NES Sonic

[evildragon]

I think I'm gonna take up a challenge.. I'm probably known on the internet by now, for being the first person to successfully attach a DVD-ROM drive to an NES, and make movie playback possible on the NES too.. (overlay circuitry, using the "hot" color)... I know how to program the NES's 6502 clone, and want a challenge..

To port Sonic 2 to the NES, fully functional, with most of the sprites intact, AND the music... (well, the music and colors will be killed drasticly, but atleast as close as possible.)

I'll first work on the rendering engine, and the music engine, THEN make the game logic.. I'll post the results here in this thread.. The basics should be done quick, as I made my own special compiler that I used for my DVD-ROM drive attachment (which can be used to load game data, as long as it's programmed for it, sorta like the Sega CD)...

So, which levels should I try to keep intact the most? From sonic 2, for the NES? I can't make ALL levels perfectly intact, as though I can use a DVD-ROM disc for storage, I never got the NES to address more than a cartridge without a mapper can hold...

[Zebbe]

Chemical Plant Zone. It is kind of famous for letting you reach speeds so high Sonic goes out of the screen.

[Genesis Knight]

I've never heard of you. =D Got a website I can visit?

[evildragon]

no website.. i just post my stuff on forums.. i might still have screenshots of the NES DVD-Player somewhere... (i tend to lose them)

[Mr Smith]

The Mystic Cave and Oil Ocean zones are musts. They are both awesome.

[Alianger]

How about making 2 games eac with half the zones as intact as possible, for maximum quality? :)

[evildragon]

How about making 2 games eac with half the zones as intact as possible, for maximum quality? :)
i was thinking about that, but then that means i have to edit the levels layout, which would just kill the authenticity..

i'm gonna try a bank switching method on the DVD-ROM drive, and see if the NES likes it...

[108 Stars]

@Genesis Knight
Actually, evildragon really is pretty well known.

@evildragon
You think you can do better than the Sonic 1-pirate on NES?

[evildragon]

i know i can do better :P i want to try and port the real Genesis code to the NES as much as possible.. luckily i know M68k assembly, AND 6502 assembly, so i should be able to pull this off...

If i can't, i'll port the Master System Sonic to the NES, which is actually far more easier (and close screen resolution too)

[evildragon]

ok, here's how the music is to be played out... The NES, with all the fast moving sprites, can only handle ONE sound channel for music.. I chose the square channel for this, for it's harmonic sound, vs the triangle bassy sound...

well that totally blows..

it's turning into: NintenCan't...

[Mr Smith]

Why not have just one zone from each level to save on space and time?

[evildragon]

here's some first time screenshots:
http://blackevilweredragon.spymac.com/sonicNES1.jpg
http://blackevilweredragon.spymac.com/sonicNES2.jpg

(taken via RF, and with a Temporal Comb Filter)

As seen, I am only using 224 lines, where the NES can do 240 lines.. I did this because it allows easier porting...

Average Frame Rate for Emerald Hill Zone without music: 56

[evildragon]

Why not have just one zone from each level to save on space and time?
one word: authenticity.. it's also a challenge.. im trying some new band switching tech on my optical drive, and so far it "seems" to work..

[Zebbe]

Wow, it looks impressive!

[evildragon]

yea, it does.. i had to make some of the layers a single layer though.. for example, the tree going behind the grass.. normally on a genesis that's a layer.. on the NES port it had to be pre-rendered into a single image, as the NES can't handle that many sprites with layers..

[Vyse of Arcadia]

...I feel as though I should be worshipping you.

Any particular animal you prefer in your sacrifices, or can I just go with chickens?

[Joe Redifer]

Sacrifice a hedgehog.

[evildragon]

i already sacrificed a two-tailed fox ;)

[Vyse of Arcadia]

Buh-da-bum tish!

So how far along is this project? Can you give us a rough estimate, percentage-wise?

[evildragon]

it's been started since atleast a month ago.. percentage wise, it's about 30% complete..

it won't, and "can't" be published to the public, as it's designed for my NES DVD-ROM drive, and it uses special API's..

I can "try" and do this on a normal cartridge, but it is using some of the drives RAM as extra memory..

[Joe Redifer]

Put up a short Youtube video of it, I'd love to see it running, even if only for a few seconds and even if it has glitches.

[evildragon]

i don't use youtube, but i'd be glad to compress it in H.264 and put it on my webserver and link it here..

it won't have sound though, as i haven't finished coding the audio engine yet..

i am almost finished with the gameplay engine, so it should be soon..

[evildragon]

UPDATE: I added the physics engine on the NES port, and the framrate was totally raped.. The average frame rate with propper physics is 15fps (I think)...

I also changed the color palette.. I will have a video soon... I found my composite cables, so i'll be able to record via composite...

EDIT: Oh yea, the new engine also includes Tails to follow Sonic.. Come to think of it, THIS may be the frame rate penalty..

[Joe Redifer]

Awesome. Looking forward to the video.

[evildragon]

here's the NES.. i can't find out why capture cards hate 240p, but luckily i was able to capture at 240p, minus the artifacts... the color really does look this crappy on the NES.. the pallette is small..

http://blackevilweredragon.spymac.com/SonicNES.mov

(encoded via H.264)

[108 Stars]

Great, but where do I find the codec I need?:?

[evildragon]

QuickTime...

(I think VLC has it too. I chose H.264 to use less web server space, and smaller bandwidth)

[108 Stars]

Great work, evildragon!
Now if you could somehow manage to get a better framerate it´ll be awesome!
I would never think this is a NES game!

[evildragon]

I'm trying to figure out what is causing the slow down... possible causes include:

Diagonal Scrolling Driver (as NES can't diagonal scroll without software support)
Tails/Miles
Remnants of 68K (or even Z80) coding.. (as this is a direct code-port of the Genesis version)
Physics Engine

Somethings causing it, and it seems the NES gets stuck in a loop trying to complete a code it either doesn't know, or can't execute fast enough..

[Joe Redifer]

That's cool. It's running at 10 fps in the video. I'm amazed that it can have so many sprites on a horizontal line.

[evildragon]

ahh, so it's 10.. i had no way to benchmark it... (i think the game clock is off, too)

the NES can really push itself.. Though, it you want to exceed the limits, you have to program around the limitation, and make programming that "emulates" more sprites, by not even using sprites in some parts...

[Genesis Knight]

Very nice - but for the framerate, it looks better than 99% of the official NES library.

[Melf]

That's pretty awesome, and it looks great for a NES game. I'd love to see the full version someday.

[Vyse of Arcadia]

In. Cred. I. Ble.

Absolutely amazing work, evildragon. Encore!

[evildragon]

glad you guys like it...

while over the weekend, i'll see if i can get some Chemical Plant vid's, and another level..

The other level, I'll let you guys decide... Be it graphically advanced, or just a speedy level.. I can only get about 25 second clips though... I really am trying to save space on my web server, cause im hitting bandwidth soon..

[evildragon]

here's another shot... More won't come until after the weekend.. I'm going to my mothers house, and I'm not taking any of my stuff with me..

http://blackevilweredragon.spymac.com/SonicNESLoading.jpg

[Joe Redifer]

Do a bonus level! Better yet do a bonus level from Sonic 3D Blast! Do Halo 2!

[evildragon]

oh, before I go, I got some sound effects clips...

http://blackevilweredragon.spymac.com/LevelEndSpinner.mp3
http://blackevilweredragon.spymac.com/Die.mp3
http://blackevilweredragon.spymac.com/Spring.mp3
http://blackevilweredragon.spymac.com/Ring.mp3

[evildragon]

Do a bonus level! Better yet do a bonus level from Sonic 3D Blast! Do Halo 2!
i'm already working on porting the Sonic 2 Special Stage.. That one, while the same pixels in width, is NOT easy to pull off on the NES, but I may have found a routine that actually works..

