Wii price drops to $199 this weekend. [Archive]

Christuserloeser

09-23-2009, 04:50 PM

A fascist is someone who believes in or promotes fascism.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fascist_(epithet)

In this sense, the word fascist is intended to mean "oppressive", "intolerant", "chauvinist", "genocidal", "dictatorial", "racist", or "aggressive" – all concepts that are at least loosely inspired by the ideology of actual fascism. One might accuse an inconveniently placed police roadblock as being a "fascist tactic" or an overly authoritarian teacher as being "a total fascist". Terms like Nazi and Hitlerite, are often used (correctly or incorrectly) in similar contexts.

- I wasn't 110% serious. But I indeed was interested what TheEdge would think that Fascism meant.

I don't see how any of the comments about the Wii being over-priced and a disgrace to the SNES as being "fascist".

Me neither. - The initial post where I was referring to "you guys" (mainly aimed towards TheEdge who posted twice above me and also immediately replied to my post as if I was adressing him directly) as "Wii fascists" was "if I'm a conservative gamer" (that's what I usually would consider myself, but I might as well be utterly wrong with my self perception), "[then, and only then] you guys are [...] Wii fascists."

Melf

09-23-2009, 04:52 PM

gamevet

09-23-2009, 04:53 PM

N64 was sweet, platformer heaven.

It was an Oasis in the middle of a desert. You were just happy to have water.

The SNES and Genesis were racing, sports, RPGs, SRPGs, platformer, shooter, fighter, puzzle, racing and adventure heaven.

The N64 was like the commercial with the girl on the bicycle in the center of the box. The guy tells her she can ride it, but only inside the designated area.

Baloo

09-23-2009, 05:51 PM

I wouldn't pay $100 less for that console which is pretty much an insult to anyone that supported Nintendo for all of these years.

It's bad enough that Nintendo followed up one of the greatest consoles of all-time the Gamecube.

http://ghostisland.files.wordpress.com/2009/03/lolwut.jpg

The whole reason for the Wii Bashing is that all of you are hardcore gamers, which is why you can't find anything on the system.

It's the only new-gen system I own myself, and although I don't get much use out of it (especially by myself) when friends come over I'll play it.

I do want to get NiGHTS and Wii Sports Resort for it though, maybe that will rekindle my time with the system. Wii Sports Resort I did really like a lot, a lot of the games on there were really fun. Also looking forward to New Super Mario Bros. Wii. As for the games I have:

Smash Bros got stale and the online sucks.
Mario Kart is good but not alone.
Super Mario Galaxy just got old for some reason.
And both Wii Play and Wii Sports suck.
Disney Th!nk Fast is too kiddy.

Yeah, it's a very casual system, not meant for people like you and I. There's just not many 1-player games on the system.

InternalPrimate

09-23-2009, 06:17 PM

I bought one last week on impulse, as my daughter has been pestering me for one for months. With Wiiware and the few decent games that interest me, it's a decent 3rd system to have. I can't imagine anyone having only a Wii though.

That was my exact reasoning when trying to explain to my brother why the Wii will end up outselling PS3 and Xbox 360 combined. It's most people's second system, meant as a crazy alternative to the 360 or PS3. On top of that, it's being bought by millions of people who only have a fleeting interest in video games and don't care if it's not an HD system.

I like mine, but it definitely doesn't get as much attention as my 360 or DS. It does, however, get a lot more attention than my PS3. You just have to search out the gems.

HOD: Overkill, for example, has been a pleasant surprise.

17daysolderthannes

09-23-2009, 06:18 PM

N64 was sweet, platformer heaven.

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_3jxKr7BlqzE/RktHo9TJhsI/AAAAAAAAA_A/w1PDS_Emcdg/s200/jaw+droppers.jpg

you mean all of those awkward, blurry, boring, and generic platformers with cameras operated by an ape with Parkinson's? Mario 64 was tolerable...and that's about it.

Also, where was all of this anti-Wii support when I was getting blasted by the peanut gallery in the Natal thread?

In a related story, I just bought Blast Works for Wii hoping for an innovative shooter romp with an awesome ship customizing tool. If anyone needs a coaster, I've got one. FML, the Wii is just a money pit: I keep trying to find a game to redeem it, and keep getting slammed and put even deeper into buyer's remorse.

17daysolderthannes

09-23-2009, 06:23 PM

That was my exact reasoning when trying to explain to my brother why the Wii will end up outselling PS3 and Xbox 360 combined. It's most people's second system, meant as a crazy alternative to the 360 or PS3. On top of that, it's being bought by millions of people who only have a fleeting interest in video games and don't care if it's not an HD system.

This is why I bought the Wii initially. Historically, systems priced below $300 (in this case almost half the price of the competitors) tend to sell ridiculous amounts of units. Hell, the PS2 is still selling like hotcakes even though the only games really coming out anymore is Guitar Hero-type games and a handful of last minute Japanese translations or retro compilations. I took this high-sales logic and assumed that, like the PS2, the best selling system of its generation, would lead to a smorgasbord of great games for the Wii. Boy was I wrong. Toy Story is coming out with a new game, guess what genre defying powerhouse it is going to be? ANOTHER FUCKING MINI GAME COMPILATION! I'd rather play Toy Story for Genesis any day of the year. FML, the Wii is a black hole of shit. There are only tolerable Wii games, no good ones.

kool kitty89

09-23-2009, 06:27 PM

Baloo, read his statement more carefully:
It's bad enough that Nintendo followed up one of the greatest consoles of all-time with the N64 and then the Gamecube. It's as if they had some secret plan to rid themselves of actual gamers.

By "greatest console" he meant SNES, with N64 and GC being dissapointing by comparison.

The whole reason for the Wii Bashing is that all of you are hardcore gamers, which is why you can't find anything on the system.

It's the only new-gen system I own myself, and although I don't get much use out of it (especially by myself) when friends come over I'll play it.

I do want to get NiGHTS and Wii Sports Resort for it though, maybe that will rekindle my time with the system. Wii Sports Resort I did really like a lot, a lot of the games on there were really fun. Also looking forward to New Super Mario Bros. Wii. As for the games I have:

Smash Bros got stale and the online sucks.
Mario Kart is good but not alone.
Super Mario Galaxy just got old for some reason.
And both Wii Play and Wii Sports suck.
Disney Th!nk Fast is too kiddy.

Yeah, it's a very casual system, not meant for people like you and I. There's just not many 1-player games on the system.

Yeah, it's our only current gen console as well and it gets more use with Gamecube games than Wii ones. I do definitely prefer Brawl to Melee though, but I think I still like the original best.

Wow! Now it's only twice as expensive as it should be! :p

Yeah, when I first saw this thread I was going to make some comment on how it's now the same price as the GameCube (with nearly idntical hardware) was at launch, but then I thought about how it'd probably turn into a remble and taking inflation into account and such. Still, it's probably the first console that's been sold for profit (or significant profit at least) since the PlayStation launched. (and they must be making a decent profit considering the hardware, plus the accessories) If they can sell it at these prices, it doesn't make buisness sense to drop it.

