PS3 vs Xbox 360 - the buyer's decision

[Diosoth]

It's come down to "I want a current gen console" this year. I owned a Wii for a brief bit and wasn't too thrilled by it, which leaves the PS3 and 360.

Save the fanboy arguments. "PeeS3 sux0rz" isn't a valid argument.

I can only buy one. So...


360 Pros:
* larger game library
* dedicated, long-time online service
* game achievements
* currently the cheaper console

360 Cons:
* having played someone else's 360 it seems some games suffer from unreadable text if using a smaller CRT television. I can't shell out for a large HDTV right now.
* they STILL suffer RROD and disc scratching because Microsoft is too friggin' CHEAP to make the things out of good parts to begin with!
* the HD-DVD format failed. The add-on is separate anyway. Just plays DVDs.
* backwards compatibility is poor. MS ditched support, deciding they'd make mor emoney by selling compatible Xbx games over XBL instead of letting us play copies we already own.


PS3 Pros:
* built-in Blu-Ray player. Even the CHEAPEST stand-alone Blu-Ray player is $300 right now. Not that my 21" flat screen CRT will really benefit, but at that price it's basically a free upgrade.
* PS1 backwards compatibility in all models. Not sure if it's 100% perfect though.
* dedicated PSN store which sells PS1 games and other goodies.
* actual integration with the PSP, not that I own one of those anymore.
* I don't hear about massive hardware failure rates the 360 is known for.

PS3 Cons:
* still uses the PS1 controller style. I prefer my left stick upward for 3D games, to be honest.
* the Sixaxis motion sensor was a bad idea that got little to no practical use from what I can see.
* current retail configurations cut PS2 compatibility entirely.
* higher price. But seems everyone's expecting Sony to price drop sometime this year- even Microsoft sees it coming.
* the PS3 port of Alan Wake was canned. It's a game I've been looking forward to.


Seems I may be best off getting a PS3 after the price drop. What do you think? Many of the games I want are cross-platform anyway. Reliable hardware outweighs exclusive titles for me.

[snume]

* having played someone else's 360 it seems some games suffer from unreadable text if using a smaller CRT television. I can't shell out for a large HDTV right now.

I have owned my 360 for over 2 years now and only own a 26" CRT TV. The text IS small, and I have had a tough time reading it, but it has never made the game(s) unplayable. I hear some games will scale the text, but I can't say which ones and can't speak for the PS3's abilities in this area.


* they STILL suffer RROD and disc scratching because Microsoft is too friggin' CHEAP to make the things out of good parts to begin with!

No RROD in 2 years and no scratches on discs, but I have had to replace my DVD drive (did it myself) and paid $40 for it so I found it reasonable. No console manufacturer would replace the DVD drive after 2 years (or 1 for that matter). The latest data shows the RROD failures very low with the newest chip and cooling technology.


* backwards compatibility is poor. MS ditched support, deciding they'd make mor emoney by selling compatible Xbx games over XBL instead of letting us play copies we already own.

They are STILL adding new games to the backward compatibility list, at the rate of a couple each month. The XBOX Originals are in addition to the back compatibility, to spur sales of the XB1 games seeing as how they make no money on used games.

[Diosoth]

No RROD in 2 years and no scratches on discs, but I have had to replace my DVD drive (did it myself) and paid $40 for it so I found it reasonable. No console manufacturer would replace the DVD drive after 2 years (or 1 for that matter). The latest data shows the RROD failures very low with the newest chip and cooling technology.

It seems to be lower, yes, but I'll be more satisfied when it's become so low you don't often hear about it. Fact is, seems MS has deemed it cheaper to fix/replace consoles than it would be to make sure the problems don't happen to begin with(word is the scratched discs are due to the exclusion of a 75 cent piece of rubber from the DVD drives), and it seems like a poor decision towards the people who actually pay money for the goods.

Given the original Xbox was very sturdy, I do take some issue with it. I'm usually hard pressed to toss that much money towards entertainment to begin with.


They are STILL adding new games to the backward compatibility list, at the rate of a couple each month. The XBOX Originals are in addition to the back compatibility, to spur sales of the XB1 games seeing as how they make no money on used games.

They shouldn't make money on used games. They're old, secondhand copies and they already got their money for each copy. Not that I'm too concerned with it, since I own an original Xbox but consoles do take up room, the Xbox especially. Still, I really don't hear much about the updates. The gaming news sites dont seem to much care anymore.

[Devil N]

As owner of both a 360 and PS3, I like to think I'm fairly impartial in this matter. In previous generations I was a loyal PlayStation supporter, and the PS3 was the only system I had to buy (the 360 was a prize I won in a contest), so if anything I should be mostly biased towards the PS3.

I don't really feel like a big rant right now, so I'll simply make some remarks on a couple of your points.


* having played someone else's 360 it seems some games suffer from unreadable text if using a smaller CRT television. I can't shell out for a large HDTV right now.

That's mostly a problem caused by game developers (*cough*Capcom*cough*). I own an HDTV, so I don't know how often this problem occurs, but it could just as well occur on the PS3. Shame on Microsoft for not checking for this problem in their (allegedly extensive) QA process.


* they STILL suffer RROD and disc scratching because Microsoft is too friggin' CHEAP to make the things out of good parts to begin with!

That has to be put into perspective a bit. I have owned my 360 for nearly three years now, and I have never had a single hardware problem with it. According to all these stories roaming the internet, it should be utterly impossible that my 360 has survived this long. Yet it has.

Thing is, the people who have suffered RRODs are very vocal in their complaints, but you should remember that there is also a very large group of people who haven't had any problems whatsoever. I personally think the problem is made to appear larger than it actually is.


* the HD-DVD format failed. The add-on is separate anyway. Just plays DVDs.

Yes, well, what to say... I've enjoyed HD DVD a lot for more than a year, and I still think it was the better designed format of the two, but that's past now. It's probably a good thing the 360 wasn't bogged down by having a next-gen optical format included in the system. The PS3 was a year late to the market because of the Blu-ray drive.


* backwards compatibility is poor. MS ditched support, deciding they'd make mor emoney by selling compatible Xbx games over XBL instead of letting us play copies we already own.

You have to wonder how important this really is. Backward compatibility is always a nice-to-have, but in my experience you rarely use it.



PS3 Pros:
* PS1 backwards compatibility in all models. Not sure if it's 100% perfect though.

It's hardly perfect. The graphics scaling is absolutely terrible. There's a smoothing option in place to mask it, but that makes the graphics very blurry. The PS3 is also region locked for PS1 games. In my opinion, an original PS1 or emulation are better options.


* dedicated PSN store which sells PS1 games and other goodies.

That's pretty much the same as the 360 offers. It's not an advantage that the PS3 has over the 360 or anything.


* I don't hear about massive hardware failure rates the 360 is known for.

The PS3 is definitely a lot more silent than the 360, both in the cooling fans and the disc drive. It feels more sturdy because of that, but again I haven't had any hardware failures with either of them. Also, newer 360 machines have cooler chips and better DVD drives, so they are probably more silent than the one I have.



PS3 Cons:
* still uses the PS1 controller style. I prefer my left stick upward for 3D games, to be honest.

I always liked the layout of the Dual Shock controller, but the role of the left analog stick has increased the last couple of years, at the expense of the d-pad. So yeah, the 360 layout makes more sense nowadays. In any case, a little innovation on Sony's part would be nice.


* the Sixaxis motion sensor was a bad idea that got little to no practical use from what I can see.

Agreed. It's a sorry attempt at imitating Nintendo's motion sensing controls, and I haven't seen a single good use of it. The motion detection is way too fiddly and sensitive to be any good.


* current retail configurations cut PS2 compatibility entirely.

Again, an original PS2 is probably better for PS2 games anyway.


Many of the games I want are cross-platform anyway.
That's very much true. The games library is hardly a reason to choose one console over the other anymore, unless there are some exclusives that you absolutely must have.

I bought my PS3 two years after I got my 360, for only three reasons:

1) Metal Gear Solid 4
2) Blu-ray playback
3) A better d-pad for fighting games

Those are hardly compelling reasons to get a PS3, even when added together, but I could afford it at the time.

Now, to be honest, I have been very underwhelmed by the PS3 so far. The whole experience is very lifeless and uninspired. The XMB interface is... functional, no more no less. The online experience is bare-bones, but that's what you can expect from a free service. The trophy system is disposable, as if Sony didn't quite understand what made the 360's achievement system so compelling.

It's clear that Sony is mainly a hardware manufacturer, but doesn't know how to turn their software into an interesting experience. With Microsoft it's the other way round - their software is very nice, but their hardware is generally lacking in quality. With the 360 you really feel like you're part of an online community, especially after the recent NXE update. With the PS3, it just feels like you're sitting in front of a machine that happens to play games.