EDIT: Here, just for you, this is what I got working so far: http://blackevilweredragon.spymac.com/SonicNESSpecial.jpg

[evildragon]

Since this is getting some interest, I'm taking some more screenshots, and might have a video of Chemical Plant, during a speed run, some time today..

http://blackevilweredragon.spymac.com/Aquatic.jpg
http://blackevilweredragon.spymac.com/CasinoNight.jpg
http://blackevilweredragon.spymac.com/Metrop.jpg
http://blackevilweredragon.spymac.com/Mystic.jpg
http://blackevilweredragon.spymac.com/OilOcean.jpg

As you might have notice, i'm having a palette problem.. Sonic's "blue" color changes slightly, and white sometimes turns blueish, and the Score/Time/Rings yellow counter sometimes turns a different shade of yellow, to match the game palette..

I'm not really hitting over 8 colors really.. I'm having a hard time programming palette separation (as I am doing some tricks to get some sprites over 4 colors)...

EDIT: Here's the video...

http://blackevilweredragon.spymac.com/SpeedRun.mov

(This one is MPEG-4)

[Alianger]

omg! and it's really fast too.. well done!

[evildragon]

Thanks!

Here's two more sound clip, and I'm done for a couple days...

WARNING! TURN DOWN SPEAKERS FIRST! I forgot to fix the volume on the soundcard when recording this, and it's quite loud..

http://blackevilweredragon.spymac.com/SonicNESEmerald.mp3

It's buggy, but im sure you all know that tune.. ;)

http://blackevilweredragon.spymac.com/SonicNES.mp3

[tokumaru]

Hi evildragon,

I've never heard of you before, but I've been a NES programmer for a good time now, and your project really caught my attention. In fact, I'm coding a Sonic game for the NES myself.

I'm coding my game from the ground, trying to mimic most features of the Sonic games, in a way that is easier for the NES to work with. I know something about the engine used in the Genesis/Mega Drive games, and I'm very curious as to how you managed to port certain features.

So, if you don't mind, I have some questions:

1. The original 16-bit game has it's levels compressed in ROM, and these are decompressed to the 64KB of RAM the system has. How are you handling these levels on the NES, that only has 2KB of RAM? Are you using a cart with extra RAM? Which one? If you changed the format of the levels, what changes have you made?

2. How are you handling the water in Chemical plant? Does the mapper you use have IRQ's, that you set to fire at the level of the water? How do you make everything past that point purple?

3. What mapper are you using? I ask so that I can have an idea of the features you have avaliable.

4. What is the region of the NES you are using? Is it a NTSC NES, PAL NES, japanese Famicom, or evena famiclone? I'm curious, because the colors in your videos are pretty unique.

5. How did you manage to have som many sprites on screen? Since the NES only allows for 8 8-pixel wide sprites per scanline, the only way to have more than that is to alternate which ones you display each frame (through a process called sprite cycling), which results in them flickering. However, I can see no flickering in your videos, and I often see more than the allowed ammount of sprites (specially at the top, where the HUD is, as other sprites go up there). Did you achive that by updating the OAM memory mid-scanline, or something like that?

6. What code is it that you ported to the NES? Do you have a copy of the source code of the original game? Did you disassemble the game yourself? Can you point me to the code your port is based from?

7. When you ported it to the NES, did you also include some sort of frame-skipping system? I mean, the videos run at normal speed, but with some frames missing. A direct port to a lower end system should result in the game playing slower, but still processing all frames. Your engine seems to be emulating some of the things the NES can't handle, so maybe that's why you have a feature so common in emulators (frame-skipping).

I think this is all. This game seems very special, as it works around so many limitations of the NES hardware. I'd like to learn more about it.

If you have any questions about my project, I'd be glad to answer them.

Thanks for your attention.

[Bregalad]

Hey, your project look somewhat cool !
How did you convert the graphics from the Genensis to the NES ? The NES have much less colours, so I guess you had to manually convert all tiles of the game in a tile editor to look authentic on the NES. This should have been some tedious work, but the result looks pretty good, tough.

Also, the background looks NESish, but the sprites really looks authentic, I ask me how you made them. I suppose you used multi-layered sprites to get so many colors at once (only 3 are available per sprite normally), so that'd be a lot of sprites on the screen. Be cautionnous, because your sprites may not disappear on a emulator, but will on a real Nintendo, because you can only have 8 of them per line. So that may (and probably will) cause problems if your projects runs on a real Nintendo console (or an emulator parametred to behave with sprite-limitation enabled).

[evildragon]

I'll try to answer the questions as best as possible.

There is a memory upgrade done to this machine.. I am using a DVD-ROM drive I build for the NES (that uses the bottom expansion port), which uses a BIOS "cartridge".. The drive has 2MB of RAM, 768K of it exclusive only to the drive, the rest to the NES, and the drive.. The drive runs on an NEC V30..

For sprite limitations, I made a routine that emulates directly drawing pixel by pixel (essentially emulating a frame buffer).. This also got me around the sprite 4-color limitation..

The mapper I am using is the NEC V30 CPU on the drive, it is emulating the function of a frame buffer (by the BIOS on the drive itself...) it's address lines were essentially divided between the drive itself, and the NES... (it also routes the memory calls)

the frame buffer technique is doing frameskipping, yes.. I was wondering when someone would notice it's skipping isn't smooth, and it's really bogging (like my car, lol)..

The region is NTSC-America (if there's a difference between the Japanese NTSC system)..

The watter effect was done via the same way it was done on the Genesis, as that was a direct port from the Genesis code.. It's a mid-screen palette switch... The NES isn't known for doing this well, or at all.. The NEC V30 on the drive aids this for the NES, by directly accessing the NES CRAM and modifying the values itself (also by monitoring where on the level you are..) You can notice an effect of the V30 playing "catch up" in 2 frames.. Right when sonic goes down low enough, notice TWO frames are exactly the same, except on one frame, the watter is too low, not even in place, where the other frame the water "caught up"...

Come to think of it, the bogging might be the frame buffer emulation, and the DVD drive attachment doing nothing but "peeking" at memory (which does take a cycle from the NES's 6502 clone)..

[Elusive]

it's been started since atleast a month ago.. percentage wise, it's about 30% complete..

it won't, and "can't" be published to the public, as it's designed for my NES DVD-ROM drive, and it uses special API's..

I can "try" and do this on a normal cartridge, but it is using some of the drives RAM as extra memory..

So this isn't a ROM you're working on, you're porting a game with the extra help of your own hardware? That's cheating :p

edit: ooh ooh ooh put 4 32Xs together and port a Dreamcast game to the system!

[evildragon]

Hey, your project look somewhat cool !
How did you convert the graphics from the Genensis to the NES ? The NES have much less colours, so I guess you had to manually convert all tiles of the game in a tile editor to look authentic on the NES. This should have been some tedious work, but the result looks pretty good, tough.