I bought one last week on impulse, as my daughter has been pestering me for one for months. With Wiiware and the few decent games that interest me, it's a decent 3rd system to have. I can't imagine anyone having only a Wii though.

Ony console as in ony current-gen console, or only game system at all?

It was an Oasis in the middle of a desert. You were just happy to have water.

The SNES and Genesis were racing, sports, RPGs, SRPGs, platformer, shooter, fighter, puzzle, racing and adventure heaven.

The N64 was like the commercial with the girl on the bicycle in the center of the box. The guy tells her she can ride it, but only inside the designated area.

I've mentioned this before, but we never had that problem, mainly because we got our N64 in late 1999 and there were already a fair number of games we knew we wanted. (and of course SSB was new) Still, for several freinds who'd gotten it in '96/97 it wasn't that lmiting either, the average kid only getting a few new games a year anyway. (along with some cheaper ones for their older consoles, of which pretty much all of them did) A lot of it also probably has to do with our ages at the time as well. (the party games in particular, Mario Kart, DK Racing, Goldeneye, Star Fox 64, and of couse SSB but that was later)

Chilly Willy

09-23-2009, 06:29 PM

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fascist_(epithet)

- I wasn't 110% serious. But I indeed was interested what TheEdge would think that Fascism meant.

Me neither. - The initial post where I was referring to "you guys" (mainly aimed towards TheEdge who posted twice above me and also immediately replied to my post as if I was adressing him directly) as "Wii fascists" was "if I'm a conservative gamer" (that's what I usually would consider myself, but I might as well be utterly wrong with my self perception), "[then, and only then] you guys are [...] Wii fascists."

Ah, okay. That's for explaining that. :)

I bought one last week on impulse, as my daughter has been pestering me for one for months.

Perfect timing! Just managed to avoid that pesky price reduction! ;) :D

Baloo

09-23-2009, 06:32 PM

Baloo, read his statement more carefully:

By "greatest console" he meant SNES, with N64 and GC being dissapointing by comparison.

Ah.

Yeah, it's our only current gen console as well and it gets more use with Gamecube games than Wii ones. I do definitely prefer Brawl to Melee though, but I think I still like the original best.

I agree, the Original definitely had the most solid gameplay. And I also use my Wii for Gamecube games once in a while.

InternalPrimate

09-23-2009, 06:40 PM

kool kitty89

09-23-2009, 07:08 PM

I agree, the Original definitely had the most solid gameplay. And I also use my Wii for Gamecube games once in a while.

Did you already have a GameCube, or did you get GC games for the Wii?

We mainly end up using the Wii for GC since out GC is packed away currently, it was less so a while ago when we had it hooked up to a second TV, but we ended up packing it up a while back and haven;t set it up again.

gamevet

09-23-2009, 07:30 PM

I like mine, but it definitely doesn't get as much attention as my 360 or DS. It does, however, get a lot more attention than my PS3. You just have to search out the gems.

If you're playing a Wii more than a PS3, you seriously haven't searched for the gems of the PS3.

If I were to buy a Wii, it would be the 3rd console of choice for gameplay, much like the N64 was to the Playstation and Saturn, and the Gamecube was to the Xbox and PS2 in my home. I'm more interested in what is being offered on the virtual console, to what is available on disc, but most of those games can be had through emulation for free.

Christuserloeser

09-23-2009, 07:46 PM

If you're playing a PS3 more than a Wii, you seriously haven't searched for the gems of the Wii.

This works fine in both ways ;)

gamevet

09-23-2009, 07:53 PM

This works fine in both ways ;)

Not really.

If I'd spent $300+ on a console with much better games, technology and features, I'm certainly not going to throw away cash for mediocre games on a console that I'd spent less money on. It would make sense if I was getting the games for a lot less cash on the cheaper console.

The guys at Game Critics (http://www.gamecritics.com/podcast) had me rolling with Podcast 16 that featured E3 coverage. Every one of them was so pissed off about the state of the Wii, and one guy about lost it with his disgust for what Nintendo had to show. They later had a podcast 18, where they talked about that particular episode, and discussed in more detail why they felt what they did about the console.

Knuckle Duster

09-23-2009, 07:57 PM

If you're playing a Wii more than a PS3, you seriously haven't searched for the gems of the PS3.

If I were to buy a Wii, it would be the 3rd console of choice for gameplay, much like the N64 was to the Playstation and Saturn, and the Gamecube was to the Xbox and PS2 in my home. I'm more interested in what is being offered on the virtual console, to what is available on disc, but most of those games can be had through emulation for free.

This works fine in both ways ;)

Universal Conflicting Opinions Being Pointed Out?!

Not really.

If I'd spent $300+ on a console with much better games, technology and features, I'm certainly not going to throw away cash for mediocre games on a console that I'd spent less money on. It would make sense if I was getting the games for a lot less cash on the cheaper console.

http://4gifs.com/gallery/d/33247-1/dramacat.jpg

InternalPrimate

09-23-2009, 08:25 PM

If you're playing a Wii more than a PS3, you seriously haven't searched for the gems of the PS3.

The main reason my PS3 is largely ignored is because pretty much all of the games I'm interested in are multi-console, and for those I'm a 360 supporter since 90% of my friends are. You'd be surprised what an online community can do to you.

As for PS3 exclusives, I can count the games I'm interested in on one hand.

MrMatthews

09-23-2009, 08:30 PM

$199 is a great investment for the upcoming year:

New Super Mario Bros. Wii
Silent Hill Shattered Memories
Red Steel 2
Raving Rabbids Go Home
No More Heroes 2
Final Fantasy Crystal Chronicles: The Crystal Bearers
A Boy and his Blob
Tatsunoko Vs Capcom
Dead Space Extraction

You have a couple of odd blank spots in your list, IP. It's weird how you don't mention Metroid: Other M or Resident Evil: Darkside Chronicles.

What happened to you, dude? :shame:

Melf

09-23-2009, 08:33 PM

This is why I bought the Wii initially. Historically, systems priced below $300 (in this case almost half the price of the competitors) tend to sell ridiculous amounts of units. Hell, the PS2 is still selling like hotcakes even though the only games really coming out anymore is Guitar Hero-type games and a handful of last minute Japanese translations or retro compilations. I took this high-sales logic and assumed that, like the PS2, the best selling system of its generation, would lead to a smorgasbord of great games for the Wii. Boy was I wrong. Toy Story is coming out with a new game, guess what genre defying powerhouse it is going to be? ANOTHER FUCKING MINI GAME COMPILATION! I'd rather play Toy Story for Genesis any day of the year. FML, the Wii is a black hole of shit. There are only tolerable Wii games, no good ones.

You should know by now that the Wii is not marketed to you. Sitting by your console, waiting for the games to arrive is only going to drive you nuts. I bought mine, stuck it under the TV, and will forget about it until something that interests me comes along. In the meantime, let my kids play Bratz and Carnival games. They're the Wii's target audience, after all.