[Diosoth]

I've never been a "company supporter". Sega killed themselves and it wasn't Nintendo's fault. I don't use Windows XP because I like MS, I use it because Macs aren't gaming platforms. If Apple could make the damn things into actual gaming machines to compete with PC then they'd have my business. I refuse to touch Windows Vista.

Thing about 360 hardware failure, it's totally random. Some people bought theirs on launch day and have no problems, others are buying the new Jasper chip or Elite units and getting them after a month. It's almost reversed from the last gen when the PS2 DREs were so bad they got sued over it, while you can smack an Xbox with a hammer and do no lasting damage.

I wouldn't be so concerned with BC except the MS systems are large. The Xbox takes up more room than my Gamecube and Genesis model 2 combined. Not such a big deal with Sony when I can get the slim model PS2 for about $60 used off craigslist.

[Zebbe]

Why are game achievements a pro?

[Elusive]

Why are game achievements a pro?

Because everyone, deep down, has an evil little monster that cackles gleefully knowing that his number is bigger than your number.


It's clear that Sony is mainly a hardware manufacturer, but doesn't know how to turn their software into an interesting experience. With Microsoft it's the other way round - their software is very nice, but their hardware is generally lacking in quality. With the 360 you really feel like you're part of an online community, especially after the recent NXE update. With the PS3, it just feels like you're sitting in front of a machine that happens to play games.

This. If you want a Blu-Ray player that also runs PS3 exclusives, get a PS3. If you want a machine that does lots of things adequately and to be part of an overarching community, get an Xbox. Even if you don't like the games, you either get a BD drive or a media centre box anyway.


[edit] There's no real 'full integration with the PSP', besides as an avenue for buying games for the handheld. Besides the few games that support remote play and the occasional gimmick (that Ridge Racer game that used it as a rear-view mirror), there's no real connection.

[Diosoth]

Online play isn't a big factor for me. And while I generally prefer to have hard copies of games I buy, if I can buy PS1 titles on PSN for far cheaper than vintage copies, it's a bonus to me. Things such as Virtual Console or other means for real old games don't grab me, considering most of the good stuff is on compilation discs now. I mainly want game systems AS game systems. When I owned a PSP the extra stuff didn't appeal to me, and even with an Acekard in my DS I RARELY use the media functions that Moonshell offers.

I have a DVD player already. 2 actually thanks to the Xbox. So the Blu-Ray player appeals to me. It's a strong format that will soon become the primary format and as I said, stand-alone players cost a fortune. The good ones even costing more than a PS3. Seems like wise financial sense to buy one when you compare costs. But missing out on Alan Wake and no Halo 3 seems like a minus.

Anyone have ideas on what Sony would do for a price drop? I'm guessing $100 off each model but it's hard to tell. They may drop only $50 off.

[Chilly Willy]

I've enjoyed HD DVD a lot for more than a year, and I still think it was the better designed format of the two, but that's past now.


Actually, it WASN'T. Toshiba took the "VHS approach" and made it CHEAPER hoping that cheap would prevail just like in VHS vs Beta. Blu-Ray is a FAR better design. Sony was smarter this time and instead of keeping BD proprietary, they lined up support for the format - they had almost 50% more companies backing them compared to HD-DVD, and that made all the difference.

Okay, I don't have a 360, but I do have a PS3. The PS3 is a most excellent media player. Even if it didn't play games, I'd probably buy one for it's ability to play DVDs and CDs in addition to BDs. DVDs never looked so good - the PS3 puts that extra horsepower to good use in post-processing the DVD to look its finest on HD TVs. Naturally, BDs look excellent. I use the digital optical link for audio, so everything sounds incredible. As you put more into your HDTV and audio, you'll see (and hear) better results from all your stuff.

One thing I love about the PS3 compared to the 360 is the support for linux. While people whine about Sony not allowing access to the RSX GPU, you still have enough power to do virtually anything other than Quake 3 or better 3D. All those emulators people play? They're all there. SNES, Genesis, N64, Atari... they're all nearly perfect on linux emulators on the PS3. You also have media players in linux for those formats Sony won't ever support in the official media player. It's something to consider.

[FoxHound]

question what models of the systems are you looking at between the 2

[Diosoth]

question what models of the systems are you looking at between the 2

Barring finding decent used sales on craigslist, I'd be likely to purchase a current retail model off the shelf.

[0x15e]

The short version: I have both. I play the 360 far more. Save your cash until you can get an HDTV at the same time.

Since you're in SD, completely ignore the Blu-Ray / HD-DVD aspect. Also, it's possible for any game to have tiny, unreadable text on a SD CRT. They're designing these games for 720p or higher. A result of that is that they're using smaller / thinner fonts that are readable in HD but really hard to see in SD.

The backwards compatibility of the 360 is nothing to sneeze at. Don't think they abandoned it to switch to selling "classics" as downloads. Every game they sell as a download can be played from disc as well. It's just that they haven't added anything new to the list since they started doing that. Basically, I think they decided the list was long enough and to start making some of the games available as downloads as well. That's a bit of a different tact than what Sony pulled when they just yanked the console's ability to play the games at all.

There are only a couple of Sixaxis control implementations I've seen that don't suck. Those are Flower and Blast Factor. While that number may be low, it does show how Sony's motion controls can provide a unique playing experience that couldn't be done on the 360.

Finally, look at what your friends are playing. It's always more fun to play online with friends than total strangers.


Actually, it WASN'T. Toshiba took the "VHS approach" and made it CHEAPER hoping that cheap would prevail just like in VHS vs Beta. Blu-Ray is a FAR better design. Sony was smarter this time and instead of keeping BD proprietary, they lined up support for the format - they had almost 50% more companies backing them compared to HD-DVD, and that made all the difference.We're going a bit off-topic here, but I'm going to have to disagree with you. I originally saw BD as the superior format but when I really started digging into HD-DVD, I decided otherwise. Marketing won that war, plain and simple. HD-DVD, as a format, had more features usable from the start because they had the format nailed down. BD was incomplete at release and has since been updated a few times to match what HD-DVD had been doing all along. When I play a BD disc, it just seems like a higher-resolution DVD experience. I have yet to see one authored with the same level of polish as the majority of the HD-DVDs I own (and again, I have players for both formats, so I'm pretty unbiased here).

[Mamba Tabac]

I too own both consoles, and the best possible advice I can honestly give is to play on each of them if possible, and make your decision based on that. They are both excellent systems in their own ways and I think which one is better is a personal thing.

One word of warning though - the 360 does still suffer from hardware problems. I am currently on my 4th console, and even my current elite has red-ringed twice.

[Chilly Willy]

We're going a bit off-topic here, but I'm going to have to disagree with you. I originally saw BD as the superior format but when I really started digging into HD-DVD, I decided otherwise. Marketing won that war, plain and simple. HD-DVD, as a format, had more features usable from the start because they had the format nailed down. BD was incomplete at release and has since been updated a few times to match what HD-DVD had been doing all along. When I play a BD disc, it just seems like a higher-resolution DVD experience. I have yet to see one authored with the same level of polish as the majority of the HD-DVDs I own (and again, I have players for both formats, so I'm pretty unbiased here).

Completely wrong on every point. In fact, BD was released slightly after HD-DVD to avoid being incomplete. HD-DVD has nowhere near the features, having taken the simplified route to get out quick and cheap. Every update to BD puts it that much further ahead of HD-DVD, which was virtually abandoned on release. As to your "experience", virtually every HD-DVD I've seen is 720p to save on space since HD-DVD can't store as much as BD. Every single BD I've seen is 1080p. You are probably viewing these on an HDTV incapable of 1080p, and the TV is doing crappy downscaling.

[Joe Redifer]

-If you list Achievements as a pro for the 360, you MUST list Trophies as a pro for the PS3. They are the same thing, but I don't think there are limits to how many trophies a single game can have because Burnout Paradise keeps adding more and more for the new download content.

-As a media player, the PS3 if FAR better. The 360 is limited to WMV files for video, but the PS3 can play MPEG 4, AVI and other such nonsense. Neither can play Quicktimes, though. Well, the original Xbox can with the Media Center or whatever it is called, but you have to add that yourself. The PS3 OSD is much less intrusive when watching other media.

-The sound on the PS3 is much better and supports 7.1 surround on many games if you have the setup. Xbox 360 is limited to Dolby Digital 5.1. I don't think any games even use DTS on the 360. PS3 has uncompressed sound. If money is limited, Dolby Digital 5.1 is probably fine.

-As for the games themselves, the 360 seems to favor first person shooter games. I really hate those kinds of games. Why? Because they are ass, that's why. N00bs love them, though. So if you are a n00b, stop reading and get a 360. Beyond that there are good games for both systems.

-Blu-ray is totally awesome.

[MrMatthews]

What FPSs are on the 360 that aren't on the PS3? Obviously Halo, but does the PS3 have Prey or Darkness? The Call of Duty series?