Also, the background looks NESish, but the sprites really looks authentic, I ask me how you made them. I suppose you used multi-layered sprites to get so many colors at once (only 3 are available per sprite normally), so that'd be a lot of sprites on the screen. Be cautionnous, because your sprites may not disappear on a emulator, but will on a real Nintendo, because you can only have 8 of them per line. So that may (and probably will) cause problems if your projects runs on a real Nintendo console (or an emulator parametred to behave with sprite-limitation enabled).
the sprite limitation is answered from the other post (in which was being typed when you were typing yours, lol ;) )

As for the tiles, I had to take all the tiles from the Genesis version, and modify each and everyone manually to fit in... Some of them, like Sonic and Tails, retain their original sprites.. The NEC V30 in the "DVD drive", will pre-render them to their propper format when a level is loading.. This allows my little routine I call "Dynamic Color Palette" to work.. You may notice that Sonic's blue color changes hue a little between different levels.. This is because of that... (sonic also sometimes gets a reflecting dot on his head, and sometimes he don't, depends on the level.. this is the V30 CPU pre-rendering sonic for the specific level)

I used Photoshop's color Indexing to break down the colors for me, and from there I coded them into the disc, to be read as a normal NES tile (for the most part)..

Sad to say, it's not a stock NES.. So yea, it's a hacked NES, but it's even cooler now.. XD

[evildragon]

So this isn't a ROM you're working on, you're porting a game with the extra help of your own hardware? That's cheating :p

edit: ooh ooh ooh put 4 32Xs together and port a Dreamcast game to the system!
I believe I did say this from the begining :p to prevent confusion..

The NES itself is playing the game logic though.. the "drive" is merely pre-rendering palettes, and some tiles, and is being used as extra RAM... But the NES non-the-less is running the game logic.. actually, i have no idea how to make the game logic run outside the NES...

[Elusive]

I believe I did say this from the begining :p to prevent confusion..

The NES itself is playing the game logic though.. the "drive" is merely pre-rendering palettes, and some tiles, and is being used as extra RAM... But the NES non-the-less is running the game logic.. actually, i have no idea how to make the game logic run outside the NES...

Ah, so the drive is holding the guts of the game, but the NES is doing all the work. Gotcha, I'm impressed nonetheless :)

[evildragon]

oh, there seems to be something i missed for someone..

i had gotten the sonic 2 source code somewhere.. I believe it was a Genesis programming site, and it gave source codes as examples (to modify and mess with).. I used that source code to port it to the NES...

Omitted from the code is the Genesis VDP and Z80 sound routines.. I couldn't do those, so I had to re-write those from scratch, but coded to make the NES emulate it as close as possible..

[evildragon]

Ah, so the drive is holding the guts of the game, but the NES is doing all the work. Gotcha, I'm impressed nonetheless :)
yep, exactly..

I had made this DVD drive some time ago, and for some reason, stopped writing for it.. i only ever used it as my DVD player, but never got into writing games for it.. I made it a simple BIOS API, and that's what SonicNES is running on, to get into the NES's memory and CPU, to run game logic...

[Bregalad]

In fact you're just disabling the video from the NES at all, and you use the video pin on the bottom connector as an input, right ? If so that does make sense, now, because I really asked myself how this could be the NES.
Using the NES graphic processor allows you, in the best case, to have the same set of 3 colors for 8 sequential horizontal pixels (but to do that you'd have to play a lot interpreting video fetches, and substitute data on reads). I'm not too sure with that, but I'm pretty sure this only allow to extend BG and not sprites, so you'd not get that amazing sprites by mapping them on the BG, not even with the most advanced tricks on video fetches.

[hap]

Yeah, Sonic 2 was disassembled, quite impressive actually. Anyway, how are you handling the internal CPU differences (M68K vs 6502). One's sub-32 bit, the other's 8 bit. The increase in addressing space is significant too.

[evildragon]

well, technically, the NES PPU is being used.. The drive doesn't have an actually graphics chip.. All it has is an ESS VideoDrive, and that's for MPEG-2... matter of fact, I didn't even know there was a video in connector on the expansion port, i'll need to re-check the pinout..

the NEC V30 is just taking a tile, assigning colors, and pretty much saying "NES, here's your tiles, and the colors you are to use for them."

I made a routine that emulates a framebuffer on the NES, which essentially lets me get away with, without actually using something called a "sprite"... this is my idea on the performance hit... the color limitation is also "dithering", and taking advantage of how NTSC would blend those colors to make a new color...

ALSO: Incase you guys want it, here's the source code to the Genesis Sonic 2.. I couldn't find the final version of the games source, so this is Sonic 2 BETA.. I'm not home, so acceessing my home computer is kinda slow on a 400k connection ;)

http://blackevilweredragon.spymac.com/s2beta.asm

[evildragon]

Yeah, Sonic 2 was disassembled, quite impressive actually. Anyway, how are you handling the internal CPU differences (M68K vs 6502). One's sub-32 bit, the other's 8 bit. The increase in addressing space is significant too.
heh, i ask myself why i don't use a "tool" to do this...

i have been painstakingly hand-coding it for a while now.. just this week was i able to get it playing...

there's a mix of 6502 code, and 8086 code (V30)...

there might be a tool out there to do this in a quick and easy automated processes, but it wouldn't fix the differences in audio and video hardware... (let alone the input, and address space)

I got two books, ones for 68K assembly, the other for 6502 assembly.. Once I get to a line, I look up in the 6502 book for a command that does the same (or similar).. if a command won't "fit", i break it down into multiple commands, which honestly sucks...

[tokumaru]

Ah... so you have a very special hardware there. Will it be possible for you to make custom carts that include the necessary hardware to play this game, so that other people can also play it when it's done? Maybe that will not be possible, bacause you access the palette RAM directly an all that. AFAIK, that can't be done with a regular mapper, that is fully inside the cart, and can't make use of lines that are not in the cart slot.

About the sprites, if I understood correctly, your hardware pre-calculates a few tiles to take care of the sprites the NES can't handle, is that it? And because of that some colors are sacrificed some times? So how does that work exactly? Your hardware generates all the tiles the NES will use, but how does the NES tell it what sprites go where and all that? Does your hardware also directly access OAM memory, name table memory...?

I must admit that since this is not exactly a NES project (probably nobody but you will ever run this game) I lost much of my interest.

Some things still make me think though, so if you don't mind I'll keep asking! =)

How come you got the exact same "bug" from the original game, the bottom scanlines in Emeral Hill that do not scroll properly with the rest of the level? Since you're doing a conversion, I imagine that should be an easy bug to get rid of. In fact, I'm amazed it's still there, at the exact same place...

[hap]

In what way are these 2 CPUs communicating with eachother? Are they simply running in parallel? The Megadrive is using a parallel CPU system too. Is one CPU mimicking the M68K part, and the other one mimicking the Z80 part? If so, which one is handling the sound engine in your system?

[evildragon]

that bug is the most annoying! when i ported the Emerald Hill Zone code, it went with it.. it seems to be a bug in the level itself.. when you start the level all looks fine, but that line gets "stuck".. i haven't found the offending code... I bet if I rewrote EHZ, the line would go away, but then i might bring other bugs into the level.. im surprised Hill Top Zone doesn't have this bug, being it's EHZ with a different layout and palette.. (and background layer, but my NES didn't use those anyway)..

making this into a normal cartridge would be troublesome for the following reasons: different addresses, and cost.. The V30 is a rare chip, and I did use some 80186 commands (to speed up in pre-rendering phases)... oh yea, power.. i don't think the cartridge port could supply the electrical current required.. ;)

when the V30 feeds the NES the sprites, it puts it in the V30's RAM.. The NES will call up those tiles, and send it right to the PPU (sorta like a psuedo DMA).. the V30 places the sprite locations (and level layout), in the NES' main RAM.. It doesn't put them ALL in there though.. only whats in the near proximity of where the camera is.. When you advance, the V30 feeds more data, relavent to the direction you are going.. (like pre-buffering).. however, even this has flaws.. you may decide to change directions ;)

whew! that's a lot of thinking XD i've not been asked the "good" questions in soooo long :p

[evildragon]

In what way are these 2 CPUs communicating with eachother? Are they simply running in parallel? The Megadrive is using a parallel CPU system too. Is one CPU mimicking the M68K part, and the other one mimicking the Z80 part? If so, which one is handling the sound engine in your system?
the NES does the sound too.. but my sound driver isn't complete for in-game use yet.. i only got it playing at sound test at the moment..

i don't have them running in parallel.. it's a master/slave setup... good question too! the NES is the master CPU.. the V30 is the slave CPU..