I got Nights, which is pretty cool, as well as Zak & Wiki (a great Capcom game that was made for fans), and Contra Rebirth. I'm going to get Ghost Squad, which is a short-but-cool light gun game, as well as both HOD games and Resident Evil: Umbrella Chronicles. Those, along with Super Mario Galaxy and Punch Out!, give me all the Wii gaming I'll need between 360 and PS3 sessions.

kool kitty89: I meant current gen.

gamevet

09-23-2009, 09:48 PM

The main reason my PS3 is largely ignored is because pretty much all of the games I'm interested in are multi-console, and for those I'm a 360 supporter since 90% of my friends are. You'd be surprised what an online community can do to you.

If the game's primary feature is multiplayer, I'll buy it for 360. If it's just a one player game, I'm buying it on PS3. I do that because I'd like to have something next-gen to play, the next time my 360 decides it's time to RROD.

As for PS3 exclusives, I can count the games I'm interested in on one hand.

And the Wii has more?

InternalPrimate

09-23-2009, 10:06 PM

If the game's primary feature is multiplayer, I'll buy it for 360. If it's just a one player game, I'm buying it on PS3. I do that because I'd like to have something next-gen to play, the next time my 360 decides it's time to RROD.

And the Wii has more?

That I'm interested in, yes. We may have completely different tastes in gaming, and that's okay. Here's the exclusive Wii games I own:

Wii Sports
Wii Sports Resort
Zack & Wiki
Geometry War Galaxies
Resident Evil 4: Wii Edition (not exactly an exclusive, but a must buy because of the way it plays)
Madworld
Twilight Princess
Super Paper Mario World
Super Mario Galaxy
No More Heroes
Super Smash Bros. Brawl
Mario Kart Wii
Resident Evil Umbrella Chronicles
Sonic and the Secret Rings (I still contend that it's the best 3D sonic game released in almost a decade)
Super Monkey Ball Banana Blitz
Metroid Prime Trilogy
Tiger Woods 10 (like RE4, not exactly an exclusive, but different in how it plays)
House of the Dead Overkill
Link's Crossbow Training

These are just the exclusives I own, and excludes WiiWare. There are far more that I'm interested in. The only PS3 exclusives I'm interested in are Ratchet and Clank, Uncharted, Valkyria Chronicles, aaaaaaand that's it. At least, nothing else comes to mind.

I understand your fear of the RROD though, its happened to me three times, and I'm on my fourth 360. Still, it's what I buy games for.

GriskaGyoran

09-23-2009, 10:18 PM

Only reasons I'd get Wii is for New Super Mario Bros. the 2D one, Punchout, and Silent Hill, other than that I really don't have any interest in pretty much the entire library.

17daysolderthannes

09-23-2009, 10:30 PM

gamevet

09-23-2009, 10:37 PM

That I'm interested in, yes. We may have completely different tastes in gaming, and that's okay. Here's the exclusive Wii games I own:

Resident Evil 4: Wii Edition (not exactly an exclusive, but a must buy because of the way it plays)

You could play this on the GC and PS2. The addition of motion control hardly makes this game a reason to buy a Wii.

Twilight Princess The same as RE4.

Metroid Prime Trilogy

I had an interest in Prime 3, but I've heard it's nothing special and 2 wasn't as good as the original Prime either. The addition of flicking your wrist to open a door and a few other motion control features don't seem like much of a reason to own the Wii version over what is already available on a GC.

These are just the exclusives I own, and excludes WiiWare. There are far more that I'm interested in. The only PS3 exclusives I'm interested in are Ratchet and Clank, Uncharted, Valkyria Chronicles, aaaaaaand that's it. At least, nothing else comes to mind.

.

Super Stardust
Wipeout HD
Little Big Planet
inFamous
Disgaea 3
Metal Gear Solid 4
Flow
Heavenly Sword
Resistance 2
Killzone 2
Demon's Souls
Motorstorm Pacific Rift
Ninja Gaiden Sigma
Zen Pinball
Linger in Shadows
Shatter

There are other titles like Flower that are considered pretty good, but I didn't play quite enough of the demo to get it. Gran Turismo HD is alright, but far too short to spend $30 on. And I'm not a fan of Ratchet and Clank.

InternalPrimate

09-23-2009, 10:42 PM

Am I crazy for finding the PS3 the only worthwhile system of this generation? Say what you will about the games, the PS3 works, the controllers aren't garbage, you can buy accessories for less than half the price of the console ($100 Wi-Fi adapter for 360, woot!), and mini-games are nowhere in sight. How that isn't an epic win for this generation is a mystery to me.

***Sigh*** 17days apparently needs attention.

Again, it's failed three times. Not four. Not that it makes much of a difference, as failing one time is unacceptable. Still, the system was under warranty each time, and I'm confident that the NEXT Xbox will be backwards compatible, so I'm not going to live in fear of buying games.

So the PS3 doesn't break, has a functional controller, and its accessories don't cost an arm and a leg. That's why it should be selling well? I'm sorry, you had me laughing there.

I stick with my 360 simply because it's the better all around system. There are more games I enjoy, the online component is far better (I don't mind paying $50 for service), the controller is excellent, and like I said, all of my friends are on board. Sure, I could play Call of Duty 4 on the PS3, free online and all, but with who? The 360 is this generation's online platform of choice, and I welcome that.

The physical hardware may be cheap and faulty, but that doesn't take away from all of the right things Microsoft has done right this generation. The 360 is an excellent console. Had it been better built, it might be one of the best ever.

InternalPrimate

09-23-2009, 10:56 PM

You could play this on the GC and PS2. The addition of motion control hardly makes this game a reason to buy a Wii.

Oh, it's far better on the Wii. I didn't say any of these games are reason to own the Wii, just exclusive games I'm interested in. And Resident Evil isn't substantially better because of motion controls, it's substantially better because of pointer controls.

Oh, and I forgot that Twilight Princess also came out on the GC :p I'll give you that one. I prefer the Wii controls, but can understand why others wouldn't.

I had an interest in Prime 3, but I've heard it's nothing special and 2 wasn't as good as the original Prime either. The addition of flicking your wrist to open a door and a few other motion control features don't seem like much of a reason to own the Wii version over what is already available on a GC.

You heard wrong my friend! MP3 is good fun. And just like in the case of RE4, it's all about pointer controls. It's far better, and worth repurchasing the first two games in the series.

Wipeout HD
Little Big Planet
inFamous
Disgaea 3
Metal Gear Solid 4
Heavenly Sword
Resistance 2
Killzone 2
Demon's Souls
Motorstorm Pacific Rift

There are other titles like Flower that are considered pretty good, but I didn't play quite enough of the demo to get it. Gran Turismo HD is alright, but far too short to spend $30 on. And I'm not a fan of Ratchet and Clank.

Well, first off, I neglected WiiWare games, so I went ahead and deleted PSN games on your list. And Ninja Gaiden isn't an exclusive. Honestly, Looking at that revised list, not one game interests me. Again, this is just matter of taste.

I will admit that there is one more game that I can't wait for: The Last Guardian.

17daysolderthannes

09-23-2009, 10:58 PM

***Sigh*** 17days apparently needs attention.

ok?