[Melf]

I think Left for Dead isn't on the PS3, but just about all the others are. I know the Orange Box wasn't developed by Valve, and it's reportedly not as smooth as the 360 version.

I have both, but I prefer the 360. I have over 50 people on my PSN list, but every time I log on, only 1 or 2 people are playing. Yet every time I connect to Xbox Live, there's usually over a dozen of my friends online, so I tend to play online games there.

The PS3 has trophies, but only a handful of games support them so far. I really wish they'd patch older games. :(

[Joe Redifer]

I don't know as I don't follow FPS games, but usually when people are slobbering about them, they are also slobbering about the 360 and badmouthing the PS3 so the 360 must be the haven for FPS games.

[MrMatthews]

Well, whoever you are talking to who "slobber" over FPS games are obviously stuck in the past. Aside from a few long-running franchises and a handful of games that happen to use the first person perspective (Bioshock and Metroid Prime 3, specifically) it's a genre that is A.) dated and B.) greatly out-numbered by all the 3rd-person shooters/brawlers and racing games that are popular right now.

Removing myself completely from the 360/PS3 debate, I still have to shake my head at anyone who believes that this console generation is inundated with first-person shooters . . . or that the 360 has significantly more than the PS3.

[Chilly Willy]

Both the 360 and PS3 will have a decent selection of games covering every category. So if all you're going to do is play the latest games, go for the one that has the exclusives you're interested in. Where the PS3 appealed to me was the better media playing, and the ability to run another OS (linux right now, but theoretically, any OS could be ported to it). I've got Fedora 9 installed on my PS3.

[0x15e]

Completely wrong on every point. In fact, BD was released slightly after HD-DVD to avoid being incomplete. HD-DVD has nowhere near the features, having taken the simplified route to get out quick and cheap. Every update to BD puts it that much further ahead of HD-DVD, which was virtually abandoned on release. As to your "experience", virtually every HD-DVD I've seen is 720p to save on space since HD-DVD can't store as much as BD. Every single BD I've seen is 1080p. You are probably viewing these on an HDTV incapable of 1080p, and the TV is doing crappy downscaling.*sigh*
Let's take this outside. (http://www.sega-16.com/forum/showthread.php?t=6851) No need to thread jack.
*grabs his beer*

[Diosoth]

I'm not even sure achievements should count since, from what I can gather, they don't really do anything.

Until I can get a decent ethernet hub anyway, my online activities would be limited to whenever I decide to switch cables. I've tried desperately to install an actual router, byt my computer will not let me. I've attempted installs of both wired and wireless Linksys routers and even a Belkin router and no luck, they just won't communicate. I have, however, used an ethernet hub with perfect success, but sold it when I got rid fo the Wii. But it seems hubs are harder to find in stores for some reason.

Anyway, I get enough "online play" in MapleStory, so playing these games online isn't an appeal to me.

It's not so much money as it is room as far as a new TV goes. Big floor model HDTV? No place to put one. Probably never get it through the front door. I'm not totally versed on smaller models, but I'm usually limited to 1 big luxury purchase a year. I have a water hearer in dire need of replacing, and unfortunately, I need hot water more than TV.

[0x15e]

I'm not even sure achievements should count since, from what I can gather, they don't really do anything.No, they don't / shouldn't, but sometimes it's fun for pointless bragging. I seriously wouldn't make them part of the decision making process here.


It's not so much money as it is room as far as a new TV goes. Big floor model HDTV? No place to put one. Probably never get it through the front door. I'm not totally versed on smaller models, but I'm usually limited to 1 big luxury purchase a year. I have a water hearer in dire need of replacing, and unfortunately, I need hot water more than TV.I heard that. Priorities and all. The thing with HD on these things isn't so much the size, it's the resolution. I found that there's a lot of stuff going on in the details that you just don't see in SD. Games where you wouldn't expect it to make a difference were really affected (racing, of all genres was one where I noticed a big difference).

It sounds like you're leaning towards the PS3. The nice thing about this generation is you can't really go wrong. Since most games are cross-platform anyway, just take a look at the (relatively few) exclusives and pick the system with more of the ones you want. If the PS1 games and Blu-Ray are a big bonus for you, then it's a pretty clear-cut decision, IMO.

[Joe Redifer]

No, they don't / shouldn't, but sometimes it's fun for pointless bragging.

Usually when I hear of a multiplatform game coming out, people post that they want the 360 version. Achievements are a large part of their reasoning. And then they slobber. Always so much slobber.

[AD2101]

Alright I struggled with this for a while in the past, and from my travels here is both consoles from my eyes. Of course I'm missing some things and not everyone will agree but I already spent wayyyy too much time on this post so here goes nothing.

360 PROS:
-Cheapest of the two. $300 for the pro vs $400 for the 80gb PS3.
-Larger library of games. kinda self explanatory
-Better online.
-Better customer service. Just going on word of mouth here. I know there are some horror stories out there (There always are with these situations), but that's to be expected and MS's 3 year RROD warranty beats out Sony's 1 year plus you have to have original receipt warranty any day IMO.
-Xbox Backwards Compatibility: Requires Harddrive and latest update but that's not too big of a deal.

360 CONS:
-Hardware issues. Microsoft has all but guaranteed to be past the Red Ring of Death in their newest console revisions, but when you've seen as many dead 360's as I have, its hard to fully believe that.
-Microsoft's "Nickel and dime" approach. Sure it's the cheapest console sticker price wise, but when you have to pay $100 for a wireless router (if needed), battery packs, chargers for those battery packs, and Xbox live it can get expensive fast.
-Not as capable as the PS3. I'll probably get flamed for this but in the coming years you'll see things on the PS3 that just aren't possible on the 360. People are already arguing that with Killzone 2 and MGS4 (If nothing else than the extreme amount of stuff on the Blu-Ray disc). Hell even the people making Tekken 6 of all games are having a hard time getting everything to squeeze onto a DVD.
-Halo, Gears of War, and Fable?: Although I could care less about Halo and Fable, these are some of the biggest franchises around and you can't get 'em on the PS3.

PS3 PROS:
-Doesn't "Nickle and Dime" you to hell and back. Free WiFi out of the box, free online, and all controllers have built in rechargeable batteries. Also if you want to use a headset nearly all bluetooth headsets are compatible with the PS3.
-Upgradeable Harddrive. If for some reason you ever fill up the potentially 160gb's of space on your hdd, you can upgrade it to pretty much whatever size you please, and it doesn't void the warranty.
-Metal Gear Solid: This probably doesn't matter to most people but at the time this was a huge factor into my decision.
-Blu Ray: Roughly 9gb worth of space compared to 50gb on a blu-ray disc. I've heard the read times on Blu-ray discs are longer, but it doesn't phase me. PS3 of course is also a blu-ray player and if you ever get a HDTV it'll kick your ass.
-Great Media player: I downloaded the Red Kawa File Server onto my PC and from there my PS3 can access any media file on my computer. Movies, music, pictures all can transfer wirelessly to my PS3. I don't care if I can watch movies on my computer, something about them being watched on a TV is just so much better to me.
-Web browser: Not a particularly great one but when you and your friends are drunk and wanna watch youtube videos it's great.

PS3 CONS:
-Won't play PS2 games: I know the old ones do but thats really not a viable option to the average consumer.
-Inferior online: Although I'm just fine with my PS3 online, no one has headsets (which I only care about because I have one I never use) and it's a pain in the ass to find matches on SFIV.
-Your friends probably don't have one: Whenever people ask me which console to buy I usually ask them what console their friends have. Most of the time they say 360 so I tell them that as I just think its better to play with your friends then some randoms online that will just act like retards anyways.
-More expensive sticker price.

When I weighed all the options I saw the PS3 to be the better deal. I get shit for it all the time at work but I love it, also it was the last PS2 compatible model Sony released that was a plus. All of my non-work friends have PS3's also so I really don't miss out on gaming with my friends either.

Bottom line: If your just looking to play some great games and don't care about online or anything past just playing games, there's nothing wrong with the 360 Arcade. If you want to see what this generation can really do I would go with a PS3.

P.S. There is a Limited Edition Resident Evil 5 360 Elite Bundle coming out friday. Its the same price as a regular Elite, but it comes with Street Fighter II HD Remix, RE5, and a super awesome Red 360. If you can find one of those I would say get that as that is one of the sweetest deals I've seen.

[TheEdge]

Don't get either. Just wait for the next generation. Use this time to get back into your older systems. You will have a lot of fun and save cash at the same time.

[Devil N]

^ That might be the wisest advice in this thread so far.

In the end, the whole 360 vs. PS3 discussion is only about which console sucks the least. Overall, I have found this current generation of consoles to be fairly disappointing, with the PS3 being the most disappointing of the two. No matter how hard I try, I really haven't felt the same excitement for new games that I felt during the 16-bit and 32-bit eras, and still somewhat during the previous generation.