[evildragon]

i have to take a break for a bit.. im getting a headache, lol (reminds me when i was trying to port the stupid physics engine, nothing but bank switching!), and im gonna be eating and spending some time with my mother...

(btw, my first programming language that i learned was ROM-BASICA from Microsoft/IBM)

[hap]

Earlier, you were saying you're using the "square channel" for the music. How were you able to output a clear four channel polyphony with only 1 channel? Normally, this would cause horrible artifacts.
Or did you change your mind, and use more 2A03 channels after all, if so which channels?

[evildragon]

Earlier, you were saying you're using the "square channel" for the music. How were you able to output a clear four channel polyphony with only 1 channel? Normally, this would cause horrible artifacts.
Or did you change your mind, and use more 2A03 channels after all, if so which channels?
i only coded 3 channels (monophonic for each, but using all 3 channels to emulate 3 polyphonic notes..).. and i did end up changing the audio mapping (i can't help but NOT take a break right now XD)

Square
Square
Triangle

that being the NES sound... I ended up using those for music, as heard.. the triangle and one of the squares did the lower end bassy stuff, and it seems like theres more sound.. i personally am not satisfied with the outcome, i think the music playback is buggy...

( know which artifacts you're referring too.. final fantasy three does this at the begining.. the rapid changing of notes to emulate a chord)

EDIT: I haven't implemented the noise channel yet, as I don't know how to use it..

[evildragon]

(ok, now i have to take my break... see you guys later! look forward to answering more questions)

[GeckoYamori]

Perhaps you could direct the PSG noise channel to the NES noise channel (Though if I remember correctly, PSG can switch the channel from square to noise usage at will, and will not always be noise playback).

[evildragon]

Perhaps you could direct the PSG noise channel to the NES noise channel (Though if I remember correctly, PSG can switch the channel from square to noise usage at will, and will not always be noise playback).
hmm, that might work... if it does say, switch from noise to square, i'll be able to isolate that code and delete the square code (or better yet, re-direct it to one of the NES's square channels)...

One thing i'd be worried about, is if the noise channel respond the same.. for example, i think the noise on the Genesis can have a modulated "sound" to it, where the NES can't.. i'll see if i can make another emulator routine...

EDIT: This reminds me.. Aquatic Ruins' music has PSG alternative.. I'll use that for the aquatic ruins music.. it normally complements the YM2612, but it's PSG does play complete leads and noise percussions...

[Genesis Knight]

All of Evildragon's threads seem to turn into rigorous hardware/coding theory Q&A sessions. :p

[evildragon]

i don't mind them, as long as it's not a "GZeus" style post ;) you know, bash first, blame later.. XD

I prefer the educated questions like I got today, obviously people who know what they are talking about, wanting to know how I did it..

[Bregalad]

Yeah, the bottom connector has one video pin, and two sounds pins. I think the audio have input and output, and that the video has only output, and I don't know if it's possible to also use video as input.

If you don't use the video as input, then you feed tiles and palette data to the NES when it featches them. But the NES just fetch one nametable byte (ignored here I think), then a attribute byte (replacing it by the palette you're using) and two pattern bytes (replacing it by the bitmap you're using). Then you cannot have more than 4 colors (including the BG color) for 8 sequential pixels (without the use of any sprites). I think the pictures have too much sprites for the NES, so really don't know how you made it without the use of external video source.

[Mr Smith]

All of Evildragon's threads seem to turn into rigorous hardware/coding theory Q&A sessions. :p

Am I to take it you don't understand a word of what's being said either?

[Joe Redifer]

Hey evildragon, can you take a pic of the DVD drive hooked up to the NES? I realize it must look kind of goofy, but I've never seen anything attached to an NES except in an ad for the Telestar modem or something like that (which you could play online with Genesis gamers, supposedly). How did you figure out the pin configuration for the DVD-ROM to communicate with it? Isn't the DVD-ROM EIDE or SATA?

[evildragon]

I'll get a pic of it when I get home...

Bregalad: I understand of the limitations.. As I have tried to say, I wrote a frame buffer emulator that gets around this.. However, it ends up limiting the total colors to 8, that can be on a single screen... I don't remember how I did it exactly, I think it was a fluke, and was recycled code from another project for the NES, that I did some time ago...

[evildragon]

Hey evildragon, can you take a pic of the DVD drive hooked up to the NES? I realize it must look kind of goofy, but I've never seen anything attached to an NES except in an ad for the Telestar modem or something like that (which you could play online with Genesis gamers, supposedly). How did you figure out the pin configuration for the DVD-ROM to communicate with it? Isn't the DVD-ROM EIDE or SATA?
I'll get a pic of it when i get home...

I got the pinout by using some docs i got before on the net. IDE pinouts are widely known..

I used a standard IDE controller, interfaced it to the V30, and I run a routine on the V30, that forwards data to the NES, only when the NES requests it.. I don't remember the name of the chip, it was "Win" something, and I took it from an 8-bit ISA card..

[evildragon]

Bregalad, I think you're also fogetting I am dithering, so in some spots, you may think you're seeing more colors...

[hap]

Dithering would require a resolution much higher than the NES 256*240 to become unnoticed. Could you show us some raw sprites of your port (the ones you edited in Photoshop).

[Bregalad]

Bregalad, I think you're also fogetting I am dithering, so in some spots, you may think you're seeing more colors...
Yeah, this is effectively possible, acessing 4 colors even frames and 4 colors odd frames would allow 10 colors in total, and with absolutely no limitations. I guess to look decent, this would require changing palette index each horizontal scanline, and then swap it each scanline, so that to output a yellow bitmaps, one scanline would be red, and the scanline imediately following it would be green, and then both scanline would be swapped next frame. This would look a decent yellow at 60Hz I guess, and require only 2 NES palettes with unlimited bitmaps (exept that they are 10 colors).
However, how did you take the screenshots without the dithering (so that we don't see the dot patterns) ?

[evildragon]

on one of the images, you can see an artifact on sonics hand, a slight green color, that's from a dithering there to add a slightly darker shade.. the "rainbow" effect there..

when i get home, i'll get some raw sprites..

[evildragon]

Yeah, this is effectively possible, acessing 4 colors even frames and 4 colors odd frames would allow 10 colors in total, and with absolutely no limitations. I guess to look decent, this would require changing palette index each horizontal scanline, and then swap it each scanline, so that to output a yellow bitmaps, one scanline would be red, and the scanline imediately following it would be green, and then both scanline would be swapped next frame. This would look a decent yellow at 60Hz I guess, and require only 2 NES palettes with unlimited bitmaps (exept that they are 10 colors).
However, how did you take the screenshots without the dithering (so that we don't see the dot patterns) ?
I just used my BT-878 TV tuner, via composite.. NTSC on this tuner just smeres the adjacent pixels to blend them by fault..

Here's a raw image from the last level, minus the character and score sprites..

http://blackevilweredragon.spymac.com/nesscreen.jpg

(yea yea, i should have used PNG or TIF.. 6 colors is the count in that scene)

[hap]

So these are the raw NES tiles? The ones that are prepared by the V30 and then sent to NES CHRRAM? For reference, could you also post an image of the last level from your TV tuner, showing the NTSC artifacts you mention?

