Mortal Kombat III

[Melf]

It's hard to believe they've made as many Mortal Kombat games as they have, and the series seems as popular as ever. One of the most anticipated installments was Mortal Kombat III, which was released on a whole slew of consoles. The Genesis version held its own, and offered gamers another reason to piss off legislators. Read the full review (http://www.sega-16.com/Mortal%20Kombat%20III%20review.htm) for all the gory details.

[16bitter]

I took issue with this:

"The combo system worked similarly to the one featured in Killer Instinct, which popularized the concept of combo's, or moves that when used consecutively, would create devastating attacks.

Now, if any game popularized combos, by way of actually creating the system, it was Street Fighter II rather than KI. Also, there were combos in all the MK games, two of which saw release before KI.

In a stricter sense, MK3's system feels somewhat close to KI due to the new run feature which seemed at times to create more pre-set button presses rather than a mixture of move selections with timing.

I'd also add that MK3 to me seemed lacking in creativity compared to II. The fatalities outright suck compared to the majority in II, and the addition of the new animalities was plain pathetic. The game was loaded with secrets, but if my memory serves the only secret battle was with Smoke.

I actually had as much or more fun playing Galaga.

[Melf]

I was thinking about the combo thing too, but I think he's right. SF II created the combo system, but KI was the game that took it over the top and made it a mainstay of the genre.

[Mel]

I was thinking about the combo thing too, but I think he's right. SF II created the combo system, but KI was the game that took it over the top and made it a mainstay of the genre.

Not only did it take it over the top, it also kept count of hits. Yes combo's were possible in SF2, and MK, BUT Ki kept count, gave out bonus points and took the combo thing to another level. If I remember right, KI took 2 and 3 hit combo's from SF2, and MK, and turned into 7, 10 and 15 hit combo's while promoting and praising the combo's.

MK started doing this at MK3, and I believe (not sure) that SF started doing this with the Alpha series.

[Mel]

Shit, I still have the phrase "Hyper Combo" stuck in mhead.... i hated KI.

[Melf]

CO-CO-CO-COMMMMMBO BREAKER!!!!

:lol:

[16bitter]

I was thinking about the combo thing too, but I think he's right. SF II created the combo system, but KI was the game that took it over the top and made it a mainstay of the genre.

Not only did it take it over the top, it also kept count of hits. Yes combo's were possible in SF2, and MK, BUT Ki kept count, gave out bonus points and took the combo thing to another level. If I remember right, KI took 2 and 3 hit combo's from SF2, and MK, and turned into 7, 10 and 15 hit combo's while promoting and praising the combo's.

You could get far more than three hitters in the original SFII. And Super Street Fighter II introduced the combo counter, not KI.

Also, as far as crazy combos, X-MEN:COTA came out around the same time as KI.

I'd still argue that SFII made combos a mainstay. It's not as if KI popularized the term in fighting games -- combos were already well known after a few months of SFII's release, and it was a far bigger game than KI ever was.

[16bitter]

Did anybody else have less fun with MK3 at home than the arcade? I played the hell out of it while being stuck at various bowling alleys on the weekends with my grandfather, but at home, while it was fun to screw around with a bit, it got lost in the shuffle of the PS's launch for me.

Also, I never did have friends that could play fighting games for shit.

[Mel]

MK3 did get lost in the Generational shuffle. As for KI vs SFII, must be a regional thing. Besides, Im not going to sit here and defend a game I so terribly hate.

Also, Melf, I dont think you used the Genesis screenshots. There's stuff there that I never saw in the Genesis version, like the place to enter codes like the psone verison.

[Mel]

I have won the argument.

In 1994 came Super Street Fighter II Turbo, which was originally released in the arcade & later on the 3DO (but wasn't released for either the SNES or Sega Genesis), featured enhanced speed & difficulty. It also featured a new character, Akuma, who had not only inherited all of Ryu and Ken's special moves, but could also produce a fireball in the air, and could perform a very powerful super move called the Shun Goku Satsu (literally means Instant Hell Murder a.k.a. The Raging Demon). It was also the first game in the series to have super combos. The game was released in the Street Fighter Collection sets for the Sega Saturn and PlayStation. It was released later for the Sega Dreamcast with an online matching service feature, but only in Japan. In 2001, a graphically simplified version of the game was released for the Game Boy Advance under the title Super Street Fighter II Turbo: Revival. Source: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Street_Fighter

Wasn't even available for home consoles I definately know that Super Street Fighter for snes and genesis only added new characters.