This is probably also largely why I have taken refuge in retro machines more and more during the last couple of years.

[Diosoth]

I couldn't care less about missing out on Gears of War. Mike Capps has begun the crusade to demonize the sale of used games, so quite honestly, the whole of Epic Games can kiss my ass.

On the other hand, I can't stand Hideo Kojima, so I refuse to touch the Metal Gear franchise. The guy has only recently started to reverse his goofy views on the gaming industry, but this is likely due to GTA constantly outselling any of his games rather than a genuine change of heart.

Likewise, for exclusives, the God of War people have gone on the "used game sales are evil" crusade, so it's another exclusive franchise I won't miss. Mass Effect on 360? I HATE Bioware and their games. I pirated Sonic Chronicles and decided after about 10 minutes that the company was stocked with idiots who can't make a good game.

That really just leaves Bioshock, Halo 3 and Alan Wake on the 360 I'd miss out on, but my leaning is still the PS3, due simply to the hardware side.

[MrMatthews]

You're in luck, then, because Bioshock recently came to the PS3

[snume]

I couldn't care less about missing out on Gears of War. Mike Capps has begun the crusade to demonize the sale of used games, so quite honestly, the whole of Epic Games can kiss my ass.

Well, to be honest, this crusade has been going on since the beginning. Developers and publishers have always been against used games, he's just the latest loudmouth. Sony was seriously contemplating making the discs for the PS3 tied exclusively to 1 console (http://www.techspot.com/news/21708-sony-to-make-it-illegal-to-sell-used-ps3-games.html), no options for resale or even lending them to a friend, but they backed down prior to the PS3 release, I believe because of negative reaction to the news.

I personally love the Gears of War series. Could be a little longer, but I love the controls and the story. To each his own. Could do with less jerkoffs online, though, but that's online gaming for you.

[Diosoth]

You're in luck, then, because Bioshock recently came to the PS3

YAY! Now if only Alan Wake would be reassigned to PS3...

I know Postal III will be out on PS3. Doom 4 is most likely as well. I shouldn't miss Halo 3 at all, assuning Id doesn't screw it up.

[tomaitheous]

^ That might be the wisest advice in this thread so far.

In the end, the whole 360 vs. PS3 discussion is only about which console sucks the least. Overall, I have found this current generation of consoles to be fairly disappointing, with the PS3 being the most disappointing of the two. No matter how hard I try, I really haven't felt the same excitement for new games that I felt during the 16-bit and 32-bit eras, and still somewhat during the previous generation.

This is probably also largely why I have taken refuge in retro machines more and more during the last couple of years.

Or it could have nothing to do with this generation all ;) You're getting older and your perception and relative experience of the fondness/memories of past consoles of your younger days.... you've got a mild case of the nostalgia blues. Everyone and every generation gets it. And every generation thinks there's was better then the current, etc. ;)

[Iron Lizard]

No must people seem to be down on this generation more then I have ever seen before. And I am talking people much younger then me who continue to play their Ps2s .

[Devil N]

Or it could have nothing to do with this generation all ;) You're getting older and your perception and relative experience of the fondness/memories of past consoles of your younger days.... you've got a mild case of the nostalgia blues. Everyone and every generation gets it. And every generation thinks there's was better then the current, etc. ;)
Well, nostalgia is probably a large part of it too. But the fact remains that most modern day games don't interest me at all. The most fun I've had in recent years has been with a) indie games and b) retro games. Fortunately, both 360 and PS3 do offer plenty of those.

[TheEdge]

^ That might be the wisest advice in this thread so far.

In the end, the whole 360 vs. PS3 discussion is only about which console sucks the least. Overall, I have found this current generation of consoles to be fairly disappointing, with the PS3 being the most disappointing of the two. No matter how hard I try, I really haven't felt the same excitement for new games that I felt during the 16-bit and 32-bit eras, and still somewhat during the previous generation.

This is probably also largely why I have taken refuge in retro machines more and more during the last couple of years.

Thanks:!:

And well said!

[gamevet]

I don't know as I don't follow FPS games, but usually when people are slobbering about them, they are also slobbering about the 360 and badmouthing the PS3 so the 360 must be the haven for FPS games.

The problem with playing FPS on the PS3, is that most players don't have a Blue-tooth headset, or don't use them. Its sort of a mixed blessing though, since most of the time (360) you have at least a couple of dumbasses that shouldn't be allowed to have a headset in the first place.

It's almost like you're playing alone, when online with the PS3.

[Diosoth]

FPS on consoles have always ben inferior to the PC. End of story. Neither a controller or Wii remote are as good as keyboard and mouse.

Part of me would prefer to say "screw the consoles" and just focus on the PC. However, I've heard nothing good about Windows Vista and I know, for a fact, that all factory-installed PC video cards are crap. I'd have to spend the cost of a console on decent video and sound cards, which doesn't strike me as worth the hassle.

As for a TV... I oculd probably get a decent PC LCD monitor instead of an HDTV, they tend to be cheaper. Assuming I can either find an appropriate VGA cable or a monitor with HDMI inputs. For that matter, I could use my LCD monitor ut I don'tknow if it's even HD compatible.

[0x15e]

As for a TV... I oculd probably get a decent PC LCD monitor instead of an HDTV, they tend to be cheaper. Assuming I can either find an appropriate VGA cable or a monitor with HDMI inputs. For that matter, I could use my LCD monitor ut I don'tknow if it's even HD compatible.With the 360, there's an official VGA cable (don't try to save money by buying a knockoff, they suck) or for either you could adapt HDMI to DVI. The only catch would be to make sure the monitor you buy supports HDCP if you're using the DVI connection.

[j_factor]

I prefer the PS3 myself. Mainly because I'm afraid of the 360's failure rate. It is worse than any console in recent memory. Sure they have warranties, but what happens when your warranty is up?

I also found that the majority of games I was interested in for either system were on both. Plus, a great deal of 360 exclusives are on PC, whereas PS3 exclusives generally are really exclusive.

Other pluses for PS3:

-- Full BC with the right model. It does suck that they took this out, but there is no 360 in existence with full backwards compatibility. Bonus: the PS3 upscales.
-- No region lockout for PS3 games. Anything that doesn't come out in the US can be easily imported. "Asia versions" are reasonably priced and have an English manual.
-- Microsoft charges out the wazoo for accessories/features. Even the Wii has wi-fi built-in, so why does MS want me to pay an extra $100 for the privilege? Plus, PS3 can use PC peripherals (including hard drives) whereas MS has a monopoly on theirs -- and their hard drives are way overpriced.
-- Free online. People say 360 has a "better" online service, but really, who cares? If I want to play online, I merely need it to work. I especially don't like how MS went out of their way to prevent tunneling software from working.
-- USB. The 360 has USB ports, but they don't actually work. MS blocks developers from allowing the use of a mouse and/or keyboard. Command & Conquer supported a mouse on Playstation and Saturn, but C&C3 can't on 360. WTF is up with that? PS3 can use USB gamepads such as the Saturn USB pad, while the 360 cannot.

[Elusive]

-As a media player, the PS3 if FAR better. The 360 is limited to WMV files for video, but the PS3 can play MPEG 4, AVI and other such nonsense. Neither can play Quicktimes, though. Well, the original Xbox can with the Media Center or whatever it is called, but you have to add that yourself. The PS3 OSD is much less intrusive when watching other media.

The 360 has supported DivX and all the other BitTorrent-friendly formats out of the box since December 2007 :)


-As for the games themselves, the 360 seems to favor first person shooter games. I really hate those kinds of games. Why? Because they are ass, that's why. N00bs love them, though. So if you are a n00b, stop reading and get a 360. Beyond that there are good games for both systems.

Lies! Damn lies!



FPS on consoles have always ben inferior to the PC. End of story. Neither a controller or Wii remote are as good as keyboard and mouse.

A mouse and keyboard is fine and dandy if you're at a desk in a comfy chair in front of a small monitor, yes. I much prefer my small, handheld device when I'm sitting comfortably in front of a big TV. There are methods to get WASD support on a 360 -- but why bother, if you're too stubborn to give up your muscle memory, get the game on the 360 in the first place?


Part of me would prefer to say "screw the consoles" and just focus on the PC. However, I've heard nothing good about Windows Vista

Are you posting from 2006?

[Elusive]

quite honestly, the whole of Epic Games can kiss my ass.

On the other hand, I can't stand Hideo Kojima

I HATE Bioware and their games. I pirated Sonic Chronicles

Why put your dislike of figureheads before giving their games a try?


In the end, the whole 360 vs. PS3 discussion is only about which console sucks the least.

Well, that's a depressing way of looking at things.

[TheEdge]

FPS on consoles have always ben inferior to the PC. End of story. Neither a controller or Wii remote are as good as keyboard and mouse.