[evildragon]

these tiles are already in NES format.. the ones that the V30 prepare are Boxes, Rings, Enemies, and Sonic/Tails... anything that's a layout, is already NES ready..

http://blackevilweredragon.spymac.com/nosprites.jpg

there's the NES shot..

[hap]

http://home.planet.nl/~haps/crap/sonic2ntsc.png

This was created with a very accurate NES NTSC emulator. It is very different from your picture. Note the characteristic diagonal artifacts on dot patterns, unlike simply blended pixels.

[evildragon]

yea, that pattern i'm familiar with, my emulator has it too in NTSC emulation..

i have no idea why my tuner doesn't get those.. my tuner might have a piss-poor comb filter, i don't know.. it is a BT-878 chip, but the actually tuner module is some no-name brand... (it does get rid of dot-crawl though, which is why i've kept it)

[hap]

That brooktree chip is doing the decoding, it's impossible a broken external component or the chip itself is causing the artifacts in your images to be different in such a way.

[evildragon]

hmm, then i don't know.. i know it can't be the NES, cause they always output the same image the same way.. i've grown accustomed to the blending my card does, so i've kinda assumed others had it too...

come to think of it, it might be a DirectDraw filter that the card came with, maybe it had a software based comb filter or something... to bad i can't use standard BT-878 drivers on it, cause then the tuner won't initialize (i've tried, cause these drivers crash my comp all the time)..

[evildragon]

i have a screencap from during the last elections, that i used with this tuner.. i'll get that so you can see how it captures normal TV broadcasts.. (so i don't have to rewire this thing and grab a 50ft coax cable)

[hap]

Don't bother, I don't have to see those :)
I'm done here.

[tokumaru]

evildragon, I take it from looking at these threads (thread A (http://nfggames.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=2119), thread B (http://www.sega-16.com/forum/showthread.php?t=2117)) that is is normal that people doubt you when it comes to your so ambitious projects.

Since your Sonic 2 port is not the first case, you should have learned that if you want people to actually believe you, you should have all kinds of irrefutable evidence that what you're doing is in fact real real.

You refuse to provide enough material for people to believe you, and always come up with excuses of why you can't get such evidence. When asked for sprites, you posted a single screen of part of a level. From the screenshots you showed us before, you should have already worked with lots of sprites, including Sonic and Tails, enemies, etc... but you showed a simple piece of a background, that could very well be a color-reduced version of a screenshot taken with a Genesis emulator with one of the background layers and the sprite layer disabled. Specially if you consider that the resolution of that image is 320x224.

My advice to you is that if you want people to believe you, you should document your projects better (your memory seems to fail you ALL the time), take loads of pictures, give more detailed specs about your projects (you didn't mention you used the DVD drive for this until the NES people started asking you questions).

Honestly, I do not believe this project is real. As a long time NES programmer, I'm finding very hard to believe your screens and video captures. But I'm not here to flame you or anything. As I said before, I have no interest in this "project" anymore because, real or not, no one but you would ever play the game.

Even though I was really offended by this at first, because I am indeed working on a Sonic clone for the NES, taking into account all the limitations of the system and making it the closest possible thing to the Genesis series. It may not be possible to match all of the features found in the Genesis games, but I believe I can go beyond the Master System has.

Anyway, I couldn't care less about this anymore, so I have no intention of arguing with you, I can only suggest that you get some evidence to back you up as fast as you can now (maybe you can still get away this time), or, if not possible for this time, at least plan your next scheme better, so that you have evidence when asked for it.

But seriously, you seem to know a lot, because you can come up with fast answers that make at least some sense, so why don't you use your knowledge for something useful? Regardless of whether these last few projects were fake or not, none of them were really useful, just personal "tests". If you know as much as you say you do, you should be able to come up with really (and real) good things. Seriously, put your effort on something that's worth it.

[evildragon]

i do small things like this to get more experience...

that one raw sprite example wasn't from an NES or an emulator, so that's why it was 320 pixels in width.. a simple check on the actual captures will prove they are indeed 256 pixels in width...

i normally have given up talking about this stuff because of those two threads ;) but in thread A, i did prove enough, the schematics are out there, and since the core parts like the CPU are not proprietary, it isn't hard to do.. thread B, well, that's one that was so hard for me alone to do, i had help, and sadly i couldn't get all the answers compiled fast enough for good answers, so i feel i let some people down (and that being the last "major" project i ever talk about)..

oh, and on post number 1, i mentioned from the start a DVD drive module i made was to be used.. im surprised no one saw that...

i would love to see your project too, since you're doing it on a stock NES, i'd like to see what "can" be done, without the aid of upgrades... all i produce normally is upgraded systems..

[tokumaru]

i do small things like this to get more experience...
They are the opposite of small... your projects are a bit too ambitious!


that one raw sprite example wasn't from an NES or an emulator, so that's why it was 320 pixels in width..
Don't mind explaining it to me... I already said I do not care if this is real or not. For a moment I really had my hopes up, thinking I was not alone into bringing the authentic Sonic The Hedgehog experience to the NES (unlike Somari, Jurassic Boy, or crap like that - although those were the ones that made me think it was possible), but got really disappointed with the outcome.


but in thread A, i did prove enough, the schematics are out there, and since the core parts like the CPU are not proprietary, it isn't hard to do..
Again, you don't have to explain anything to me. However I have a comment on this one: If I went as far as having a full Genesis/Mega Drive working, I'd never forget about it and take it apart because of a small video problem. I'm not saying you did make it or not, but you have to admit it all sounds (smells!) very fishy...


thread B, well, that's one that was so hard for me alone to do, i had help, and sadly i couldn't get all the answers compiled fast enough for good answers, so i feel i let some people down (and that being the last "major" project i ever talk about)..
Yeah, I read it all. I can't comment anything here though, 'cause I don't know much about the Sega CD or the 32X or Mac OS, so I'll just be quiet.


oh, and on post number 1, i mentioned from the start a DVD drive module i made was to be used.. im surprised no one saw that...
Too lazy to check it now, but I though you had just mentioned you were known for the drive, not that you were using it for this. I may be wrong though. Anyway, you should have told people you were using extra RAM, and everything else that came with the drive, or else people will have no idea how far off the NES specs you are.


i would love to see your project too, since you're doing it on a stock NES, i'd like to see what "can" be done, without the aid of upgrades
You, like everyone else, is welcome to check out my project when I have something worth showing. Now that this thread was brought to attention, I may just post a little something in this forum too. I'm expecting to use this weekend and the next few couple days off to advance as much as i can with this.

[evildragon]

ok, then i'll let it sit... yes, i'll admit it was my bad for not making it clearer on the first post...

anyways, can't wait to see yours!

[tokumaru]

anyways, can't wait to see yours!
You and me both, pal!

I have a hard time focusing, so I get distracted a lot. For example, now I'm here posting instead of working!

But I have to admit that seeing your screenshots made me want to move faster with my project, I'll give you that...!

OK, off I am now, going to code some Sonic.

[Epicenter]

BlackEvilWereDragon-whatever the hell you call yourself now-- quit posting bullshit. This is another obvious lie from your enormous stockpile of extravagant nonsense.

Just like your claims you got Mac OS to run on a MegaDrive with a 32X, despite obvious problems demonstrating your complete lack of understanding of how the hardware even works, not to mention performance that outclasses a system with a processor 8 times as powerful. Bullshit.