Released the same year as killer instinct, 1994.
In the Arcades.

Killer Instinct made it the SNES in '95.


This is the first arcade game to use a hard disk drive for mass storage. ... Killer Instinct was the first game to feature the 'auto-combos'.


http://www.arcade-history.com/history_database.php?page=detail&id=1280

However, I must agree, that Street Fighter was the best of all the Fighting franchises of the '90s. I don't really care for the Super SF2 characters, but the original (in particular Ryu) cast is the best. If they wouldn't have kept Ryu in the Future incarnations of SF, and the Capcom vs series, there is a very good chance I would have abandoned 2d gaming entirely. =)

[Drixxel]

Also, Melf, I dont think you used the Genesis screenshots. There's stuff there that I never saw in the Genesis version, like the place to enter codes like the psone verison.

That code enterin' versus screen is definately in Genesis MKIII. Start up a two player match and let it caress your retinas.

..as for this maddening combo scuffle.. yes, the existance of the combo dates at least as far back as the 1991 release of Street Fighter II, and as such the hardcore fighter crowd was very aware of combo magic via SFII well before the release of Killer Instinct in 1994. Still.. name association.. when Street Fighter II floats up in your consciousness, do you immediately think quarter circle forward + punch, or do you think of a long string of button taps? A huge part of Killer Instinct's game design was built around these preprogrammed endurance runs of buttonslapping, and while "the combo" had been around for easily three years previous, Killer Instinct really made it an unforgettable term for the mainstream gamer. Up until KI, I would imagine that the average fighting game player's understanding of a combo was probably closer to a two-in-one rather than a true multi-hit combo. And yes, X-Men: COTA was rather outrageous in the combo department, but Killer Instinct seemed to be 1994's primary fighter sensation.

Anyways.. yeah. Combos became a pretty big deal, however they were popularized.

MKIII: I like playing as Kabal!!!..

[j_factor]

I have never, ever heard of KI being referred to as popularizing the concept of combos. That's pretty left-field, IMO. Virtually every mention-worthy fighting game features combos, that's long been a staple of the genre.

And if any game "stepped up" combos, it's Samurai Shodown.

[16bitter]

Super Combos aren't the same as combos -- they're just super moves which charge up. Street Fighter II CREATED the combo system. This is a fact of arcade history. Everything that followed sprang from that game in the one on one fighting genre.

What Super added were new characters, slower speed (yay :P), an extra or updated move for the original characters and text that told the player how many hits they got on a given combo. This was 1993, six months before Super Turbo and about a year before KI.

KI's combos though were different from SFII's in that they were far more pre-programmed by button pressing. Obviously SF has the more subtle and nuanced gameplay as far as combos, IMO, as well as being the creator of the term and gameplay feature.

[Mel]

Super Combos aren't the same as combos -- they're just super moves which charge up. Street Fighter II CREATED the combo system. This is a fact of arcade history. Everything that followed sprang from that game in the one on one fighting genre.

What Super added were new characters, slower speed (yay :P), an extra or updated move for the original characters and text that told the player how many hits they got on a given combo. This was 1993, six months before Super Turbo and about a year before KI.

KI's combos though were different from SFII's in that they were far more pre-programmed by button pressing. Obviously SF has the more subtle and nuanced gameplay as far as combos, IMO, as well as being the creator of the term and gameplay feature.

Umm I just played the home conversion of super. it doesn't keep track of combo hits, thats what i've been trying to tell you.

[Mel]

When I was a kid, we called combo's "Being a cheap bastard". We didn't start calling them combo's until after '94 or '95. Origins, unknown.

[Mel]

I have never, ever heard of KI being referred to as popularizing the concept of combos. That's pretty left-field, IMO. Virtually every mention-worthy fighting game features combos, that's long been a staple of the genre.

And if any game "stepped up" combos, it's Samurai Shodown.

Got a date on that? Now I'm interested in making a timeline about this. We'll have Melf edit the game's name appropriately in the review.
I was never an arcade junky, we were more into home systems during that time period, so for us, the big combo thing didn't show up until '95 in KI. Hence why I tossed that in.

Like I mentioned before we didnt even call them combo's until KI.

I went back to playing SF Alpha II last night.... oh the fighting goodness...