Part of me would prefer to say "screw the consoles" and just focus on the PC. However, I've heard nothing good about Windows Vista and I know, for a fact, that all factory-installed PC video cards are crap. I'd have to spend the cost of a console on decent video and sound cards, which doesn't strike me as worth the hassle.

As for a TV... I oculd probably get a decent PC LCD monitor instead of an HDTV, they tend to be cheaper. Assuming I can either find an appropriate VGA cable or a monitor with HDMI inputs. For that matter, I could use my LCD monitor ut I don'tknow if it's even HD compatible.

Wish you were here when Gamevets and I got into a huge debate a while back.

PC vs Consoles

It was one bloody battle.

[Joe Redifer]

The 360 has supported DivX and all the other BitTorrent-friendly formats out of the box since December 2007 :)

Does it? I am not too concerned about "bit torrents" as they can suck my unwiped ass, I'm more concerned about displaying original content that I create. Bit-torrents, LOL. Anyway, the PS3 allows me to play back high definition m2ts files whereas the 360 does not. I can create videos that have DTS sound and the PS3 can play them back whereas the 360 cannot. See where I am going here? Sure, I can just encode for Divx or WMV or something like that, but a decent-looking WMV file takes a while to encode and I've never really been impressed with DIVX nor do I like the way it encodes. If it would just support H.264 encoded MP4s it would be much better.

[snume]

I prefer the PS3 myself. Mainly because I'm afraid of the 360's failure rate. It is worse than any console in recent memory. Sure they have warranties, but what happens when your warranty is up?

The PS1 and PS2 may not have had the same "rate" of failures as the 360, but 3 years of warranty shouldn't be scoffed at. At least MS has done what Sony never did and admit they had/have a problem and took steps to rectify it. You prefer Sony's response? "Just buy another one"


Other pluses for PS3:

-- Full BC with the right model. It does suck that they took this out, but there is no 360 in existence with full backwards compatibility.

Really? This is a positive argument? With the right model? Which you can find new on the shelves where? Nowhere. You are selling a feature that is NOT available anymore. Nice try. I'll take a console that has SOME (and the ability to add more - which they are STILL doing - over the one that used to but doesn't but it was good when it did. Laughable.


-- No region lockout for PS3 games. Anything that doesn't come out in the US can be easily imported. "Asia versions" are reasonably priced and have an English manual.

Admittedly, a good feature, for some. This means nothing to me, but I'm glad the PS3 does it. But really, why would the 360 need it? What games does it have that are region exclusive that anyone wants? I would love to play Yakuza 1-3 though. Still not enough to sell me a PS3.


-- Microsoft charges out the wazoo for accessories/features. Even the Wii has wi-fi built-in, so why does MS want me to pay an extra $100 for the privilege? Plus, PS3 can use PC peripherals (including hard drives) whereas MS has a monopoly on theirs -- and their hard drives are way overpriced.

I agree on the hard drives, but lack of 3rd party peripherals doesn't bother me. Do you have a bunch of 3rd party controllers for your Genesis or Saturn? Or do you prefer the original Sega ones? I do. I'll take MS's 1st party ones any day.


-- Free online. People say 360 has a "better" online service, but really, who cares? If I want to play online, I merely need it to work. I especially don't like how MS went out of their way to prevent tunneling software from working.

Your opinion. and if you think that all Live is is the PSN with a cost, than you obviously haven't used it. I actually LIKE the fact that they went out of their way to SECURE their network. Thank you MS. And it DOES work. I have had no network issues. I'm sure there have been some, but I guess I've been lucky.


-- USB. The 360 has USB ports, but they don't actually work. MS blocks developers from allowing the use of a mouse and/or keyboard. Command & Conquer supported a mouse on Playstation and Saturn, but C&C3 can't on 360. WTF is up with that? PS3 can use USB gamepads such as the Saturn USB pad, while the 360 cannot.

Did the Saturn or PS1 use PS/2 mice? I seem to recall that you needed to buy a proprietary mouse to use it for Saturn (not sure about PS1). Would be nice to have the option, tho. I did get a PS/2 adaptor for my DC so I could play UT. Worked Great. Have you played Halo Wars on the 360? Great control scheme for a RTS on a console. Check it out sometime.

[Joe Redifer]

if you think that all Live is is the PSN with a cost, than you obviously haven't used it.
My Xbox360 came with a free month o' gold I think. Plus I've used a trial code for 3 free days here and there. I really didn't notice any differences. If there were, then they certainly weren't enough for me to excitedly whip out my wallet. I remember the proprietary headset breaking very easily. For the PS3 I just use my old SOCOM USB headset and it works perfectly. I forgot I even had it and went out and bought a regular one, but fortunately I was able to take it back unopened once I realized that I had the thing.

I agree with j_factor about the USB thing. I can hook up hard drives, flash drives, SD cards, controllers, whathaveyou to the PS3's USB drive and they work. Need to replace your system for whatever reason? Simply backup all of your crap to a connected USB drive and then restore it on the new PS3 or whatever. All of your games saves, profiles and crap like that will have transferred over. Makes putting in a bigger hard drive a snap!

[j_factor]

The PS1 and PS2 may not have had the same "rate" of failures as the 360, but 3 years of warranty shouldn't be scoffed at. At least MS has done what Sony never did and admit they had/have a problem and took steps to rectify it. You prefer Sony's response? "Just buy another one"

No I do not prefer Sony's response with the PS1 and PS2 (especially the "turn it upside down" thing), but those systems are not part of this discussion.


Really? This is a positive argument? With the right model? Which you can find new on the shelves where? Nowhere. You are selling a feature that is NOT available anymore. Nice try. I'll take a console that has SOME (and the ability to add more - which they are STILL doing - over the one that used to but doesn't but it was good when it did. Laughable.

You can get a 60GB PS3 used. It exists, and it's the one I own. There is no 360 unit, anywhere, that has full backwards compatibility. I certainly would have preferred that Sony keep BC in all PS3 models, but at least you have the option of being able to get it. Having them out there, even if they're not available anymore, is preferable to not having the ability to have it at all.

And as far as I'm aware, MS hasn't updated BC on the 360 since 2007. Doesn't seem like they're adding them anymore.


Admittedly, a good feature, for some. This means nothing to me, but I'm glad the PS3 does it. But really, why would the 360 need it? What games does it have that are region exclusive that anyone wants? I would love to play Yakuza 1-3 though. Still not enough to sell me a PS3.

360 has a few shmups that didn't come out here. PS3 has a non-download version of Siren: Blood Curse available outside of North America, as well as Initial D: Extreme Stage. I'm sure there are more, I haven't really looked deeply into the import scene yet.


I agree on the hard drives, but lack of 3rd party peripherals doesn't bother me. Do you have a bunch of 3rd party controllers for your Genesis or Saturn? Or do you prefer the original Sega ones? I do. I'll take MS's 1st party ones any day.

I prefer the Sega ones because Sega made kick-ass controllers. MS doesn't necessarily. A great example is Street Fighter IV. The 360 controller sucks ass for that game. 360 has some decent options for it, but it's limited compared to the controllers you can use on PS3. With PS3 you can get a Saturn USB pad, a USB Virtua Stick, a MAME controller, or just about anything else.

It's not just the controllers, either. You can use practically any USB device on the PS3, and if it doesn't have enough USB ports, you can even hook up a standard USB hub. I really like how with PS3, you can basically do what you want with the system.


Your opinion. and if you think that all Live is is the PSN with a cost, than you obviously haven't used it. I actually LIKE the fact that they went out of their way to SECURE their network. Thank you MS. And it DOES work. I have had no network issues. I'm sure there have been some, but I guess I've been lucky.

I've used Live. I'm not complaining about its quality. You're right, it's not just PSN with a cost -- but personally, I do not give one iota of a damn about all their extra features. What if I prefer a basic, free service? Maybe I don't play online games that much and I don't feel a paid, premium service should be my only option. At least on the original Xbox there were alternative programs you could download -- but MS has gone out of their way to eliminate alternatives with the 360.


Did the Saturn or PS1 use PS/2 mice? I seem to recall that you needed to buy a proprietary mouse to use it for Saturn (not sure about PS1). Would be nice to have the option, tho. I did get a PS/2 adaptor for my DC so I could play UT. Worked Great. Have you played Halo Wars on the 360? Great control scheme for a RTS on a console. Check it out sometime.

You're correct that Saturn and PS1 both had proprietary mice -- but the 360 doesn't even have that. Even Genesis had a mouse. 360 can't even do everything Genesis can do.

I haven't played Halo Wars. I have heard good things about its controls, but I've also heard that it's basically just Dune II with updated graphics.

[snume]

Well, I basically think it's just a matter of opinion on most if not all of the factors. And we would all agree that one should try out and use both systems before making the big ($300-500) decision. You would or should with any big purchase. And you could say that we are just trying to remove the need for someone to have to do all that, but from the varying degrees of responses, fanboyism (guilty here), etc one just needs to check it out for themselves.

