View Full Version : Ace's "Neptunizing" progress thread
Ever since I saw Longhorn Engineer's Neptunized Model 2 Genesis, I wanted to give it a run myself. Well, I will now initiate my "Neptunizing" of a Genesis. I will be using a VA4 Model 2 Genesis for this mod. It will feature a single power supply input for both the Genesis and 32X and will be international, in other words, with 3 region switches, 2 for the Genesis(U/J, 50hZ/60hZ), the other for the 32X(50hZ, 60Hz). I will also see if I can find a way to get Master System compatibility restored via a switch that will toggle between the 32X's B30 signal and a Ground signal to enable Master System mode(hopefully, this isn't wishful thinking and is actually feasible).
So far, the Genesis and 32X have been dismantled. Every day, I will post any progress I've made in the "Neptunizing" process.
Well, good luck :) I hope you can fit the audio mod somewhere too :)
It's a VA4. The latest models of the Genesis 2 don't need it. My VA3 had good sound, and so does my VA4, so the Audio Mod will be left out.
Zebbe
08-23-2008, 04:23 PM
I hope you succeed. Good luck!
Afcs46
08-23-2008, 05:28 PM
It's a VA4. The latest models of the Genesis 2 don't need it. My VA3 had good sound, and so does my VA4, so the Audio Mod will be left out.
Crap :) My VA4 sounds like playing a K7 with 10 upper records on the tape :yuck:.
Odd. My VA4 sounds just like my VA3. Something weird I noticed is that my VA4 is in an MK-1631 shell. Is that board only supposed to be in MK-1451 shells, or did Sega use the board in the MK-1631 Genesis 2 before the model number changed to MK-1451 when Majesco took over?
Day 1 saw some pretty good progress:
-Added US/JAP region switch
-Removed cartridge slot off the Genesis motherboard
-Added S-Video for Genesis games(anyone have a CXA1645 I can use to get S-Video off both the Genesis and 32X?)
-Modified the Genesis' top casing to fit 32X cartridges and to add in the writing on the Japanese MegaDrive 2(16-BIT and MEGA DRIVE 2 on the front)
The unit is now 10% complete. Today, I will wire up the 32X to the Genesis cartridge slot's old location and see if I can link up the Genesis' power input/video output to the 32X's power/video inputs.
I have come across a bit of a problem, however. How do you add a switch to the VA4 Genesis 2 to switch between 50 and 60Hz? Post #133 here shows pictures of the VA4 motherboard: http://www.sega-16.com/forum/showthread.php?t=5079&page=9
My assumption is that 50/60Hz is controlled by resistors R33 and R34. Is this assumption correct?
Day 2 didn't really go as planned. All I did was to prepare the wires to solder on the 32X. I also backtracked a little bit, as the connection to switch the Genesis' region code to Japan broke, so I'll have to solder that to a ground.
It's only about 12% complete now. I will redo my switch and start soldering on the 32X today.
Day 3 didn't see much progress, more of a backtrack, if you will. The wires I had made were too short to reach from the Genesis' slot to the 32X's contacts, so I had to make a new set, although one of the sets of wires is still good for the A side of the Genesis and 32X.
Making a Neptune clone out of MD2 and 32X should take only 1 night.... ? I don't have a spare 32X to make a Neptune...
I've got many other things I'm modifying or fixing up. My VA7 Genesis 3 needs to have a solder joint redone to display the 32X video layer, I'm trying to get better compatibility out of my VA2 Genesis 3, plus I'm trying to find the audio outputs on my Gen-X Geniclone/Famiclone's Genesis side to clean up the audio. I'm doing many things at the same time, so it hinders progress a bit.
Afcs46
08-26-2008, 12:16 PM
My assumption is that 50/60Hz is controlled by resistors R33 and R34. Is this assumption correct?
http://img259.imageshack.us/img259/6642/genesis2modsk8.png
Maybe this image helps you (it's not mine)...
I already performed this mod. I need to know for 50/60Hz, not for US/JAP, I've already done that one.
Day 4 has passed, and really, not much has been made in terms of progress. The wires for the B side have been soldered in place, and I'm ready to install the switch that will enable/disable Master System mode on the Genesis(is it really that the 32X inhibits access to pin B30 to switch the Genesis into Master System mode that breaks Master System compatibility, or am I missing something?).
Day 5 saw the 32X being soldered into the Genesis in its entirety, minus pin B30, which I have to link up to a switch to switch between Master System and Genesis modes.
No progress made on Day 6, as I was making videos comparing the Gen-X clone to original hardware.
Little progress on Day 7. The DIN on the Genesis board has been removed. It will soon be glued upside-down to get the video signal from the 32X. I still need to link up the Genesis' video out to the 32X's video in and solder the switch for Master System/Genesis mode.