[StRiDA CoL]

Yeah Mel I gues u r right before in like SF2 and other games they were called "hits" which sounds more cheeseir than combo 6..

WAIT A MINIUTE

I m an idiot they were always called hits :oops:

[16bitter]

Super Combos aren't the same as combos -- they're just super moves which charge up. Street Fighter II CREATED the combo system. This is a fact of arcade history. Everything that followed sprang from that game in the one on one fighting genre.

What Super added were new characters, slower speed (yay :P), an extra or updated move for the original characters and text that told the player how many hits they got on a given combo. This was 1993, six months before Super Turbo and about a year before KI.

KI's combos though were different from SFII's in that they were far more pre-programmed by button pressing. Obviously SF has the more subtle and nuanced gameplay as far as combos, IMO, as well as being the creator of the term and gameplay feature.

Umm I just played the home conversion of super. it doesn't keep track of combo hits, thats what i've been trying to tell you.

Um, I know for a fact it did. Both SNES and Genesis keep track of combos, as does their arcade big brother. If you didn't get that information onscreen, then it simply means you didn't pull off any combos.

[16bitter]

I have never, ever heard of KI being referred to as popularizing the concept of combos. That's pretty left-field, IMO. Virtually every mention-worthy fighting game features combos, that's long been a staple of the genre.

And if any game "stepped up" combos, it's Samurai Shodown.

Got a date on that? Now I'm interested in making a timeline about this. We'll have Melf edit the game's name appropriately in the review.
I was never an arcade junky, we were more into home systems during that time period, so for us, the big combo thing didn't show up until '95 in KI. Hence why I tossed that in.

Like I mentioned before we didnt even call them combo's until KI

You might not have, but everybody I knew did. And Super calls them combos in its onscreen tracker. And SSFII hit in 93.

[Mel]

we need screenshots.

[Mel]

Super Combos aren't the same as combos -- they're just super moves which charge up. Street Fighter II CREATED the combo system. This is a fact of arcade history. Everything that followed sprang from that game in the one on one fighting genre.

What Super added were new characters, slower speed (yay :P), an extra or updated move for the original characters and text that told the player how many hits they got on a given combo. This was 1993, six months before Super Turbo and about a year before KI.

KI's combos though were different from SFII's in that they were far more pre-programmed by button pressing. Obviously SF has the more subtle and nuanced gameplay as far as combos, IMO, as well as being the creator of the term and gameplay feature.

Umm I just played the home conversion of super. it doesn't keep track of combo hits, thats what i've been trying to tell you.

Um, I know for a fact it did. Both SNES and Genesis keep track of combos, as does their arcade big brother. If you didn't get that information onscreen, then it simply means you didn't pull off any combos.

I played it yesterday, I didnt see it in SSF2(Genesis). I dont have an snes so i wouldn't be able to vouch for that.
I've been playing street fighter 2 for years, I can at least get a 3 hit combo. I did so on Alpha 2 plenty of times yesterday.

The computer didn't get any combo's either, which is odd at higher difficulties.

Screenshots, screenshots, screenshots. From my research, street fighter didnt have it until SSF2 turbo.

[16bitter]

we need screenshots.

I looked. Couldn't find any easily, other than a shot that had the "first attack" text.

I just played the Genesis version though -- and got the combo message. The game doesn't give you a read-out of the computer's combos, only the human players.

[Mel]

we need screenshots.

I looked. Couldn't find any easily, other than a shot that had the "first attack" text.

I just played the Genesis version though -- and got the combo message. The game doesn't give you a read-out of the computer's combos, only the human players.

Hmm.. Ok, did some history checking. Actual combo's were in the original SF. But Im curious to see who called them combo's, counted them and gave extra points for them first. I suspect it was SSFII

I'll rewrite that sentence later, but Im very interested in having an accurate history of it.

--

In other news, anyone know if the psone version of alpha 2 any good?

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Is the saturn version of MK trilogy any good?

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Anyone know Scorpion's fatality in UMK3 Genesis?

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Was killer instinct an snes exclusive?