Again, it's failed three times. Not four. Not that it makes much of a difference, as failing one time is unacceptable. Still, the system was under warranty each time, and I'm confident that the NEXT Xbox will be backwards compatible, so I'm not going to live in fear of buying games.

just like this XBOX was backwards compatible, right? :roll:

I'll remember this when you sell your collection of coasters for the price of broken glass because there aren't any systems left to play them on.

So the PS3 doesn't break, has a functional controller, and its accessories don't cost an arm and a leg. That's why it should be selling well? I'm sorry, you had me laughing there.

Ummmm, yeah, it's a damn good start. It has Skate and Skate 2 and Gran Turismo 5 (prologue for now, but just wait). That's enough for the rest of my life TBH.

I stick with my 360 simply because it's the better all around system. There are more games I enjoy, the online component is far better (I don't mind paying $50 for service), the controller is excellent, and like I said, all of my friends are on board. Sure, I could play Call of Duty 4 on the PS3, free online and all, but with who? The 360 is this generation's online platform of choice, and I welcome that.

That's the biggest mystery of all. Your friends not having one wouldn't be a problem if they were smart and went with the PS3 to begin with. I would rather get a PS3 and LOL when they had to get it repaired again. I don't have any friends good enough at video games to be competitive with me anyway, so I'd rather play with strangers online if I need a quick multiplayer fix. If I want to play with friends, I'll play with them in my living room. Besides, my schedule is so irregular because of school that I would probably never be on when they were anyway.

The physical hardware may be cheap and faulty, but that doesn't take away from all of the right things Microsoft has done right this generation. The 360 is an excellent console. Had it been better built, it might be one of the best ever.

Exactly what did they do right? come out before Wii and PS3, that's pretty much it. Aside from games also on the PS3, I haven't played a single game on XBOX 360 I was thrilled about. Forza sucks my nuts, though the first one was sort of fun for $4.

gamevet

09-23-2009, 11:00 PM

Still, the system was under warranty each time, and I'm confident that the NEXT Xbox will be backwards compatible, so I'm not going to live in fear of buying games.
.

The 360 is hardly compatible with the last Xbox. MS doesn't care if you can play games you've bought for their older system, they want your cash. BC doesn't fit into that equation. I love how every arcade compilation disc I have for the old Xbox, didn't make it over to the BC list for the 360. It's kind of hard to justify buying Joust ($5) through DLC, if there was a BC version available from Midway's Arcade Treasures on Xbox.

17daysolderthannes

09-23-2009, 11:10 PM

The 360 is hardly compatible with the last Xbox. MS doesn't care if you can play games you've bought for their older system, they want your cash. BC doesn't fit into that equation. I love how every arcade compilation disc I have for the old Xbox, didn't make it over to the BC list for the 360. It's kind of hard to justify buying Joust ($5) through DLC, if there was a BC version available from Midway's Arcade Treasures on Xbox.

where have I heard this before? hmmm, not PS3...was it Dreamcast? no. Oh yeah, THE WII. "No, we're not going to make cartridge adapters, just sell them their collection again!"

You know what pisses me off the most about VC (besides the highway robbery prices)? They have not put a single light gun game on it! The majority of Wii owners probably have some sort of HD TV that won't work with a Zapper, Justifier, Menacer or Super Scope and this would enable them to trade those rare, somewhat unreliable, battery hogs for a simple infrared light gun that is built into the standard controller. I have been DYING to play games like Metal Combat with a proper lightgun for YEARS and Nintendo has the opportunity for the perfect marriage of old games and new technology (less battery usage, HD compatibility) and they haven't even touched it. I guess I'll just have to buy an XBOX light gun and play it on my modded XBOX.

InternalPrimate

09-23-2009, 11:11 PM

That's the biggest mystery of all. Your friends not having one wouldn't be a problem if they were smart and went with the PS3 to begin with. I would rather get a PS3 and LOL when they had to get it repaired again. I don't have any friends good enough at video games to be competitive with me anyway, so I'd rather play with strangers online if I need a quick multiplayer fix. If I want to play with friends, I'll play with them in my living room. Besides, my schedule is so irregular because of school that I would probably never be on when they were anyway.

Exactly what did they do right? come out before Wii and PS3, that's pretty much it. Aside from games also on the PS3, I haven't played a single game on XBOX 360 I was thrilled about. Forza sucks my nuts, though the first one was sort of fun for $4.

First off, thanks for calling me and my friends a bunch of dummies, appreciate that.

I'm sorry that you don't have any friends good at video games and that you'd rather play alone with strangers. That's not me. On our totem pole, I'm right about mid-level, which I love. There's always a challenge. And don't forget that you're talking to someone who just got his degree, meaning just a few months ago he was working 40 hours a week and taking four to five classes. We all find time on weekday evenings. Or at least we did. Things have slowed down until Modern Warfare 2 releases.

Microsoft has done almost everything right this generation. First and foremost is the 360s online component. Like it or not, Sony and Nintendo are struggling to copy it. Trophies? Wonder where that idea came from. Being able to have a consistent online identity, achievements (no matter how trivial they are), being able to communicate with friends regardless of whether or not they're playing the same game (or a game at all) are all innovations that have attracted gamers to the 360.

Besides the online component, Microsoft has done a tremendous job of gaining 3rd party support. Maybe you don't remember, but the PS2 was an absolute monster. In an age where so much business relies on "exclusives", Microsoft successfully stole Sony's biggest - GTA. And they continue to do so, as evident by Final Fantasy 13. Turning once exclusive games into mulit-console games effectively closed the gap between Sony and Microsoft. Choices are now being made based on the little things, which again leads to their excellent online component.

ADDED: Cartridge adapters?! You never cease to amaze me 17days :p

17daysolderthannes

09-23-2009, 11:22 PM

First off, thanks for calling me and my friends a bunch of dummies, appreciate that.

I tried, I REALLY tried not to, but god dammit, at some point you just gotta call it how it is.

I'm sorry that you don't have any friends good at video games and that you'd rather play alone with strangers. That's not me. On our totem pole, I'm right about mid-level, which I love. There's always a challenge. And don't forget that you're talking to someone who just got his degree, meaning just a few months ago he was working 40 hours a week and taking four to five classes. We all find time on weekday evenings. Or at least we did. Things have slowed down until Modern Warfare 2 releases.

Pffft, apparently that degree wasn't in Mechanical Engineering. Most people in my major end up fat by the time they get out because they have no time to do anything but sit down and study, and those people don't have jobs either. I could probably have a full time job too if all of my classes were liberal arts "ummm, we'll have 3 tests, no homework, and a 2 page paper, hope that's not too much for you!"

Microsoft has done almost everything right this generation. First and foremost is the 360s online component. Like it or not, Sony and Nintendo are struggling to copy it. Trophies? Wonder where that idea came from. Being able to have a consistent online identity, achievements (no matter how trivial they are), being able to communicate with friends regardless of whether or not they're playing the same game (or a game at all) are all innovations that have attracted gamers to the 360.

trophies? who gives a shit. If my friends want to play online, it's REAL easy to coordinate that without paying $50 a year for it. As for vintage arcade games, I hear they are way better on 2Dfighter.com FOR FREE than they are over XBOX LIVE. I thought there was actually something special about XBOX LIVE, it's even more pathetic and lame than I thought!