Just like your ridiculous claims you built your own MD from scratch and even reverse-engineered all of Sega's custom ASICs, which you then backpaddled your way out of by saying you had to tear it all apart to use the Z80 to repair your mom's VCR. Sure, lots of VCRs use Z80s. And they're SO RARE A PART you'd tear apart a from-scratch MD to get one? You can get armloads of VCRs for $20. Bullshit.

Just like your claims of using a DVD-ROM drive on a NES, again, more fantasy.

You already shitted up the Underground Console Mods forum with this bullshit, same for GamesX and countless others. You PM me about basic hardware questions all the time demonstrating a near total lack of understanding of electronics and then claiming you cooked up projects that would make a skilled engineer sweat bullets to pull off.

And now you try to shit up Sega-16 just because you found some people who might believe your lies. You're going to have to pull a better hoax out of your little bag of tricks to fool someone who has even the vaguest idea of the NES hardware, which is why you decided to post on a Sega-centric forum. Had you posted on a forum for avid fans of Nintendo hardware you'd have been sent packing in the first post. I am surprised this thread has gone on for 6 pages with some people still believing your incessant diarrhea of the mouth.

You can't even figure out the native resolution before making your fake bullshit hoax screenshots which is the first thing anyone who had even the vaguest understanding of NES hardware would do-- they'd start with images that were 256x240 or 256x224 not 320x224. Way to go taking screenshots from MD emulators and fucking with them in Photoshop. You don't even take into consideration how many colors a tile can have. You exceeded the hell out of them. I won't even begin to scratch the surface of the iceberg of recompiling 68000 and Z80 ASM for a 6502 processor, which would be an enormous task even WITH source code, which you don't have. All three processors are completely incompatible with each other. Not to mention all the sound issues of trying to imitate the output of a Yamaha YM2612 and the MD's custom PSG. But a quick skimming of your comments on the matter prove you barely have any concept of what sound channels the NES/FC RP2A03 procesor even provides.

Grow the fuck up if you want anyone to take you seriously or perform a real project if you want respect. Lying just makes you look like a moron and you're wasting everyone's time, including your own.

[evildragon]

Look, if you don't believe me, fine, i never asked everyone to believe me.. But you don't need to threaten me about it.. THAT is annoying me now, and honestly, it's scaring me, and I feel you're stalking what I do, and I don't appreciate that.. If I was really faking this, I truly wouldn't have openely said I have Photoshop, let alone, take it this far... The only hoax I ever pulled was Intel Mac OS X on a laptop, but after a couple days, I came out and said it was a joke.. And it was piss-poorly done, because I don't have experience in video editing.. The only thing I'm good at besides programming is straight 35mm photography.. That's all..

All I'm asking from you, is to just leave me alone, and let it be...

(and for the record, I always know the NES resolution, it's 256x240.. every NES programmer knows that.. the 320x224 image was a mockup, and yes, that WAS from a Genesis emulator capture, using Gens KMod, and I used the same algorithm to compile NES tiles, to get a raw image data, to compare from the palette used on the real NES... I had to do that as I have no development kit for my stuff...)

[Epicenter]

Don't flatter yourself. No one is STALKING you and this isn't my first post on this forum. I was shown this thread by a friend.

I'm not trying to attack you, I'm proving you're deceiving people who don't know not to believe your lies. As long as you keep lying I'm going to keep calling you out on it until you admit you're just taking everyone for a ride. What the hell enjoyment do you even get out of this?

No more bullshit. No more claiming you can't take photos of this or that, or you're too big a perfectionist, or you had to destroy your work at the last minute before you could take a photo to fix a VCR, no more trying to say you're autistic and hide behind that facade or just claim you don't remember anything when you get cornered. No more making up stories as you go along "Oh, that's impossible on the NES hardware??! Well I wired up a V30 and a 68010 and a PowerPC 603e and 128MB of RAM and a DVD-ROM drive! But I don't remember how I did any of it and I can't take photos becaue I had to use the 603e to repair my Mom's sewing machine! Also I'm autistic, OK!"

Come clean and people will only think higher of you for it, it'll show you have a shred of maturity. Right now you're not making anyone respect you except people who don't know any better than to believe your nonsense.

[evildragon]

i had already agreed to take a picture of this unit.. but what good does that do if it'll get shot down anyway?

[Epicenter]

i had already agreed to take a picture of this unit.. but what good does that do if it'll get shot down anyway?
You've done that before; first you made a hoax picture and then you refused to take more with further detail (like the inside/wiring of your "Mac MegaDrive" when prompted), ruining any credibility. If you can prove the system actually makes any bit of rational sense and we can see how it's wired/analyze it there's a chance to confirm if you're lying or not.

But honestly everything you've said already pretty much confirms that anyway. Seriously, just admit you're lying.

If you prefer contact me on AIM (Epicenter713) or email (epicenter713@gmail.com) and we can take this discussion off the forums.

[evildragon]

sorry, can't admid im lying, because im not...

if my project is closed source, why would i show my stuff's inside wiring? it's closed source because it is special to me, to make, and honestly, i don't want to share it.. wonder why i don't want to share it? look at your own over-the-line comment to me... why would i want to if people are just going to say threatening things like that?

I really don't mind if people don't believe me, I don't care, but you don't have to say what you did...

(and i ask you things in PM's because I am not a know it all.. I don't know everything.. I don't know the Genesis VDP well.. that's why the 32X was used for SegaMac, i know that a bit and had a friend who knew it more.. i asked you about the sprite limitation order, because i wasn't aware of it.. i knew about a limitation, but that's all i knew..)

[Zebbe]

Pics of the NES-DVD, please!

[Epicenter]

if my project is closed source, why would i show my stuff's inside wiring? it's closed source because it is special to me, to make, and honestly, i don't want to share it.. wonder why i don't want to share it?
ahahahahahahahahaha. Sure.


I really don't mind if people don't believe me, I don't care, but you don't have to say what you did...
If you don't care why do you drop a fucking dramabomb when people call you out, whine about how everyone needs to just leave you alone unless they're going to pelt you with blind praise and lock your topics and delete your posts when you don't get your intended response?


(and i ask you things in PM's because I am not a know it all.. I don't know everything.. I don't know the Genesis VDP well.. that's why the 32X was used for SegaMac, i know that a bit and had a friend who knew it more.. i asked you about the sprite limitation order, because i wasn't aware of it.. i knew about a limitation, but that's all i knew..)
More proof you're a liar. The 32X hardware is much less well understood than the MD's VDP which is based on an off-the-shelf Texas Instruments part. You're just an endless faucet of bull.

You're not hiding information 'on principle because it's personal and important', that's the worst excuse I've ever heard. You previously offered such things and then just backed out of it because you had nothing to show and wanted to keep up your lies. When no one on UCM would believe you, myself included, you threw a shit-fit. And now you pull this crap, making yourself out to be a victim. You're not releasing anything because you have nothing to show.

The day you can prove a single goddamn thing you say, which would be as easy potentially as just puttig up a few decent photos, and I'll stop calling you out on it. But until that day I'm going to judge based on what you've told us-- and so far that's a crock of lies.

[hap]

Nobody's threatening you :) They're just seeing things from their perspective (which is different from yours).


sorry, can't admid im lying, because im not...
Then what is it? Are you describing a planned project, a wish? Or is evildragon a made up character/split personality of the person that's sitting behind the computer (the real you), living in his own world of incredible projects? The latter would be interesting really, and I wouldn't blame you nor evildragon for it since it's your nature.

[evildragon]

Nobody's threatening you :) They're just seeing things from their perspective (which is different from yours).