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[Drixxel]

So are we denying Killer Instinct any credit for helping to draw attention to combos? There were and are plenty of people out there whose SFII strategies are no more complex than buttonmashing it up with Blanka. These people make up a good part of the gamer majority. Just because the elite members of the fighter's guild have known about combos since the fateful 1991 release of Street Fighter II, that does not make the concept of "the combo" a popular one. Popularized among the hardcore gamers does not equate to popularized among the mainstream. In Killer Instinct, combos are flashy and an incredibly intentional aspect of the game. This is not necessarily so with SFII, and as such, not necessarily visible to the average gamer. Watch KI in attract mode for even 30 seconds and you'll see one or both of the computer fighters pull off a fancy combo.

[Drixxel]

In other news, anyone know if the psone version of alpha 2 any good?


I dig it. I've always heard that the Saturn version is superior, but having only played and owned the PlayStation port and very much enjoyed it, I give'r my recommendation.


Anyone know Scorpion's fatality in UMK3 Genesis?


A move list from some random FAQ lists these two.

(from jump distance): D, D, U+HK
(when close): F, F, D, U+Run


Was killer instinct an snes exclusive?


There was also a Gameboy release, but ehh.. that one doesn't count. As I understand it, Killer Instinct didn't hit consoles again until the late 1996 release of Killer Instinct Gold for the ol' N64.

[Mel]

So are we denying Killer Instinct any credit for helping to draw attention to combos? There were and are plenty of people out there whose SFII strategies are no more complex than buttonmashing it up with Blanka. These people make up a good part of the gamer majority. Just because the elite members of the fighter's guild have known about combos since the fateful 1991 release of Street Fighter II, that does not make the concept of "the combo" a popular one. Popularized among the hardcore gamers does not equate to popularized among the mainstream. In Killer Instinct, combos are flashy and an incredibly intentional aspect of the game. This is not necessarily so with SFII, and as such, not necessarily visible to the average gamer. Watch KI in attract mode for even 30 seconds and you'll see one or both of the computer fighters pull off a fancy combo.

Yeah, KI made the whole combo thing into meat and potatoes. SF2, it was just another feature like fireballs. That was the essence of my argument.

However, now the quest is to find the origins of these combos.

[16bitter]

we need screenshots.

I looked. Couldn't find any easily, other than a shot that had the "first attack" text.

I just played the Genesis version though -- and got the combo message. The game doesn't give you a read-out of the computer's combos, only the human players.

Hmm.. Ok, did some history checking. Actual combo's were in the original SF.

I've hardly played SF, but I've always heard of and remember combos making their appearance in SFII.



--

In other news, anyone know if the psone version of alpha 2 any good?

---

I have Alpha 2 Gold, and I assume it's not much better animation-wise than the original Alpha 2 on PS. The Saturn version is a big improvement as far as animation, and one can tell within the PS game itself how much has been cut by the contrast of mirror matches versus any multi-character match. Even then I assume much is cut, but it is a contrast -- I've mostly played the arcade version of Alpha 2, though so my estimation of the home versions isn't that detailed as far as differences and strengths.


---

Anyone know Scorpion's fatality in UMK3 Genesis?

http://www.angelfire.com/va3/mk/

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Was killer instinct an snes exclusive?

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Yes. KI Gold (I think that was the title), which was a modified build of KI2, was translated to N64 in 96.

[16bitter]

So are we denying Killer Instinct any credit for helping to draw attention to combos? There were and are plenty of people out there whose SFII strategies are no more complex than buttonmashing it up with Blanka. These people make up a good part of the gamer majority. Just because the elite members of the fighter's guild have known about combos since the fateful 1991 release of Street Fighter II, that does not make the concept of "the combo" a popular one. Popularized among the hardcore gamers does not equate to popularized among the mainstream. In Killer Instinct, combos are flashy and an incredibly intentional aspect of the game. This is not necessarily so with SFII, and as such, not necessarily visible to the average gamer. Watch KI in attract mode for even 30 seconds and you'll see one or both of the computer fighters pull off a fancy combo.

Yeah, KI made the whole combo thing into meat and potatoes. SF2, it was just another feature like fireballs. That was the essence of my argument.

I don't know if I buy that semantically. I think KI was flashier, but that SFII has far deeper gameplay as far as its combos and their effects.

However, now the quest is to find the origins of these combos.

As I've said, I always remember SFII as being the originator. But there should be a site somewhere to go more extensively into the history of combos in one on one fighting games. What I do know is that combos have been hugely popular since SFII, going back to the days of obsessive dronings on usenet and within EGM on the subject.

[16bitter]

So are we denying Killer Instinct any credit for helping to draw attention to combos? There were and are plenty of people out there whose SFII strategies are no more complex than buttonmashing it up with Blanka. These people make up a good part of the gamer majority.