Besides the online component, Microsoft has done a tremendous job of gaining 3rd party support. Maybe you don't remember, but the PS2 was an absolute monster. In an age where so much business relies on "exclusives", Microsoft successfully stole Sony's biggest - GTA. And they continue to do so, as evident by Final Fantasy 13. Turning once exclusive games into mulit-console games effectively closed the gap between Sony and Microsoft. Choices are now being made based on the little things, which again leads to their excellent online component.

So dual release of GTA 4 makes the 360 better than the PS3? tha fuck?

ADDED: Cartridge adapters?! You never cease to amaze me 17days :p

Tack on HD-DVD drives? you never cease to amaze me Microsoft :p

At least cartridge adapters would be beneficial to people with blinking NES problems or dead cap SNES consoles or people with HD TVs that don't display 240P well.

Knuckle Duster

09-23-2009, 11:25 PM

InternalPrimate

09-23-2009, 11:36 PM

Isn't it funny, that the same guy on this board who defends the Wii the most also defends the 360 the most? Well, no one can accuse me of being a fanboy.

Like I said, everyone has different tastes, and that determines their console preference. If Gamevet loves the PS3 for its exclusive games, and 17days loves the PS3 because it's functional, then so be it! That's great that you get enjoyment out of something. Just don't rip into other people (Gamevet didn't) for finding enjoyment and value in something you didn't.

http://ep.yimg.com/ca/I/yhst-34640480252896_2073_1466083

Knuckle Duster

09-23-2009, 11:51 PM

http://www.tshirthell.com/shirts/products/a1280/a1280_thumb.jpg

kool kitty89

09-24-2009, 12:21 AM

where have I heard this before? hmmm, not PS3...was it Dreamcast? no. Oh yeah, THE WII. "No, we're not going to make cartridge adapters, just sell them their collection again!"

It does have GC compatibility of course, which is probably what we use it for most as of late. (mainly because aour GC is put away) Given the hardware, lack of GC comatibility would have been lame, but then again, they easily could have had GB/GBC support of the GB Micro and DS... (GB hadware onboard the GBA ASIC, but no switch mechanism)
Granted they're not really supporting GC at all anymore, weird that kind of the opposite happened with the PS3, it lost compatibility, but the PS2 is still getting some releases.

You know what pisses me off the most about VC (besides the highway robbery prices)? They have not put a single light gun game on it! The majority of Wii owners probably have some sort of HD TV that won't work with a Zapper, Justifier, Menacer or Super Scope

Super Scope uses a (rather inaccurate) sensor bar, and shouldn't be any worse on modern sets than old ones.

17daysolderthannes

09-24-2009, 12:33 AM

It does have GC compatibility of course, which is probably what we use it for most as of late. (mainly because aour GC is put away) Given the hardware, lack of GC comatibility would have been lame, but then again, they easily could have had GB/GBC support of the GB Micro and DS... (GB hadware onboard the GBA ASIC, but no switch mechanism)
Granted they're not really supporting GC at all anymore, weird that kind of the opposite happened with the PS3, it lost compatibility, but the PS2 is still getting some releases.

That's a huge cop out though.

#1 a used Gamecube is like $20 and won't even sell at that price. You could even get them new at that price not too long ago

#2 It's virtually the same hardware as the Gamecube, it would be incredibly unnacceptable if it wasn't backwards compatible.

you would've done better just skipping the Wii and kept on truckin with your Gamecube. Hell, the Gamecube is known for being one of the most reliable video game systems to date, why not run it into the ground instead of buying a $250 console with motion controls you won't use?

Isn't it obvious yet why Nintendo isn't releasing Gamecube games? Duh! so they can FORCE their customers to buy new hardware, even if they don't like/want motion controls. I'd like to punch the CEO of Nintendo square in the balls for these shenanigans they've been up to lately.

Super Scope uses a (rather inaccurate) sensor bar, and shouldn't be any worse on modern sets than old ones.

It was my understanding it used the scanline as well, but maybe that was incorrect information. Even still, it's a large, hard to find, awkward battery hog compared to a Wiimote. Super Scope on Wii VC would be the first worthwhile piece of software on the Wii IMO.

edit:

turns out I was right

The Super Scope makes use of the scanning process used in cathode ray tube monitors, as CRTs were the only affordable TV monitors until the late 1990s. In short, the screen is drawn by a scanning electron beam that travels horizontally across each line of the screen from top to bottom. A fast photodiode will see any particular area of the screen illuminated only briefly as that point is scanned, while the human eye will see a consistent image due to persistence of vision.

The Super Scope takes advantage of this in a fairly simple manner: it simply outputs a '0' signal when it sees the television raster scan and a '1' signal when it does not. Inside the console this signal is delivered to the PPU, which notes which screen pixel it is outputting at the moment the signal transitions from 1 to 0. At the end of the frame, the game software can retrieve this stored position to determine where on the screen the gun was aimed. All licensed Super Scope games include a calibration mode to account for both electrical delays and maladjustment of the gunsight.[7]

The Super Scope ignores red light, as do many guns of this type, because red phosphors have a much slower rate of decay than green or blue phosphors.[7] Since the Super Scope depends on the short persistence of CRT pixels, it will not function with modern displays (such as plasma screens or LCDs) that continuously light each pixel.

so again, pull your head out of your ass Nintendo, you were big enough dicks by making the Super Scope a gigantic, expensive battery hog the first go around, how bout you use the VC for good instead of evil for once? ($8 for Sonic 2, I think my heart just stopped)

17daysolderthannes

09-24-2009, 12:36 AM

Knuckle Duster

09-24-2009, 12:41 AM

I'll remember this next time I praise the iPhone/iPod Touch and people unload a cart full of horse manure on me.

http://www.threadbombing.com/data/media/4/super_villain.jpg

Christuserloeser

09-24-2009, 01:04 AM

Twilight Princess
Super Paper Mario World
Super Mario Galaxy
Super Smash Bros. Brawl
Mario Kart Wii
Super Monkey Ball Banana Blitz
Link's Crossbow Training

Those (+New Super Mario Bros., Mario Tennis, and Muramasa: The Demon Blade) would be the Wii games I'd buy if I were to buy a Wii.

Plus a good number of N64 games via Virtual Console seeing as they're rendered in 640x480p60, then maybe a few TG-16 games since I never owned one, some WiiWare stuff, and Megaman 9.

Oh, and some GameCube games like WindWaker (I sold my collection not too long ago and do miss that game the most)

Atm, I am happy with my Mega Drive, Saturn and Dreamcast though. I can play Master System on all three of them, and I use NesterDC for NES emulation.

tomaitheous

09-24-2009, 01:08 AM

The next xbox will likely maintain the xenon processor scaled to accommodate the necessary performance demanded of it.

Complaining about the 360's BC with Xbox is ridiculous once you get past the fanboy wailing. It works as well as expected for a RISC console, emulating an x86 CPU while maintaining a software layer to handle the old Nvidia GPU.