I am also wondering if any of you PS3 owners have experienced Home yet? Or if you're looking forward to it.

And why haven't any of you, who have 360's, mentioned the ability to stream movies over the 360 using Netflix? I hear it's pretty cheap and it works really good and the content is being expanded all the time. I hear that the alternatives on the PS3 (online services, not streaming your own content from your own PC, etc) are not nearly as good, ie they run like shit (Hulu is one I've heard bad things about). I don't own a PS3 so I have no option there and Netflix isn't available in Canada (and we have no streaming alternative other then MS marketplace). I'd like to hear your experiences/thoughts.

[FoxHound]

Netflix works great on the 360, I use that feature alot. I have rented a few movies on the PS3, Uh and it takes forever to DL and thats wired up to my router. You do have the option on the PS3 to play the movie while Downloading, but it often stops as it needs to buffer and will play again. I constantly will need to pause for it to catch up about4-5 times in the movie. Both systems take some time to DL a demo, but the PS3 is so slow in comparison to the 360 in that aspect.

[Diosoth]

Are you posting from 2006?

No. 2009. And everyone I've personally talked to that has used Vista has told me it's no good. The local computer repair outlet hates Vista so much they won't use it on their own computers.

[acdc]

go for the xbox more games

ps 3 not all the games from the ps 1 and 2 are working on it
but that something that the origenal xbox games also do on the xbox360
but there s a list to see wich one work and wich one not

only gonna buy a ps3 if i say if there s a new twisted metal is coming out for it

[Diosoth]

Why put your dislike of figureheads before giving their games a try?

If the head of a game company wants to make me out to be a criminal for buying and selling used copies of games, then he doesn't get my business, especially since I might end up selling the used copy once I'm done with it. Therefore, they don't deserve my business. I won't even pirate the games of companies that have this point of view.

Bioware's different. I just think the company is staffed with chimpanzees at 1000 typewriters, because every bit of dialog on Sonic Chronicles was awful, and the gameplay was mediocre. I'm sad that Free Radical had to close down from the economy, but an underdone, overhyped company like Bioware keeps going.

[snume]

No. 2009. And everyone I've personally talked to that has used Vista has told me it's no good. The local computer repair outlet hates Vista so much they won't use it on their own computers.

I'm talking to you personally. I have Vista on 2 of my computers at home and I say it's good. One is even refurbished and it still runs great. I take it from your comments that you haven't used it yourself?

[Elusive]

No. 2009. And everyone I've personally talked to that has used Vista has told me it's no good. The local computer repair outlet hates Vista so much they won't use it on their own computers.

Have you used it yourself, or are you talking to the 'I AM IN CHARGE OF MY COMPUTER' types? In the days where vendors slapped 'Vista Capable' stickers on machines with 512Mb of RAM and graphics card manufacturers absolutely refused to fix their drivers for months you'd have a point; what people don't get is that Vista is not XP with a shiny new interface. If you apply the same tweaks to Vista that you have to do to a fresh Windows XP install, you will cripple the machine!


If the head of a game company wants to make me out to be a criminal for buying and selling used copies of games, then he doesn't get my business, especially since I might end up selling the used copy once I'm done with it. Therefore, they don't deserve my business. I won't even pirate the games of companies that have this point of view.

Fair enough. Although you are certainly a criminal for stealing games, more than you are 'maybe' a criminal for 'maybe' selling the game in the future :P

[snume]

He doesn't say you are a criminal for buying or selling used games ... yet. I'd be willing to bet that ALL publishers are against used games sales. They cut into their possible sales. It's a business. They may not be looking at it so hard if piracy wasn't so rampant. It's always the ones that DON'T pirate that end up paying in the end. It's also why they loke certain consoles more, like the 360, that are harder to pirate or where it's less prevalent than PC's.

[AD2101]

He doesn't say you are a criminal for buying or selling used games ... yet. I'd be willing to bet that ALL publishers are against used games sales. They cut into their possible sales. It's a business.

Eh I wouldn't say so. Of course my perspective is pretty skewed since I work at a GameStop, but you really don't start seeing used copies of a particular title until after a good month, let alone is it to the point where you can just walk in and immediately find a used copy of a particular game. For Fable II for example, it took until sometime in January for us to have more than 1 copy in at a given time. New sales for that game dropped off long before then, and currently my store has 2 copies of it used. When COD4 came out, used copies were rarely seen until last April when I transferred to the mall.

Occasionally you'll get the oddball that turns in a new game shortly after its release (How I got Killzone 2) but usually people will buy the new game, possibly beat it, and let it sit on their shelf a good month and a half before the bother to trade it back in, and a lot of the time the trade goes towards a new title anyways.

[Kollision]

I did not contribute to this discussion, mainly because I have no experience on both consoles (which I own by the way).

But....

This is at least funny:
http://uk.gamespot.com/users/tiggerboy/show_blog_entry.php?topic_id=m-100-25578816&om_act=convert&om_clk=soapbox&tag=soapbox;subject;2

[17daysolderthannes]

I work for a local Play N Trade

I exclusively do console repair

XBOX 360 is the biggest piece of shit ever on the planet, a $1.50 Wal-Mart made in China alarm clock has better build quality.

[/thread]

The original XBOX was good because it was extremely rushed and built with all off-the-shelf parts like the Genesis, therefore making it the sum of tried and true components (at the expense of making it huge and heavy as a bastard). The XBOX 360 was also rushed, but made of rushed custom parts and many corners were cut to fit it all in the dainty little case. There are so many possible points of failure in an XBOX 360 I almost expect a problem every time I turn one on. I have repaired RROD on systems as new as a year old (maybe newer), don't believe the bullshit, they are still using x-clamps and as long as they do, they will get RROD. The drive problems are mostly due to asshats standing up their systems vertically (STOP THAT!) and knocking them over or bumping them with a game in the drive, effectively scratching the discs. The drives also commonly have spindles that fail and seize up, keeping the disc from spinning and therefore rendering it useless. Even the flash chips fail in the 360 drives from time to time. Come to think of it, I can't think of a single part on the XBOX 360 that hasn't failed in some epic way due only to the fault of Microsoft.

Oh, and that whole "PS2 disc read error" crap is nonsense, abuse is the #1 cause of that. Every PS2 I've had come in with disc read error was either filthy or showed signs of physical damage (dropping, etc.) or both. I've had mine since a year after launch and it has hundreds if not thousands of hours of PS1, PS2, and DVD playback (if I wasn't playing it, my sister was watching movies on it) and it still boots up games first try, every time. Then again, it has not been moved, bumped, dropped, or otherwise abused in its life. I will admit, the PS2 is a bit fragile in terms of physical abuse, but it is nowhere near the epic failure of the XBOX 360 that can never be touched and still fail.

[17daysolderthannes]

He doesn't say you are a criminal for buying or selling used games ... yet. I'd be willing to bet that ALL publishers are against used games sales. They cut into their possible sales. It's a business. They may not be looking at it so hard if piracy wasn't so rampant. It's always the ones that DON'T pirate that end up paying in the end. It's also why they loke certain consoles more, like the 360, that are harder to pirate or where it's less prevalent than PC's.

game companies have taken steps to prevent piracy since the 2600. Why do you think every game console had a custom cartridge? to combat piracy, thats why, otherwise games would've come on floppy discs (like the Famicom Disc System) or some other inexpensive standard format. While in America the bootleg scene is pretty small and underground (talking retail, not torrents), in some markets (like China and South America) you almost find more pirates than authentic games. What pisses me off the most about this crap is that it makes the consoles difficult to repair. You can't just put a drive in a 360, you first have to change the flash chips out, if the flash chip is bad, you're fucked. Allegedly you can flash another chip and install it instead, but I believe that requires illegally ripped data to accomplish. You also can't simply replace a bad hard drive with another laptop drive (thats all it is inside that form fitting case) because of the special lockouts it has on it.

[Metal_Sonic]

I work for a local Play N Trade

I exclusively do console repair

XBOX 360 is the biggest piece of shit ever on the planet, a $1.50 Wal-Mart made in China alarm clock has better build quality.

Didn't Microsoft come out with a new chipset called Falcon or Jasper that fixed the issues? Still, the 360 sure is a piece of shit.

[Kollision]

Oh, and that whole "PS2 disc read error" crap is nonsense, abuse is the #1 cause of that. Every PS2 I've had come in with disc read error was either filthy or showed signs of physical damage (dropping, etc.) or both. I've had mine since a year after launch and it has hundreds if not thousands of hours of PS1, PS2, and DVD playback (if I wasn't playing it, my sister was watching movies on it) and it still boots up games first try, every time.
Then you're a very lucky fellow, I'll give you that.
PS2 hardware is also shit, from my exp so far even more than the Xbox 360.