So is the argument that KI somehow deepened fighting game gameplay?

As far as popularity, I do know that SFII truly popularized the combo by making it standard in fighting games as well as being a far bigger series from day one -- arguably the biggest and most influential in the genre ever -- than KI ever was. I think this leads back to the combo issue.

The very word started being used due to SFII's gameplay.

Just because the elite members of the fighter's guild have known about combos since the fateful 1991 release of Street Fighter II, that does not make the concept of "the combo" a popular one.

The concept has to be popular by the virtue of it being the core of the most influential and popular fighting series created. Now whether people called them combos or not makes little difference as to who is responsible for creating the standard and popularizing the base idea of combos -- and that's Street Fighter II.

Popularized among the hardcore gamers does not equate to popularized among the mainstream.

Almost everybody was playing SFII back in the day. I don't recall anywhere near the attention being given KI, though it was very popular in its own right.

Frankly, you guys surprise me on this one, as I remember clearly that all who were into the gaming scene (I wouldn't classify that broad generalization as hardcore) -- to decent enough extent to, you know, be aware of it and maybe pick up an issue of EGM between matches in the arcade -- were aware of combos as THE aspect to fighting game gameplay, which SFII popularized back in 91.

In Killer Instinct, combos are flashy and an incredibly intentional aspect of the game.

Combos are very much intentional within SFII, though more subtle. KI changed the combo system by making it less about timing and more about pre-set button commands that led to over the top hit counts.

I think in many ways that KI took the concept over the top and dumbed down the gameplay in the process. As most fighting junkies would argue in regards to Capcom's Versus series as well.

[j_factor]

I have never, ever heard of KI being referred to as popularizing the concept of combos. That's pretty left-field, IMO. Virtually every mention-worthy fighting game features combos, that's long been a staple of the genre.

And if any game "stepped up" combos, it's Samurai Shodown.

Got a date on that? Now I'm interested in making a timeline about this. We'll have Melf edit the game's name appropriately in the review.

1993. Samurai Shodown introduced the Rage/POW meter, which charges up with hits, and charges more with combos. So combos are actually a part of the gameplay strategy, beyond simply "doing more damage". It was the first game to really "do anything" with combos.


I was never an arcade junky, we were more into home systems during that time period, so for us, the big combo thing didn't show up until '95 in KI. Hence why I tossed that in.

Like I mentioned before we didnt even call them combo's until KI.

Samurai Shodown was on several home systems.

I never remember KI having much of an impact on anything, but then, I was more of an arcade gamer, and KI didn't have much of an arcade presence. I do remember when the home version came out, and regarded it as a passable fighter whose selling point was its visual effect.

[Drixxel]

So is the argument that KI somehow deepened fighting game gameplay?


Not at all. I was trying to explain the possibility that KI broadened the general public's understanding of combos, not that it enriched the one-on-one fighting experience. If you didn't know what a combo was before watching someone play KI, you did after. We're talking Joe Average Gamer here, the casual gamer, who makes up much of the gaming populace. Street Fighter II was a phenomenon, yes, and practically everyone had played it, yes, but combos are a deeper aspect to the gameplay that the average lad would be blissfully ignorant of.


Frankly, you guys surprise me on this one, as I remember clearly that all who were into the gaming scene (I wouldn't classify that broad generalization as hardcore) -- to decent enough extent to, you know, be aware of it and maybe pick up an issue of EGM between matches in the arcade -- were aware of combos as THE aspect to fighting game gameplay, which SFII popularized back in 91.

I personally have known about "combos" since the SNES release of Street Fighter II Turbo and the subsequent buying of a thick strategy guide describing in detail the SFII combo black magic. But nearly all of my friends at the time who played games knew little more about Street Fighter II than the quarter-circle forward motion for fancy projectiles. To visit the arcade was to watch as a handful of SFII pros kick the asses of each and every other weakling who didn't know half of what the SFII god to their left was even doing.


I think in many ways that KI took the concept over the top and dumbed down the gameplay in the process. As most fighting junkies would argue in regards to Capcom's Versus series as well.

Well at least we agree there. The Versus series is lowbrow flash.