That's just it. It's not emulating anything. XBOX tiles playable on the 360 are recompiled cores. That's not emulation. When it comes to XBOX/360, everything goes through an API. You have no direct hardware level access. This means you can make hardware changes while still having compatibility. Just like a PC. So only the core game code had to be recompiled, and voila. Playable on another platform.

I personally don't give a rats ass about BC. I'm a gamer. I have last gen consoles still. If I *really* need to play such outdated-but-not-retro-yet game action, I simply use that system. No big deal. I really don't want to pay for something I already have. And god knows, you *are* paying the cost for BC. M$ got it right. BC is a false sense of value. For suckers and such.

Knuckle Duster

09-24-2009, 01:12 AM

That's just it. It's not emulating anything. XBOX tiles playable on the 360 are recompiled cores. That's not emulation. When it comes to XBOX/360, everything goes through an API. You have no direct hardware level access. This means you can make hardware changes while still having compatibility. Just like a PC. So only the core game code had to be recompiled, and voila. Playable on another platform.

I knew that. I'm just tired and stupid. :shame:

17daysolderthannes

09-24-2009, 02:08 AM

I personally don't give a rats ass about BC. I'm a gamer. I have last gen consoles still. If I *really* need to play such outdated-but-not-retro-yet game action, I simply use that system. No big deal. I really don't want to pay for something I already have. And god knows, you *are* paying the cost for BC. M$ got it right. BC is a false sense of value. For suckers and such.

And that's why PS3 dumped it practically out of the gate and lowered the cost significantly. Still, I do love the backwards compatibility from PS2->PSX, it really was a selling point since I played my PSX games on Virtual Game Station for Mac OS and wanted a console to play them. Seeing as the backwards compatibility caused a ton of problems on PS3, I don't really miss it and it won't bother me once I pick up a PS3.

I knew that. I'm just tired and stupid. :shame:

http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1402/766916583_bec81ce7eb.jpg

It's OK Old Man Dusty Knuckle, we know you just need your nap and your prunes.

Chilly Willy

09-24-2009, 02:09 AM

Complaining about the 360's BC with Xbox is ridiculous once you get past the fanboy wailing. It works as well as expected for a RISC console, emulating an x86 CPU while maintaining a software layer to handle the old Nvidia GPU.

It doesn't emulate NOTHING. XBox BC is done by forcing the devs to recompile the executable for the 360. That's why the list is as haphazard as it is: they simply can't get some games recompiled because the original programmers are gone.

Knuckle Duster

09-24-2009, 02:17 AM

It's OK Old Man Dusty Knuckle, we know you just need your nap and your prunes.
http://www.threadbombing.com/data/media/50/180px-Old-macro.jpg

:lol:

InternalPrimate

09-24-2009, 02:21 AM

gamevet

09-24-2009, 02:29 AM

Nintendo isn't doing anything out of the ordinary.

They're selling you $99 hardware with a handful of good games and a ton of crap, for the price of $250. Hey! We've lowered the price $50 and we're still making a killing.

I'm sorry, but I just can't see how anyone can justify spending $200 on way outdated hardware and then have the gall to say there's nothing to play on the PS3 because the 360 exists. Unless you really don't play games much, the Wii is just a distant 3rd choice as a real game machine. And considering that the 360 arcade is $200 and the PS3 is $300, you'd have to be a totally blind to not see how badly Nintendo is screwing you around.

The Wii motion controls were originally planned as an add-on for the GC btw.

ApolloBoy

09-24-2009, 02:34 AM

I'm sorry, but I just can't see how anyone can justify spending $200 on way outdated hardware

:?::?::?:

17daysolderthannes

09-24-2009, 02:34 AM

What are you talking about? You're starting to sound like the ranting and raving bum on the corner downtown.

First off, who in the world expected a cartridge adapter? That's nearly as goofy as you calling the $300 cell phone console "the future". Don't let this man buy stocks!

Second off, Nintendo is pulling "shenanigans" by not releasing Gamecube games anymore? Holy cats, what year do you live in? The PS2 is the exception to the rule. Are original Xbox games still being made? Of course not! The regular lifespan of a console is five years, Nintendo isn't doing anything out of the ordinary.

hmmm, lets see:

The company that brought you the Super GameBoy and the Game Boy Advance player couldn't do the same with console carts? GOD DAMN, I AM RIDICULOUS! Obviously the system can emulate them, so why not make a simple pass through adapter to play your old games or god forbid upload them to your Wii? (would never happen, Nintendo are much to big of pricks for something that cool to happen) I didn't say I expected adapters, just that it would be a decent thing to do for their unbelievably devoted fans that have been sucking their money grubbing dick all of these years.

Is that cell phone console in "the past"? no? then it's the future. I didn't say it was the future of all video games as we know it, but I wouldn't doubt for a second that larger broadband connections and even potential city-wide Wi-Fi will bring that style of console around much sooner than you think. And, for like the 23.5 trillionth time, I didn't realize it was $300, but that doesn't really make a difference as I was just showing it to everyone, not demanding anyone buy one or even suggesting it. The real focus was just to show the crazy stuff Tec Toy was coming out with because the drastically different foreign markets intrigue me.

XBOX isn't perfectly compatible with XBOX 360 like Gamecube is to Wii. There are lots of games on the Wii that are best with a Gamecube controller anyway, so what's the difference? Hell, most games don't come anywhere near the Wii's potential anyway, so why not make it an upwards compatible Gamecube game that can work with the Wii if you have one? Oh right, they want you to buy the new system so they can force you to buy even more crap you don't need. If you've been taking notes, you know I'm also not fond of Microsoft anyway, if I was an original XBOX owner I would've been PISSED at how short the life of the system was. Just another reason I like Sony the best of the companies still in the console game.

MrMatthews

09-24-2009, 02:38 AM

And considering that the 360 arcade is $200, you'd have to be a totally blind to not see how badly Nintendo is screwing you around.

Does the Arcade still require an extra $200 sunk into it to perform some of the neat tricks that the Wii does out of the box? Like, WiFi and backwards compatibility?

Just curious.

17daysolderthannes

09-24-2009, 02:38 AM

:?::?::?:

it's a Gamecube in a white plastic shell. It's like if Playstation 3 was just a Playstation 2 with the SixAxis controller and a built in hard drive. The Wii was originally just going to be an add on like a Guitar Hero guitar or some Donkey Konga bongos, but the marketing department did the smartest thing ever and convinced the ignorant masses it was the most advanced gameplay upgrade the world has ever seen. They might fool 5 year olds, but they ain't foolin' me. I only got one because PS3 and 360 were ludicrously expensive at the time and I thought Wii would've had lots of good cheap games due to its higher sales volume (like the PS2 enjoyed).

17daysolderthannes

09-24-2009, 02:43 AM

Does the Arcade still require an extra $200 sunk into it to perform some of the neat tricks that the Wii does out of the box? Like, WiFi and backwards compatibility?

Just curious.

oh, you mean like the PS3 does out of the box for $299 (PSX anyway)? PS3 takes USB controllers, has the Wii learned that trick yet? Gotta have that huge :lol: Gamecube game library :lol: full of all of that gold :lol: . I have had my Wii since early 2007 and still do not own a single Gamecube game, take that to the bank. What is worth playing is WAY too expensive.