[17daysolderthannes]

Didn't Microsoft come out with a new chipset called Falcon or Jasper that fixed the issues? Still, the 360 sure is a piece of shit.

yeah, you believe it, wait a year.


Then you're a very lucky fellow, I'll give you that.
PS2 hardware is also shit, from my exp so far even more than the Xbox 360.

not even close. PS2s just wear out because PS2 is the only game system in the past 10 years worth playing. I own more games for PS2 than any other system and the number will probably continue to grow for years to come.

I have never seen a PS2 brought in for repairs that looked like the problem was Sony's fault. On the other hand, about 75% or more of the XBOX 360s brought in are absolutely pristine inside and out. The only PS2 read problem that was genuinely Sony's fault was the extemely early PS2s that weren't compatible with double layer DVDs, which Sony offered to replace for a while. Other than that, its all wear and tear from years of use and poor maintenance (getting it dirty and throwing it around). The simple fact is that the PS2 is an inexpensive system, and like all inexpensive systems it finds its way into the hands of people that don't give a shit about or take care of what they own, and they subsequently get fucked up. Hell, I've fixed PS2s that had been so tightly wedged in an entertainment center that the back had warped where the fan was. And you know what? it worked with just a lense cleaning, except it couldn't play blue label games because the drive was so warped that the spindle couldn't grab it tight enough to spin it 24X. On the other hand, I've had NEW XBOX 360 drives that won't fucking work.

[Rassilon]

I had both, and played the 360 almost none. I sold it last year, and dont miss it one bit.
To be blunt, the (exclusive) games on the 360 are complete crap. Lots of hype, nothing but shit.

and MS STILL hasnt fixed a damn thing about the hardware problems.
All the new revisions have been going to smaller die size chips, but guess what, those lower heat chips come with SMALLER heatsinks in order to cut costs, so the overall effect is close to no improvement in cooling.


this generation IS pretty disappointing overall, but the PS3 has some really good games, the hardware is nice: quiet and reliable, there are more 3rd party peripherals (and are usually cheaper and/or wireless), the HD can be upgraded with any 2.5" SATA drive, online play is FREE (and it works every bit as well as xbox live).

The 360 however, is the worst console i have EVER owned, from hardware AND software standpoints (yes, worse than the 3D0).

[17daysolderthannes]

I had both, and played the 360 almost none. I sold it last year, and dont miss it one bit.
To be blunt, the (exclusive) games on the 360 are complete crap. Lots of hype, nothing but shit.

and MS STILL hasnt fixed a damn thing about the hardware problems.
All the new revisions have been going to smaller die size chips, but guess what, those lower heat chips come with SMALLER heatsinks in order to cut costs, so the overall effect is close to no improvement in cooling.


this generation IS pretty disappointing overall, but the PS3 has some really good games, the hardware is nice: quiet and reliable, there are more 3rd party peripherals (and are usually cheaper and/or wireless), the HD can be upgraded with any 2.5" SATA drive, online play is FREE (and it works every bit as well as xbox live).

The 360 however, is the worst console i have EVER owned, from hardware AND software standpoints (yes, worse than the 3D0).

Actually the heatsinks are the same size, they never made them smaller, though they did remove the heat pipe from the CPU heatsink and then added one to the graphics heat sink. The problem isn't primarily from the size of the heatsink (though the graphics one is LAUGHABLY small), but rather from the shitty x-clamps that don't secure it well, allowing it to separate from the board and make the chip quickly overheat. A heatsink only works if it can properly conduct heat from the chip and then have the heat removed via convection to the ambient air. An improperly fastened heat sink actually can act as an insulator and just make things worse.

As for software, I can tell you right now the only games I ever play on XBOX 360 are Skate, Skate 2, Street Fighter IV, Street Fighter HD Remix, I want to try Mirror's Edge, and Forza 2. All of those except Forza are available on PS3, and GRID is supposedly much better anyway. If I was to own either one, it would surely be a PS3.

[gamevet]

The PS1 and PS2 may not have had the same "rate" of failures as the 360, but 3 years of warranty shouldn't be scoffed at. At least MS has done what Sony never did and admit they had/have a problem and took steps to rectify it. You prefer Sony's response? "Just buy another one"


The 3 year warranty doesn't cover everything. If you go to the MS's official Xbox site, you can check the warranty left on your console. Mine is going to expire in November of this year and I bought my Elite in November of 2007. The 3 year warrantly only applies to consoles that get the 3 lights in the RROD.

My 360 lasted 14 months and the problems started with the DVD drive and the system eventually RROD with the power supply failing. I'd sent in my Elite, got somebody elses system and didn't find out about the power supply failure, until I had another 360 shipped. I ended up paying $12 to ship it UPS (MS wouldn't accept another shipper) and went without a functioning 360 for over a month.

If I have the option of buying a game on the 360 or PS3, I'm buying it on the PS3. I really enjoyed playing the 360 because of achievements, Xbox LIVE and the comfort of the controller (beyond the crappy D-pad) because of how the controller feels in my hands. Yet, I'm pretty wary of buying games for a system that is pretty much a ticking time bomb, with multiple triggers ready to fire it off.

[Mel]

I had both, and played the 360 almost none. I sold it last year, and dont miss it one bit.
To be blunt, the (exclusive) games on the 360 are complete crap. Lots of hype, nothing but shit.

and MS STILL hasnt fixed a damn thing about the hardware problems.
All the new revisions have been going to smaller die size chips, but guess what, those lower heat chips come with SMALLER heatsinks in order to cut costs, so the overall effect is close to no improvement in cooling.


this generation IS pretty disappointing overall, but the PS3 has some really good games, the hardware is nice: quiet and reliable, there are more 3rd party peripherals (and are usually cheaper and/or wireless), the HD can be upgraded with any 2.5" SATA drive, online play is FREE (and it works every bit as well as xbox live).

The 360 however, is the worst console i have EVER owned, from hardware AND software standpoints (yes, worse than the 3D0).


I totally dissagree. I own both. And the ps3 is an expensive peice of junk as far as i'm concerned. 30 for a hidef movie is a bit much. The 360 arcade has a ton of games I enjoy and hte few games that are next gen i actually play look great on the 360.

So my 360 gets tons of attention, particularly with shmups, and fighters, and the ps3 has been a glorified ps1 to hdtv adapter. That's all I've found interesting in it is that fact that it plays my ps1 games. If it was still possible to play ps2's on them then I'd be far happier with it, but for right now the 360 wins out in my mind. So much so I'm considering selling hte ps3 to a friend.

[RowdyRodimus]

This is my opinion. Go ahead and get a 360 now. It has a great library of games and the XBL Arcade is just icing on the cake. Yes, you do have the chance of getting the RROD (I did after a year) but they do fix or replace the system very quickly (mine was back in less than a week with a new console).

However, when the price goes down and the library is larger get a PS3. I'm just waiting for the DC MMORPG to get one. My brother has one, so technically I do have one since we live together.

Either way, you can't go wrong. It's just that the price is more attractive for the 360 along with it's lineup of games. I also had a Wii and got rid of it in two months, it just wasn't what they made it out to be.

[Joe Redifer]

30 for a hidef movie is a bit much..

Where are YOU doing your shopping? I think the very most I have ever paid for a Blu-ray movie was about $26 or so. Usually you can find them for a lot less with free shipping.

[Chilly Willy]

Yeah. WalMart even has a selection of Blu-Rays for $15 and even $10. For example, Stargate on BD is only $10.

[The Jackal]

The 360 has problems, but it still beats the crap that is the PS3 into the dirt anyday.

[Joe Redifer]

If you say so...

[Puffy2k316]

The consoles this generation really have no identity as far as their game libraries (except the wii but this thread isn't about the wii). There's really only a handful of games on either side that you can't get on the other system. So, unless you really like Halo or Metal Gear Solid you're better off going for the best hardware which is far and away the PS3.

[The Jackal]

I agree with your statement, Jackal. All hail sexy Jackal!

Woah, calm down there!

[Sudo]

The 360 has problems, but it still beats the crap that is the PS3 into the dirt anyday.

Don't be such an ignorant fanboy. Both systems have a great library of exclusive games.

[The Jackal]

I'm not a fanboy - I just hate the PS3. I've had both systems, and for me, the 360 was the best.

And please tell me - what great game library does the PS3 have?!!

[Chilly Willy]

I'm not a fanboy - I just hate the PS3. I've had both systems, and for me, the 360 was the best.

And please tell me - what great game library does the PS3 have?!!

That whole post is brimming with fanboy-ism. You just aren't up to admitting your disease. ;)

[The Jackal]

I don't have a 360 anymore. When it came down to both systems, I liked the 360 more.

The only thing I'll admit to being a fanboy to is my Sega Mega Drive...