But really, popularizing a concept is not nearly as important as creating it, so SFII will always be the better game because it pioneered so much. The point of my argument is not to give Killer Instinct any credit for making the fighting genre a better place or that combos were a relative unknown until Killer Instinct. My point is this: Killer Instinct's fancy, attention-getting combos helped to educate the gaming ignorant to the ways of the combo. That is all.

[Dartagnan1083]

I remember Combo discussion in an old gamepro magazine from 1993. Mostly between MK1 and Street Fighter 2 Turbo.
So they were in fact called combos before KI was ever released.

The combo's in KI and MKIII are mostly there for flash.
entering a combo breaker kills it.
Combos in other fighting games are there for strategic and/or improvosational purposes. . .and in games like Virtua Fighter or Soul Calibur, you break it with a properly timed Tech-Roll or Parry. . .rather than hitting D-D-<C at your leisure.

[16bitter]

So is the argument that KI somehow deepened fighting game gameplay?


Not at all. I was trying to explain the possibility that KI broadened the general public's understanding of combos, not that it enriched the one-on-one fighting experience. If you didn't know what a combo was before watching someone play KI, you did after. We're talking Joe Average Gamer here, the casual gamer, who makes up much of the gaming populace. Street Fighter II was a phenomenon, yes, and practically everyone had played it, yes, but combos are a deeper aspect to the gameplay that the average lad would be blissfully ignorant of.

My argument is that, yes, KI's combos were more in your face and obvious due to that certainly, yet SFII's overall popularity was such that by the time KI came around combos were well-known and popular anyway. I simply don't buy that KI popularized what SFII created -- not when SFII was so much more popular than KI ever was. By sheer fanbase ratio alone, the issue should go to SFII -- even if the number of its players weren't as aware percentage-wise as KI's -- because it's popularity was of such a hugh-degree that the number of better-versed players in its following could very well have matched the number of semi-casual players on KI by 1994, thus making the point of KI's more overt combo system rather moot as the terminology was already a part of the arcade and overall video game culture by the time of its release.

I saw flash in KI, but felt no sense of revolution from it -- either as an individual or within the pre-teen/teenaged/war-vet burnout culture of the arcade scene. As far as broad popular culture, I don't think KI was really on the radar.


Well at least we agree there. The Versus series is lowbrow flash.

But really, popularizing a concept is not nearly as important as creating it, so SFII will always be the better game because it pioneered so much. The point of my argument is not to give Killer Instinct any credit for making the fighting genre a better place or that combos were a relative unknown until Killer Instinct. My point is this: Killer Instinct's fancy, attention-getting combos helped to educate the gaming ignorant to the ways of the combo. That is all.

Yet I still have my doubts as to the length of its reach on the subject as opposed to the game that originated the usage and terminilogy of the combo to begin with. SFII was so much bigger than KI -- one was a nuke and the other was a blip on the radar, quickly forogotten by comparison. Considering that, I don't know if KI can be considered the game that finally let the combo loose on the overall gaming populace -- I think that had already happened.

[16bitter]

I remember Combo discussion in an old gamepro magazine from 1993. Mostly between MK1 and Street Fighter 2 Turbo.
So they were in fact called combos before KI was ever released.

The combo's in KI and MKIII are mostly there for flash.
entering a combo breaker kills it.
Combos in other fighting games are there for strategic and/or improvosational purposes. . .and in games like Virtua Fighter or Soul Calibur, you break it with a properly timed Tech-Roll or Parry. . .rather than hitting D-D-<C at your leisure.

In many ways, KI bastardized the combo -- the player would basically enter a code and then watch an intermission sequence for his trouble.

[Mel]

Hmm, so we need to change that to Street Fighter II.

[Fang]

MK3 sure brings back memories it was the last genesis I bought when they were first came out. I thought it sure did have the arcade feel to it.

[janus]

Wow, and I thought only Gate of Thunder had the arcade feel!

http://web.archive.org/web/20040319182846/sardius.fefea.org/reviews/jturbo/jturbo1-2.htm

[Drixxel]

Ohhhhhmy. Johnny Turbo. What a dapper dog.

I was just reading over Mel's MKIII review again, and I thought of a simple enough way to reword that one troublesome sentence without removing the KI reference.

"The combo system worked similarly to the one featured in Killer Instinct, which popularized the concept of pre-programmed combos, or moves resulting from a correctly entered string of button presses, that would create devastating and flashy attacks."