ApolloBoy

09-24-2009, 02:45 AM

it's a Gamecube in a white plastic shell.

I really don't see that argument, considering that I've played both the GameCube and Wii long enough to know that the Wii is more than just a GC with motion controls. It doesn't really make sense, and even then, it still doesn't matter to me that much considering that I quite liked the GC.

gamevet

09-24-2009, 02:45 AM

If you've been taking notes, you know I'm also not fond of Microsoft anyway, if I was an original XBOX owner I would've been PISSED at how short the life of the system was. Just another reason I like Sony the best of the companies still in the console game.

Yeah, I wasn't too happy with that decision. MS could have at least kept the hardware available for another year and offered a game or 2 along the way. EA supported the console up to Madden 08 and we were lucky to get Call of Duty 3 as well. The PS2 was my backup until I could afford a PS3 and 360 in 2007.

InternalPrimate

09-24-2009, 02:46 AM

I'm sorry, but I just can't see how anyone can justify spending $200 on way outdated hardware and then have the gall to say there's nothing to play on the PS3 because the 360 exists.

I didn't say that, all I said was that my PS3 gets the least amount of game time. And it does. The last time I played anything on my PS3 before Arkham Asylum was Ratchet and Clank Future. I'm not saying it isn't a viable console, I'm just giving my reason for not using it as much as my 360 and Wii. I'm not insulting your choice of console, I'm just explaining my choice.

Unless you really don't play games much, the Wii is just a distant 3rd choice as a real game machine. And considering that the 360 arcade is $200 and the PS3 is $300, you'd have to be a totally blind to not see how badly Nintendo is screwing you around.

That, sir, is condescending. Trust me, I've been an avid gamer ever since I could get my mind around Super Mario Bros. and the very fact that I own all consoles being discussed at least suggests I'm able to form a valid opinion. One more time, value is subjective. Are you paying $199 for the actual pieces of technology that go into a console, or the ability to use said product to play a specific group of software.

You can say that $200 is a rip off all you want, it isn't because there is a demand for the product. If there wasn't, the price would've been lowered long ago. The public dictates the price based on demand, who are you two to rip on Nintendo from benefiting from their in-demand product?

You can claim all you want that the Wii isn't a serious video game console, 54 million people would disagree.

gamevet

09-24-2009, 02:48 AM

Does the Arcade still require an extra $200 sunk into it to perform some of the neat tricks that the Wii does out of the box? Like, WiFi and backwards compatibility?

Just curious.

It doesn't require the golly gee family friend code to play online. I've never used WiFi to play online either.

You can claim all you want that the Wii isn't a serious video game console, 54 million people would disagree.

I'll bet half of that 54 million is collecting dust in many family entertainment centers, or it's being used for Wii fit by soccer moms around the country. I've probably heard just as many complaints about the lack of real games for the system, as I've heard RROD stories for the 360.

Check out the Gamecritics podcast I linked to earlier in the thread. These are legitamate gamers that want something to play on their Wii consoles and they are frustrated that Nintendo doesn't care about them. I about fell over laughing at Mike's comments, because the guy was having a shit-fit over how bad the gaming situation was for the console and what Nintendo was showing at E3.

MrMatthews

09-24-2009, 02:48 AM

oh, you mean like the PS3 does out of the box for $299 (PSX anyway)? PS3 takes USB controllers, has the Wii learned that trick yet? Gotta have that huge :lol: Gamecube game library :lol: full of all of that gold :lol: . I have had my Wii since early 2007 and still do not own a single Gamecube game, take that to the bank. What is worth playing is WAY too expensive.

I'm having difficulty understanding exactly what your point is, probably because you didn't understand mine.

17daysolderthannes

09-24-2009, 02:53 AM

I really don't see that argument, considering that I've played both the GameCube and Wii long enough to know that the Wii is more than just a GC with motion controls. It doesn't really make sense, and even then, it still doesn't matter to me that much considering that I quite liked the GC.

From a hardware perspective, they are basically identical. Everything else is minute tweaks, mostly a user interface and some internal memory.

I didn't say that, all I said was that my PS3 gets the least amount of game time. And it does. The last time I played anything on my PS3 before Arkham Asylum was Ratchet and Clank Future. I'm not saying it isn't a viable console, I'm just giving my reason for not using it as much as my 360 and Wii. I'm not insulting your choice of console, I'm just explaining my choice.

That, sir, is condescending. Trust me, I've been an avid gamer ever since I could get my mind around Super Mario Bros. and the very fact that I own all consoles being discussed at least suggests I'm able to form a valid opinion. One more time, value is subjective. Are you paying $199 for the actual pieces of technology that go into a console, or the ability to use said product to play a specific group of software.

You can say that $200 is a rip off all you want, it isn't because there is a demand for the product. If there wasn't, the price would've been lowered long ago. The public dictates the price based on demand, who are you two to rip on Nintendo from benefiting from their in-demand product?

You can claim all you want that the Wii isn't a serious video game console, 54 million people would disagree.

you mean 53,999,990 people are super pissed they wasted $250 and now have a paper weight. Nintendo can benefit all they want, but I'll enjoy watching them burn when the "casual" market moves on to the next fad.

17daysolderthannes

09-24-2009, 02:56 AM

I'm having difficulty understanding exactly what your point is, probably because you didn't understand mine.

your point was that the XBOX 360 arcade has zero features, and I agree, that's why I passed on it a long time ago because I would've had to spend twice that to get it up and running, a simple piece of math people neglect and I suspect is half the reason PS3 didn't dominate this generation thus far. All I was saying is that PS3 gives you everything the Wii has and a whole lot more for not much more money (motion controller on the way, not that I want it).

Knuckle Duster

09-24-2009, 02:59 AM

Nintendo can benefit all they want, but I'll enjoy watching them burn when the "casual" market moves on to the next fad.

To what purpose? One less game company?

We know you hate the Wii. Your ridiculous ranting serves no purpose & bears no traction in persuading others from forming their own opinion.

You're an idiot. Shut up already.

InternalPrimate

09-24-2009, 03:01 AM

hmmm, lets see:

The company that brought you the Super GameBoy and the Game Boy Advance player couldn't do the same with console carts? GOD DAMN, I AM RIDICULOUS! Obviously the system can emulate them, so why not make a simple pass through adapter to play your old games or god forbid upload them to your Wii? (would never happen, Nintendo are much to big of pricks for something that cool to happen) I didn't say I expected adapters, just that it would be a decent thing to do for their unbelievably devoted fans that have been sucking their money grubbing dick all of these years.

Is that cell phone console in "the past"? no? then it's the future. I didn't say it was the future of all video games as we know it, but I wouldn't doubt for a second that larger broadband connections and even potential city-wide Wi-Fi will bring that style of console around much sooner than you think. And, for like the 23.5 trillionth time, I didn't realize it was $300, but that doesn't really make a difference as I was just showing it to everyone, not demanding anyone buy one or even suggesting it. The real focus was just to show the crazy stuff Tec Toy was coming out with because the drastically different foreign markets intrigue me.