Then what is it? Are you describing a planned project, a wish? Or is evildragon a made up character/split personality of the person that's sitting behind the computer (the real you), living in his own world of incredible projects? The latter would be interesting really, and I wouldn't blame you nor evildragon for it since it's your nature.
it is a project in testing, and running phase.. evildragon is a short name that i have used since my deviantart days.. it means nothing and i've been meaning to change it...

i thought i said everything i needed to say to prove the project was real, without getting into too much detail.. what the hell did i miss? i made sure i was prepared as much as possible before posting this.. hence when you NES guys came, i had quick answers.. if i was really hoaxing, i doubt i'd have had quick answers, let alone videos..

let's say i was hoaxing.. if i was to make a video, with what, 1000 frames total, that would mean that's a LOT of frames to photoshop.. well, that doesn't make sense, cause i turned out the videos quite quickly.. even then, wouldn't 1000 frames take a whole day? seems that way, yea...

now lets say i was hoaxing the screenshots.. well, if i really wanted to hoax something, to me, i'd have used that same NES filter you used.. but, i didn't.. i can't control what my tuner's driver and whatever the hell it's filtering does.. i captured the shots using "DScaler"... (though the softwares own program has the same effect)..

that's my take on it.. you know? if i was hoaxing, i'd think i'd have been slower in producing videos, and would have had used a filter on the pics to make it look like an NES.. but alas, i did not.. i produced straight results from whatever i got from the hardware/software... you asked for NES sprites, i produced them raw for you, in the same manner i would have, and i get called out on that because the resolution wasn't NES.. well of course it wouldn't, it was RAW, it wasn't from the real hardware, that should have been obvious, with the lack of, well, lol, everything from the picture..

[hap]

You're a smart guy. Earlier when I said I was done here, you knew that I knew for a fact this project exists in your brain only.


well, if i really wanted to hoax something, to me, i'd have used that same NES filter you used.. but, i didn'tOf course you didn't, it was made with a BMP to NES image converter, created by me and not released to the public.

[evildragon]

You're a smart guy. Earlier when I said I was done here, you knew that I knew for a fact this project exists in your brain only.

Of course you didn't, it was made with a BMP to NES image converter, created by me and not released to the public.
now you're just insulting me..

i could easily have reproduced that filter.. NES emulators have it, and with that it's pretty easy to make a simple NES binary with a single image on it, then take a screenshot with that..

if you guys don't believe me, fine, i don't give a rats ass.. what i do care about, is namecalling, trolling.. i don't like that, and i know others wouldn't either...

im just surprised you NES guys don't know how it's possible.. There's been some NES games that have borderlined sprites like this..

but just remember this: what can't be done in hardware, CAN be done in software.. just like Software Rendering on all those old games, it's there for the lack of hardware support.. that's all i did on the NES, i went around hardware limitations by software.. i just don't know how you guys don't know how to do that.. maybe you guys don't because it's not recommended practice, as it results in a performance penalty...

Atari 2600: Supercharger.. If I'd had invented that today, people would still think I was lying.. but it's obvious that product was real, in the days of the Atari! I didn't invent it, Starpath did, and damn were they smart.. not only did it increase the RAM, it allowed the impossible, Tape based games on a cartridge based console.. That means that cartridge had hardware that interpreted the pulse as binary numbers, and stored it in RAM.. not to mention, it might have had some form of error correction...

anything is possible.. that should be obvious by now.. im done here myself.. this thread has been requested to be locked, and i am no longer sharing my projects.. only people i trust can see them (and yes, there's some, some being on this forum, and others too)...

[hap]

now you're just insulting me..That message was for you, not evildragon.


im done here myself.. this thread has been requested to be locked, and i am no longer sharing my projects.. only people i trust can see them (and yes, there's some, some being on this forum, and others too)...Good choice :)

[Epicenter]

i thought i said everything i needed to say to prove the project was real, without getting into too much detail.. what the hell did i miss? i made sure i was prepared as much as possible before posting this.. hence when you NES guys came, i had quick answers.. if i was really hoaxing, i doubt i'd have had quick answers, let alone videos..
I don't deny you're intelligent and you're able to make up lies to cover your ass quickly. Good improvisational skills. But you should be putting that creative energy toward something useful or a real project.


let's say i was hoaxing.. if i was to make a video, with what, 1000 frames total, that would mean that's a LOT of frames to photoshop.. well, that doesn't make sense, cause i turned out the videos quite quickly.. even then, wouldn't 1000 frames take a whole day? seems that way, yea...
Assuming you're hoaxing, since you are, don't play dumb. You know you wouldn't need to photoshop 1000 images. It's easy to use a decent video processing tool to remove/edit colors and palletize a video, even dither, all at once. No handling of individual frames. That's obviously all you did-- took output from an emulator with one layer removed (the background), with heavy frameskip to make the game look like it was running poorly due to the slow NES CPU (you completely forgot the NES cannot frameskip. If the CPU lags behind and cannot complete its work before each vblank the old frame is redrawn til a new one is ready; this produces a slow, smooth 60 or 50 FPS 'bullet time' sort of slowdown. You're yet to try and weasel your way out of explaining THAT).. and then you filtered it via a video editing app to make it look like it ran on less graphically sophisticated hardware. You didn't even get the resolution right. Seriously, I've seen much better hoaxes from less intelligent people.


now lets say i was hoaxing the screenshots.. well, if i really wanted to hoax something, to me, i'd have used that same NES filter you used.. but, i didn't.. i can't control what my tuner's driver and whatever the hell it's filtering does.. i captured the shots using "DScaler"... (though the softwares own program has the same effect)..
That's just been your cover story; it was already shown the artifacts and flaws in your video were self-applied blur to make the emulator output look like it was a hardware NTSC capture, when in fact real NTSC video artifacts are more complex and subtle. I've used 3 WinTV cards with your exact BT878 Brooktree chipset and their video output looks nothing at all like your videos. Not a BIT.



that's my take on it.. you know? if i was hoaxing, i'd think i'd have been slower in producing videos, and would have had used a filter on the pics to make it look like an NES.. but alas, i did not..
You rushed so you wouldn't be assumed a liar, and that backfired. You just made poor, rushed hoax videos and images and crappy 2A03 renditions of MD audio which anyone can do with a few freeware PC programs.

And now, you move to get the topic locked, just like I said you would. Just like you always do. Once no one believes you and you can't whore for attention anymore, you seal the deal with one final drama-bomb, making yourself look like a piteous victim and dragging the whole thread down with you. The internet equivalent of a suicidal last stand. You know you've lost. Come down from your victimized soapbox and just admit it and no one will think less of you for it, I've said it, hap has said it .. dragging on like this just makes us all think less of you. You've created a real reputation as a troll across many forums now. UCM, here, NesDev, GamesX .. how many more do you need to humiliate yourself across before you give it up and just come clean?

[evildragon]

i requested it to be locked because of the name-calling.. any moderator would do that.. not to mention, YOU should know you shouldn't do that.. aren't you a mod too?

(yes, normally it's warning first, THEN take action, but being you're a mod, you kinda are self-warned)

[hap]

Have you ever played megalomania? (not the Megadrive game :P )

[Epicenter]

i requested it to be locked because of the name-calling.. any moderator would do that.. not to mention, YOU should know you shouldn't do that.. aren't you a mod too?

(yes, normally it's warning first, THEN take action, but being you're a mod, you kinda are self-warned)
I'm a mod on UCM, not here. but since you've posted all this bullsht on forums where I am a mod .. my patience wears thin. I doubt a few four letter words mean a thread needs locking. You're just trying to cover your ass and doing a poor job...