This argument has been a good one, and I'm willing to accept that Street Fighter II single-handedly created and popularized the combo. Still, since the combos of MKIII more closely resemble those of KI rather than SFII, it seems sensible to compare MKIII to KI if the combos of SFII are indeed commonly understood by the masses. Anyways.. yeah.

[16bitter]

I was going to say much the same thing.

I must say I had far more fun with MK3 than I ever did KI, though. Am I the only one that couldn't really get into that game? MK3 dominated a summer, KI never really made an impact with me.

I had a bit of fun with it on rental. That's it.

And I'm not saying I was unaware of it at all, just that I never really became a fan. First X-Men ad then MK's latest dominated my playing time in the arcade/bowling alley back then.

[Drixxel]

I never really played KI much in the arcades, maybe a couple times here or there, but I spent a fair bit of time with the SNES port and I recall enjoying it quite a bit. I eagerly looked forward to Mortal Kombat III, but after the first wave of amazement from seeing the game in action at the arcade, it dawned on me that what I was playing was not the same calibur of game Mortal Kombat II was. In the grand scheme of things I've played considerably more MKIII than KI, though, mostly through Mortal Kombat Trilogy for PlayStation which I must admit is pretty awesome. So many characters...!

There's a copy of KI Gold for sale at a nearby rental store. I was thinking of buying it two weekends ago, but ended up picking Mischief Makers instead. Killer Instinct perhaps deserves another go..

[Mel]

I was going to say much the same thing.

I must say I had far more fun with MK3 than I ever did KI, though. Am I the only one that couldn't really get into that game? MK3 dominated a summer, KI never really made an impact with me.

I had a bit of fun with it on rental. That's it.

And I'm not saying I was unaware of it at all, just that I never really became a fan. First X-Men ad then MK's latest dominated my playing time in the arcade/bowling alley back then.

I had fun w/ MK3, but I found KI to be intollerable.

[16bitter]

What was so bad about it?

[16bitter]

I never really played KI much in the arcades, maybe a couple times here or there, but I spent a fair bit of time with the SNES port and I recall enjoying it quite a bit. I eagerly looked forward to Mortal Kombat III, but after the first wave of amazement from seeing the game in action at the arcade, it dawned on me that what I was playing was not the same calibur of game Mortal Kombat II was. In the grand scheme of things I've played considerably more MKIII than KI, though, mostly through Mortal Kombat Trilogy for PlayStation which I must admit is pretty awesome. So many characters...!

I played MK Trilogy last night. The loading drives me nuts, and it almost always has. I also felt parts of it were lazy -- lack of boss fatalities, no longer being able to knock opponents off The Pit II, etc. Pathetically, it sonded about seven times better than MK3 on XBox.

Another thing about Trilogy and UMK3 that always turned me off was the abundance of palette swap ninjas posing as individual characters -- it went overboard with UMK3 and I feel much the same way about Trilogy on that front. Also, Brutalities absolutely suck. How lame.

In the end, I think I still prefer MK3 over either UMK3 or Trilogy. It's the one I've spent the most time with -- when UMK3 hit I hardly noticed, and was totally unimpressed with its repetition of two character types and the lacking backgrounds it brought with it. Trilogy mainly fails for me on loading times.

How many secrets are in Trilogy? That's what made MKII and 3 so great.

There's a copy of KI Gold for sale at a nearby rental store. I was thinking of buying it two weekends ago, but ended up picking Mischief Makers instead. Killer Instinct perhaps deserves another go..

KI Gold is okay. It was something to rent back when the N64 was new. Certainly a better game than the lousy Cruis'n port I bought.

[j_factor]

Trilogy mainly fails for me on loading times.

How about that N64 version?

[16bitter]

I only played it on a Toys 'R Us kiosk back in the day. Fewer characters, less animation, crappy sound by comparison -- about all it had were boss fatalites (but only one each, and it only had two bosses instead of the PS's four) and, of course, lack of loading. I also remember it looking cleaner, but it could have just been the setup in-store.

Overall though, I think the PS version probably owns it -- except for the load times, which truly drop it way down for me.

Back in early 97 the PS version was the way better deal anyway. I got it for $30 a month after it came out, whereas the N64 game stayed at $60 for months. I probably could get it for a few bucks loose, but is there any reason?

You'd probably know better than me.

[j_factor]

Actually I wouldn't really know. N64 ports are one area where I lack any expertise, and Mortal Kombat Trilogy is one game I spent little time with.