[Chilly Willy]

The only thing I'll admit to being a fanboy to is my Sega Mega Drive...

Well that's only as it SHOULD be! :D :cool:

[Joe Redifer]

I'm not a fanboy - I just hate the PS3.

You make my brain hurt!

[The Jackal]

You make my brain hurt!

And I do that ....how??

[Joe Redifer]

The extreme contradiction in a single sentence!

[AD2101]

And please tell me - what great game library does the PS3 have?!!

Are you posting from 2007 or something?

That argument held up for a while but is totally null and void now. Its ok though, I at least I got a laugh out of it. (Almost) Everything worth having on 360 is also on PS3 unless its something first party. Thinking about it for a second Left 4 Dead is the only game I wish existed on the PS3 that isn't already on it or will be on it.

[Diosoth]

Sony seems reluctant to do a price drop. Retailers insist it's coming, analysts believe it, even Microsoft seems ready, but Sony? Nah. Their statesemt seems to be, "what, do you want it for FREE or something? There will be no price drop."

No price drop, then I'm not getting one.

Browsing Craigslist, I could get a decent 360 with a HDD for $200 or possibly a bit less. However, I'd honestly prefer to get a new retail console to ensure I have the proper warranties and such, but even $300 new isn't too bad.

[j_factor]

Sony will be announcing new pricing at the GDC. Supposedly, the 80GB model will be $399 and come with both Resistance and Motorstorm, and they will reintroduce the 40GB model priced at $299.

[Diosoth]

Sony will be announcing new pricing at the GDC. Supposedly, the 80GB model will be $399 and come with both Resistance and Motorstorm, and they will reintroduce the 40GB model priced at $299.

Here's hoping the 40GB model isn't stripped down in some way. Though all I'd expect is just a version of the current model with a 40GB HDD. Eh, anything I'd be likely to download would be PS1 games I don't own. I doubt save game files take up TOO much room and I oppose DLC for retail games solely on principle(since it feels like I'm not even buying a complete game anymore).

While Resitance might tempt me I couldn't give a damn about Motorstorm, so I'd be unlikely to shell out for it.

I'll have to keep watch. No price drop = no purchase though.

[GEN ESIS GAMER]

The 360 has way more games than PS3 if you want a blue ray player go buy a PS3 if you want a gaming ssystem buy a 360.

[Baloo]

To be honest, I prefer Wii to both, but when it comes to these two, 360 definitley. Cheaper price, better design, Better online capabilities, downloadable classic games, and almost all of the exclusives on PS3 have been bought by Microsoft to be put on 360. Especially PS3's big ones, I.E. Final Fantasy, Kingdom Hearts 3, and the like.

I really do think that if Sony doesn't get some really good exclusives and a price drop fast, this system is going to tank big time.

[Joe Redifer]

Better design??? This is the 360 you are talking about. It is a far inferior design in every aspect!

[Diosoth]

I had a Wii, actually. Metroid Prime 3 was nice, I preferred Twilight Princess with Gamecube controls. I sold it when I realized it was using it as a Gamecube 90% of the time. Nothing's really come out in the meantime that's made me regret selling it.

[Baloo]

Better design??? This is the 360 you are talking about. It is a far inferior design in every aspect!

Hardware sucks, but I should've been clearer. The outside looks nicer and the controller is loads better than the PS3 one, which has sucked since PS1 days, and still sucks.

[Knuckle Duster]

PS3 needs a price drop & LBP bundle for me to adopt one. It seems like a no brainer. That game looks like it's balls deep in excellence.

[Joe Redifer]

You'll only get it if LBP is bundled with it? They can't bundle a specific game for every individual! I won't get an Xbox 360 unless Test Drive Unlimited is bundled with it SO THERE!

[The Jackal]

Better design??? This is the 360 you are talking about. It is a far inferior design in every aspect!

You're a Sony fanboy, aren't you?

[Joe Redifer]

Just for this generation. Last generation I was more of an Xbox fanboy.

[The Jackal]

To each of he's own, i suppose...

[Diosoth]

I'm not a company fanboy, usually, because it's rare that a company can actually hold my loyalty. I find every large company releases crap I don't want or is run by idiots. They're lucky to get my money to begin with.

I think Running With Scissors is the only company I can claim loyalty to, and all they make are the Postal games. Though they made a LOT of other stuff under the old name(a lot of the NES Sesame Street titles, and they made the Spy vs Spy game. Yep, same guys who went on to make Postal.)

[richardavies]

Thanks to multiformat gaming, both systems game library's are practically identical anyway. Just list what is exclusive on each system then see which is best.
(point out anything were missing)

PS3
Uncharted
LBP
Motorstorm
Killzone
Resistance
everybodys golf
Eye of judgement
Gran turismo
Haze
Heavenly sword
God of war 3
Heavy rain
Infamous
Metal gear 4
360

Gears of war
Fable 2
Kameo
Lost odyssey
Lost planet
Viva pinata
Mass effect
Project gotham
Alan wake
Left 4 dead
Prey
Halo
Crackdown




Im a 360 owner and to be honest now I can see a list of them both up the PS3 doesn't look as bad as I thought.

[gamevet]

Your list is missing Valkyria Chronicles, Disgae 3 and Wipeout HD for the PS3. It's also missing Culdcept Saga and REZ HD for the 360.

[gamevet]

Hardware sucks, but I should've been clearer. The outside looks nicer and the controller is loads better than the PS3 one, which has sucked since PS1 days, and still sucks.

I like the overall look of the PS3 better (the 360 looks like a modded PC) and the dongle force-feedback of the Dual-Shock 3 is more effective than the rumble feature of the 360 controller. The 360 controller layout is better though.

[17daysolderthannes]

hey, to pour some gasoline on the RROD fire:

today my coworker, who always defends the 360 and claims hardware failures are consumer's fault, got the "audio, no video" problem, lol. For those of you not in the know, that is one and the same as the infamous 3L RROD (meaning it is from the graphics chip desoldering, but it just so happens it doesn't do it enough to trip the 3L RROD). And no, its not his video cables, this problem gives a distinct flicker of "snow" right before the start up "fooom" sound clip is played.

I'm only going to say this one more time:

EVERY SINGLE XBOX 360 WILL GET RED RING OF DEATH SOONER OR LATER

if you want to buy one, you might as well just shoot yourself.

Now I know early PS3s have been failing (specifically the 60GB backwards compatible ones), but that is a very small number compared to EVERY XBOX 360. This is why I say "fuck it" and stick with the ol PS2, the best single console ever (especially including compilation discs).

[Iron Lizard]

I know a lot of people who are still playing their PS2s.

[17daysolderthannes]

I know a lot of people who are still playing their PS2s.

FWIW, its the best selling system at my Play N Trade, I think some of that has to do with the giveaway $70 price tag.

[Iron Lizard]

I'm enjoying the cheap ass games right now, tons of RPgs, compilations, awesome weird randomness like Katamari, and so on.

[TheEdge]

hey, to pour some gasoline on the RROD fire:

today my coworker, who always defends the 360 and claims hardware failures are consumer's fault, got the "audio, no video" problem, lol. For those of you not in the know, that is one and the same as the infamous 3L RROD (meaning it is from the graphics chip desoldering, but it just so happens it doesn't do it enough to trip the 3L RROD). And no, its not his video cables, this problem gives a distinct flicker of "snow" right before the start up "fooom" sound clip is played.

I'm only going to say this one more time:

EVERY SINGLE XBOX 360 WILL GET RED RING OF DEATH SOONER OR LATER

if you want to buy one, you might as well just shoot yourself.

Now I know early PS3s have been failing (specifically the 60GB backwards compatible ones), but that is a very small number compared to EVERY XBOX 360. This is why I say "fuck it" and stick with the ol PS2, the best single console ever (especially including compilation discs).

:rofl:

Has anyone seen the RROD review on the Classic Game Room Youtube site?

Its hilarious.

[nissling]

My brother and I have both an Ps3 and an Xbox 360. Or had a 360 becuse it's need a repair now (Red Ring Of Death). I like the Ps3 more then the 360, but I just bought it for Metal Gear Solid 4 and it was it worth.

But to be serious about the Blu-Ray player on the Ps3, my Ps3 have never played a Blu-Ray film even if I have about ten movies on Blu-Ray. The reason? Becuse I already have a real Blu-Ray player since a half year ago and I bought the Ps3 for almost two months ago. So to be serious, when I already have a real Blu-Ray player, I have no need for the Blu-Ray player on my Ps3. But I agree with Joe Redifer anyway, Blu-Ray is awesome.

But if it would be that Ps3 sells more then the 360 becuse it has Blu-Ray (since it's pretty unusal after all to have a Blu-Ray player), it's a bit too late for the 360 to do something about its media player since HD DVD has been dead in a year.

EDIT: I'd forgot to say that I love Little Big Planet! :D