now a days surface mount is actually cheaper than through hole mount pcb.

[Azathoth]

Slobu, YGPM.

[sega16]

Anyone want to make this?
In my schematic is says 470uf you can just use 47uf
http://s16.postimage.org/d0lrg5083/8_megabit_5v_genesis_flash_cart.png

[slobu]

Anyone want to make this?
In my schematic is says 470uf you can just use 47uf
http://s16.postimage.org/d0lrg5083/8_megabit_5v_genesis_flash_cart.png

For my purposes that wouldn't do. The board would still need a case too. Some people can do both hardware and software. I, personally, can barely do the software side :p

Seems kinda sketchy as the author mentions mistakes and only references the source files for correct/working info. He should have just edited the instructions with correct information. Seems lazy - and greatly ups the chance of rework on my end.

[sega16]

I just posted it because I made it and did not use it so I hoped to atleast help someone with it. I was just being lazy about the schematic and it was just sitting on my computer never to be used again because while making it the plan was that I was going to make about 25-50 flash carts myself and make a flash programmer (atmega328 with a few io expander and a few leds for status) to save up money to make a surface mount flash cart that is smaller and uses a level shifter and 3.3v flash (3.3v flash + level shifter is cheaper) also featuring a built in micro controller (AT32UC3A3256) http://www.atmel.com/devices/AT32UC3A3256.aspx?tab=overview supporting the i2s bus allowing the users of my cart to add enhanced audio with the external 24bit dac and SVP style enhancements
But while making the 5v 1megabyte flash cart and programmer I realized that it would not be a good cart because 1. It needed an external programmer 2. The through hole components on the programmer make it pretty big. 3. 1mega byte does not cover all genesis games So I decided I needed to come up with some thing else that is easy for me to make so I could save up money for to get alot of these run so I can offer reasonable price (40-50 NOT 78 unlike a competing product for the self programmable flash cart with powerful micro controller and sd card support) And NO I do not believe in kickstart I do not want a bunch of people sending me money only to find out that something went wrong and they lost their money I can not let that happen. I would like to have the product BEFORE someone wants to buy one. So you will hopefully see a flash cart from me soon that offers a fair price but contains alot of features.

[slobu]

@sega16: oops! Er, I guess I didn't read your post very well. Didn't realise YOU were the guy who made that cart! Hope I didn't come off too harsh.

Someday I hope someone gets as far as AtariAge and their Melody boards. With AtariAge you can literally online order your cart. Just send the binary and they have the boards ready. No need to make anything as expensive as a Everdrive clone. Just something easy for one-off carts.

[sega16]

You did not come off too harsh at all and if you do want a on off cart then you would want to make my cart schematic. I estimate with the expensive 5v nor flash and the time it takes to program and test the cart it would go from anywhere between 8-12 dollars per cart WITHOUT case. I did not realize there was a demand for that kind of service and also I should probably make an lpt based programmer instead of using a microcontroller it would lower cost.