Days 8 and 9 were spent rewiring my VA2 Genesis 3, so no progress was made on my Neptune, but I will go all-out today and do as much as I possibly can.
Flygon
09-02-2008, 03:42 AM
Just some encouragement.
I wish you the best of luck completing this.
I sure hope it doesn't result in the 6th Genesis I kill.
Day 10 was interrupted because of a F-ing electrical transformer that exploded and caused a power outage! At least I got the region switches in place.
matteus
09-02-2008, 07:35 PM
Aren't 32x's rare...shouldn't we be trying to keep them alive rather than merging them into neptunes?
David J.
09-02-2008, 07:51 PM
Aren't 32x's rare...shouldn't we be trying to keep them alive rather than merging them into neptunes?
In Europe they are. Dunno about Japan... But in the USA, they are so fucking common, I've seen many of them scattered about for a pittance.
matteus
09-02-2008, 07:52 PM
ahh Euro ones.......that makes sense *sighs* they are rare around these parts! Shame their a bit on the poo side for the price they fetch....
The Neptune is on hold until my Genesis 3 works properly again(minus PSG sound output).
"Neptunizing" has resumed(it's now day 11), and I have some good news, but it's a little overshadowed by a problem. The Neptune is operational, but I think some of the solder joints are bad, as I have one of the following 3 situations whenever the Neptune is booted:
-The "Produced by or Under License from Sega Enterprises LTD." screen never disappears
-The games load, but then crash
-The games load and display a red screen soon afterwards
I noticed that the issue seemed to change depending on how the wires were placed(I'm using IDE ribbon cable by the way). I must have some fragile solder joints/wires, but I will now go resolder all 64 connections on the 32X. If that still doesn't work, I will redo them on the Genesis. If it still won't work, there's a serious hardware problem, which I doubt, as at first, the games loaded, but 32X games had black spots on the 32X video layer, so I resoldered some wires, and it got worse since.
you seem to have some loose contact... red screen means bad checksum and that means the system does not see data correctly.
So I guess the problem originates from the data lines, then? I also now have a problem where when the Neptune is turned on, it doesn't recognize anything(!CART_IN is loose?).
not data, address ones... of there would be data line issue, you will not get anything more than a black screen.
!CartIn might be the cause for the other issue you have
Okay, now I'm having the same problem as my VA7 Model 1: loss of 32X video layer. What pin on the cartridge slot is supposed to get the 32X video mixed in with that of the Genesis?
I can also confirm that Master System compatibility is impossible to achieve, as even when the Genesis is in Master System mode, the games don't load.
UPDATE: So far, so good. The Neptune seems to have stabilized(I have After Burner Complete running as I'm typing this with all video and it hasn't crashed yet). I've redone all my B connections and reoriented the A side connections like The Longhorn Engineer did(makes for a more stable connection).
UPDATE 2: @%#$, this thing just crashed! How F-ing unstable are my solder joints?!?! That's what I hate most about the Genesis: when you have a fresh solder joint, everything works fine, but then, as time goes by, the solder joint's no good anymore. $%#@!
UPDATE 3: Seems like when I nudge the 32X board a little bit, it works again, but then crashes soon after. I'm not sure if it's because of a lack of aluminum foil, as I haven't put that in between the wires. I also have the wires in bunches instead of separate, so I'm not sure if there's some cross-talk going on.
UPDATE 4: Well, what do you know, pin B30 was on a Ground, enabling Master System mode. It works now.
UPDATE 5: I can't stop this thing from giving a red screen on Genesis games! Every time I resolder something, it just doesn't change anything!
UPDATE 6: Thunder Force II just gave me a ROM error. What would that mean?
Something seems strange. Looks like !CART_IN is at the heart of all my problems, as when I put it on a ground, it almost always boots, but then crashes, as always.
ooXxXoo
09-15-2008, 03:28 PM
Not sure if this will come handy in your case and assuming that you have removed the bottom metal shieding side and the bottom cartridge connector plastic support stand tab, but after building around 13 Neptunes wanna be's, I've noticed that some boards behaved strange without the actual support. Some boards required to be tightened (w/ the holding screws), while others only worked properly when loosened or even without the stand.
Btw, You mentioned a 32x/ SMS mode switch...Why doesn't the 32X supports Virtua Racing or the SMS converter?...Are the cartridge connections B19 and B30 missing on the 32X system?
I haven't bother really to find the problem or a the possible solution for these compatibilities...
I've removed all the IDE ribbon cables, and will replace them by 22-gauge wire. It's currently stalled until I get the Gen-X sounding right.
Virtua Racing's incompatibility seems related to a memory addressing conflict between the cartridge and the 32X, if I'm not mistaking. I don't know what's up with the Master System issue, but I think if I want Master System compatibility, I need to add a 50-pin card-edge connector along with the 32X's 64-pin one. Or maybe, as the system was already going haywire, some other connection could have been missing. I don't know.