[evildragon]

I'm a mod on UCM, not here. but since you've posted all this bullsht on forums where I am a mod .. my patience wears thin. I doubt a few four letter words mean a thread needs locking. You're just trying to cover your ass and doing a poor job...
i know where you're a mod, i didn't inferr you were one here..

and i don't post this on forums where your a mod, to stay out of your way, so you dont have to SEE it..

[Genesis Knight]

Epicenter, keep it civil if you want to continue posting here. Discussion and debate is fine as long as it's conducted in an appropriate manner. If you want to disprove Evildragon, that's fine, but I don't want to see this thread devolve further into personal insults and name-calling.

The thread will be locked if this continues.

[hap]

If you want to disprove Evildragon, that's fineThat's been done already, he's just trying to make him confess. Though I think evildragon is a pathological liar, a megalomaniac, unable to confess unless under severe pressure. He's the cause of this mess, and at the same time the victim.

[Bregalad]

Why would people make evildragon confess ? We all know his stuff isn't real, there is no reson to attack him 'bout that.

Debates cannot be made on facts, but on sense you put to them. Since it has been technically proofed a fact that all of evildragon's projects are fake, why one would try to make him confess the obvious ?

@evildragon : If you don't wan't to share yours... ahem... projects, then why make a topic about it ? (I challenge you to find a valid quick answer on this one)

And, I trought it would be cool to make a contest where everyone would be invited to design fake projects, and then publically present them, and then they would be asked technical questions by other candidates, and for each questions answered decentely, the candidate wins points. Then the one with the most points on his projects win.
I trought it'd be cool, especially if evildragon would be the contest's president, having considerable experience in this domain. That'd be a great fun, and avoid people actually flaming eachother, but just make it for fun.

[evildragon]

Why would people make evildragon confess ? We all know his stuff isn't real, there is no reson to attack him 'bout that.

Debates cannot be made on facts, but on sense you put to them. Since it has been technically proofed a fact that all of evildragon's projects are fake, why one would try to make him confess the obvious ?

@evildragon : If you don't wan't to share yours... ahem... projects, then why make a topic about it ? (I challenge you to find a valid quick answer on this one)

And, I trought it would be cool to make a contest where everyone would be invited to design fake projects, and then publically present them, and then they would be asked technical questions by other candidates, and for each questions answered decentely, the candidate wins points. Then the one with the most points on his projects win.
I trought it'd be cool, especially if evildragon would be the contest's president, having considerable experience in this domain. That'd be a great fun, and avoid people actually flaming eachother, but just make it for fun.
i don't mind sharing, i just don't like the flaming.. that's my quick answer..

if you really do have that contest, i'll do it.. i think i could pull it off.. video shots are hard to fake, they take time as you'd have to manipulate it frame by frame.. (for that, we're talking days, cause it could be over 10000 frames)

PS: To be honest, I don't care about this project anymore, so let's just forget about it... But we can continue this discussion on how to fake a project.. i once did the Mac OS X on a Dell hoax.. was pretty wide-spread for a bit.. But I mentioned it was a joke like 4 days after...

[hap]

or worse, call me pathological.. That's rude, and totally uncalled for.. even if i was lying, that's still rude, and honestly, it does nothing to hurt you.It means I think you're ill, so you can't really be blamed for your actions. I'm sorry that indirectly only one person is hurt.

*edit* erm, you removed the post I quoted from :P

[evildragon]

here was my infamous hoax..

http://www.tuaw.com/2005/06/13/dell-laptop-running-os-x/

too bad the people on that forum didnt see me admit it was a hoax... (i honestly didn't expect it to leave the forum it originated on..)

(and yes, it was a full-screen VNC session.. that's all... and to what one of those guys said, this laptop is way to OLD for Media Center XD)

[Bregalad]

No, honnestly, evildragon, I had a lot of fun proofing the fake of your so called... hahem.... project. I don't mind flaming you, because this really did provide me a lot of fun. You shouldn't take it all that bad.

Fake projects don't harm people like does spam or messages such as "Send a copy of this to at least 10 of your frends else...."
The only think they do is make people try to find proofs of the fake nature of the project, and trus making functionning their brain, and provide fun too.
I just wouldn't do that myself serioulsy, just because it makes no sense to me. Seems it does for other people (I don't give names to not hurt anyone).

EDIT : However, this could possibly harm people with similar real projects, like here it was the case with Tokumary. He originally was very angry, but I said him to calm down, because in some sense this wouldn't hurt his project in any way (on the countrary).

[108 Stars]

I have a feeling that some people just register here to bash evildragon. Are you friends of Gzeus?
If you don´t believe him just ignore him! There is no proof either way; we can´t control what evildragon really has done, so decide for yourself but stop bashing.

[hap]

I have a feeling that some people just register here to bash evildragon.Basically, yes. We were invited from a NES development forum to try prove him wrong.


Are you friends of Gzeus?No.

[evildragon]

that's against this forums rules i believe... guess you'll be punted...

(and oh yea, that proves to us SEGA fans, that NES fanboys can be real jerks---congrats for proving that to us)

[system]

Basically, yes. We were invited from a NES development forum to try prove him wrong.

No.
http://nesdev.parodius.com/bbs/viewtopic.php?t=3333

Took me five seconds of googling :P

[Bregalad]

If you don´t believe him just ignore him!
That could be a way to go, but for me I just wanted to not let people who don't have the same knownledge as I am to fell in trap.

There is no proof either way; we can´t control what evildragon really has done, so decide for yourself but stop bashing.
I never bashed anyone, on the countrary, I think ask questions and say facts clearly is a much better thing to do than bashing (and only Epicented had done ANY bashing on this thread).


that's against this forums rules i believe... guess you'll be punted...

Since when it's against rules to register and ask questions ? I guess hoax is more against rules, but I'm not too much a very rule-guy myself.

and oh yea, that proves to us SEGA fans, that NES fanboys can be real jerks---congrats for proving that to us
Depend of what you call a jerk. If you mean people that states facts and ask technical questions about technical stuff, then yes you should be right.
And if you think so then why make your.. ahem.. project on a Nintendo console ?

PS : I'm still disapointed you havent found an answer to why you made a topic for a project you wouldn't share.

Anyway I'm done here, since I have no reason to continue this nonsense debate.

[evildragon]

yep, they are as bad as we all figured they were! shoot first, ask questions later... LOL

anyways, you guys can call it fake, i don't care.. call it the worst/best hoax, i don't care..

[evildragon]

i would have shared it, if i had made it for an original cartridge.. i would have shared the source code too...

and it's against the rules to ask questions, if the intent is to bash the person.. as per your NES dev thread...

(im actually getting a laugh at you guys..)

[hap]

(im actually getting a laugh at you guys..)That's good :) We didn't intend to harm you like eg. GZeus did in that old thread, but deal with you more maturely.

[evildragon]

how many days has it been since i started this post?

[evildragon]

damn, one day late, i was supposed to say something yesterday (which would explain the flaming)..

ok ok, you all got me, and damn good too.. it IS fake.. damn glad some people here know stuff... (i do have the technical knowledge on it too, but i wanted SOMETHING to be fishy... and no, i don't know the pinout at all to the expansion bus)...

as I said, after 4 days, i admit a hoax.. i didn't know this was the fifth day, my bad...

[Elusive]

So flaming is when people call you out on your 'evidence'? I don't get it what is going on here @_@

[evildragon]

So flaming is when people call you out on your 'evidence'? I don't get it what is going on here @_@
flaming to me, is when people start name calling, and just cursing at people.. that's flaming..

[Mr Smith]

So, to clarify, as I haven't been paying attention. This topic is completely pointless as you were creating a "hoax" that you had made a NES version of Sonic 2?

[evildragon]

yes.. so don't bother reading it..

[Melf]

...and we're done.