32X intercepts many of the cartslot signals, and few address lines that get shorted by the PBC won't reach in that state to the MD, so even if you have !SMSmode grounded, it just applies to VDP, the few other pins are for putting the rest of the system into SMS mode.
I think I'd need a separate cartridge slot with a Pause button if I want Master System compatibility, then! No thank you, that's too much trouble.
Not sure if this will come handy in your case and assuming that you have removed the bottom metal shieding side and the bottom cartridge connector plastic support stand tab, but after building around 13 Neptunes wanna be's, I've noticed that some boards behaved strange without the actual support. Some boards required to be tightened (w/ the holding screws), while others only worked properly when loosened or even without the stand.
Did you ever have to deal with a VA4 Genesis 2? If so, what usually worked well for them(I have the bottom RF shielding and cartridge slot support still in place, but with no screws)?
ooXxXoo
09-18-2008, 10:32 PM
Did you ever have to deal with a VA4 Genesis 2? If so, what usually worked well for them(I have the bottom RF shielding and cartridge slot support still in place, but with no screws)?
No, I've never seen a Genesis 2 V4 board....Mostly and only V3's and earliers revisions....But if your V4 has the shorter motherboard like V3's do, you may experience this issues that I talked about...What you probably want to do is trial and error, you know, sometimes with metal shielding/slot support and screws and other times by removing each at a time...until you are able to achieve the game play( if your connections are correctly)....Make sure to use the original bottom metal shielding, 'cause I've noticed that these shorter boards will act funny with a different one for some reason, not sure why.
The VA4 has the smaller motherboard like the VA3. What I noticed was that after leaving the Neptune off overnight, it'd work again, only to crash soon afterwards. What worked best for a VA3? It may work the same way for a VA4.
None yet. The Neptune is on hold for the time being, as I'm focusing my efforts on my "Project Rebirth" Genesis 3.
None yet. The Neptune is on hold for the time being, as I'm focusing my efforts on my "Project Rebirth" Genesis 3.
Whats that gonna be?
the Rebirth was shoving Gen-x clone into Genny3 case. He succeeded, there's a thread on Genny Does.
I have a link to "Project Rebirth" in my signature.
As for the Neptune, I may be able to resume work on that, but some solder joints need to be redone, as some of my IDE ribbon cables snapped.
Been a while since my last update on this project, but it's not a very good one. During testing, one of my solder joints on the Genesis came loose, which made the game that was in the Neptune at the time crash, then nothing worked. So I tried to resolder the wire, but alas, the trace for that pin(one of the A pins) broke from under the motherboard. I know where to get that pin elsewhere in the board(the Sanyo chip on the motherboard), but I don't want to risk causing any more damage to that Genesis. So, the "Neptunizing" has come to an abrupt end.
Or did it? If you remember from my "Project MAXED OUT" thread, user Kagemaru(who's been banned(may I ask why?)) had said this:
You wanna know "MAXED OUT"? Implement FM synth into a Power Base Converter, Neptunize a Genesis Model 1, and hot wire the power supply of a front loader SEGA CD to the Genesis before attatching it.
This means, I will be moving my 32X(it still works) into one of my 3 Genesis Model 1s(my VA6, to be more specific, as the system already has region switches put in place), and adding a cartridge slot for Sega Master System cartridges. I won't be able to do the power linking thing with the Sega CD because I don't know how(I don't even have the tray-loading Sega CD). And I'll just put back a 64-pin card-edge connector into my VA4 Model 2 Genesis with the pin whose trace is damaged linked to the Sanyo chip(at least if I can make it into a Genesis again, that's good). Plus, it's one of the best Genesis Model 2s for Sega Master System backwards compatibility(VA0-VA1.8 have issues recognizing certain cartridges, VA2 has horrible PSG, VA3/VA4 are the same).
The "Neptunizing" will resume soon! I've found a "High Definition Graphics" Genesis Model 1, and will be picking it up in the afternoon(it's currently past midnight here in Canada).
nathanallan
02-08-2009, 01:21 AM
You still have my support Ace, it'll happen!
Got my own neat little project moving, too.
I got the Genesis, but the testing was unpleasant. I couldn't get the damn thing to work(no sound, very loud buzzing, white screen either with or without a cartridge). The guy who had the Genesis was using a power supply whose amperage was too low, because with an official Sega power supply, it works no problem.
Now, here's the best part: no TMSS! I'm under the impression this will be the very first non-TMSS Neptune. The "Neptunizing" has officially restarted!
And if you're curious about the motherboard revision of that Genesis, it's the same motherboard as my other pre-TMSS Model 1, which is motherboard revision VA3.
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