XBOX isn't perfectly compatible with XBOX 360 like Gamecube is to Wii. There are lots of games on the Wii that are best with a Gamecube controller anyway, so what's the difference? Hell, most games don't come anywhere near the Wii's potential anyway, so why not make it an upwards compatible Gamecube game that can work with the Wii if you have one? Oh right, they want you to buy the new system so they can force you to buy even more crap you don't need. If you've been taking notes, you know I'm also not fond of Microsoft anyway, if I was an original XBOX owner I would've been PISSED at how short the life of the system was. Just another reason I like Sony the best of the companies still in the console game.

Calm down there, Turbo.

I don't think the idea of a cartridge adapter is dumb, I think the fact that you're pissed off at Nintendo for not creating that imaginary product is dumb. Really really dumb. Damn you Ford for not giving me a condom dispenser in my car!!! See how ridiculous that sounds?

Last time I checked, when someone calls something "the future", they're saying that it's the next big thing. Not that it's just coming soon. I think you realized how ridiculous you sounded, but instead of backing down, you chose to take the "that's not what I really meant!" route. And I don't care if you didn't know it was $300, you should've. You don't research things, which is evident in most of your anti-Wii arguments, and you need to start doing so if you want to be taken seriously.

MrMatthews

09-24-2009, 03:03 AM

your point was that the XBOX 360 arcade has zero features, and I agree, that's why I passed on it a long time ago because I would've had to spend twice that to get it up and running, a simple piece of math people neglect and I suspect is half the reason PS3 didn't dominate this generation thus far. All I was saying is that PS3 gives you everything the Wii has and a whole lot more for not much more money (motion controller on the way, not that I want it).

Right, my point was basically the same as the one you've often made yourself. MS nickels and dimes their customers blind, so Gamevet was a little silly to imply that Nintendo's customers are being dicked around while Sony & Microsoft gamers are pandered to.

But as long as you brought up the PS3, how much was it again when it launched? Back when the Wii (again, offering out-of-the-box WiFi and BC) was $250?

Oh, and wasn't there some kind of snafu about the PS3's BC, also? I might be mistaken, but I seem to recall hearing about that.

Deo

09-24-2009, 03:06 AM

Damn you Ford for not giving me a condom dispenser in my car!!! See how ridiculous that sounds?

I'm going to use that as a conversation starter sometime in the near future.

InternalPrimate

09-24-2009, 03:07 AM

I'll bet half of that 54 million is collecting dust in many family entertainment centers, or it's being used for Wii fit by soccer moms around the country. I've probably heard just as many complaints about the lack of real games for the system, as I've heard RROD stories for the 360.

Check out the Gamecritics podcast I linked to earlier in the thread. These are legitamate gamers that want something to play on their Wii consoles and they are frustrated that Nintendo doesn't care about them. I about fell over laughing at Mike's comments, because the guy was having a shit-fit over how bad the gaming situation was for the console and what Nintendo was showing at E3.

Even if you're right, that's still more than PS3 units sold :p Yeah, I went there.

And I don't care what Mike from Gamecritics thinks of the Wii. He's just as much of a gamer as I am. There is literally no difference between me and Mike, which just proves the point that value is subjective! Why can't people like what they like? Why do you or anyone else give a darn?

And if you really don't think "serious gamers" like the Wii, go check out Classic Game Room and hear what Mark has to say. One of the very few people who completely understands the value in ALL gaming consoles.

And MrMatthews. That guy's got his head together :p

ApolloBoy

09-24-2009, 03:08 AM

From a hardware perspective, they are basically identical. Everything else is minute tweaks, mostly a user interface and some internal memory.

Hm. Well even then, the Wii seems like quite the improvement over the GC, and right now I have to say that it's my favorite of the three consoles out now, even though I don't really follow the game industry that much these days.

And for the record, I have played both the 360 and PS3 (my brother owns a 360 and Wii, my dad owns a PS3) and liked playing games on those systems as well. I don't think I'll actually consider buying any of them until all three are past their prime though.

InternalPrimate

09-24-2009, 03:13 AM

Hm. Well even then, the Wii seems like quite the improvement over the GC, and right now I have to say that it's my favorite of the three consoles out now, even though I don't really follow the game industry that much these days.

And for the record, I have played both the 360 and PS3 (my brother owns a 360 and Wii, my dad owns a PS3) and liked playing games on those systems as well. I don't think I'll actually consider buying any of them until all three are past their prime though.

Maybe it's the California air? It just makes us open-minded to new video game experiences :p

gamevet

09-24-2009, 03:15 AM

Right, my point was basically the same as the one you've often made yourself. MS nickels and dimes their customers blind, so Gamevet was a little silly to imply that Nintendo's customers are being dicked around while Sony & Microsoft gamers are pandered to.

Yeah, I got dicked around by Nintendo. They had all of these false promises with the N64 and Gamecube. Sure they tried to lure back 3rd party support, but it wasn't more than just a few nice exclusives and a small collection of Nintendo 1st party titles. They sell a $40 network adaptor for the GC, have nothing online for the console except Phantasy Star and don't even bother to use the adapter for Mario Kart. They later take away Pilot Wings from the Gamecube, because they've got bigger plans for their next console. They repackage the GC, add a motion control and release a bunch of glorified party games in the process. I'm done with their weak attempts at console gaming.

Seriously, the Wii friend code makes online gaming with the system practically useless. If you're going to buy a console that doesn't really have online gaming, you might as well spend the same amount of money on the 360 arcade.

Oh, and wasn't there some kind of snafu about the PS3's BC, also? I might be mistaken, but I seem to recall hearing about that.

The only problem I've had with BC on my 60gig PS3, is with peripheral based games like Guitar Hero 2 and Taiko Drum Master. Guitar Hero 1 works fine though.

Knuckle Duster

09-24-2009, 03:16 AM

My 2 Cents:

I like the Wii.
I like the Xbox 360.
I like the PS3.

You're all retards.

That is all.
-KD-

PS:
http://images2.fanpop.com/images/photos/3800000/Sarcasm-Motivational-Poster-house-md-3805895-500-400.jpg

MrMatthews

09-24-2009, 03:18 AM

The only problem I've had with BC on my 60gig PS3, is with peripheral based games like Guitar Hero 2 and Taiko Drum Master. Guitar Hero 1 works fine though.

That last one wasn't a rhetorical question, so I appreciate the answer. I seem to remember hearing that you had to have the "right" PS3 model, and even then it was a "backwards compatibility is coming, we'll get back to you" kind of thing.

Granted, I barely paid attention to anything PS3-related, so that could be totally off.

ApolloBoy

09-24-2009, 03:23 AM

Maybe it's the California air? It just makes us open-minded to new video game experiences :p

Having all three systems under one roof certainly helps. My brother and dad don't hog their systems at all, so I could play a game on any one of them if I felt like it. For example, if I want to play Resistance on my dad's PS3, I'll wait until my dad's done watching TV and I'll pop it in the PS3. Same goes for the Wii and 360. I remember playing Wii Sports a lot when my brother first got his Wii and I really had fun playing with my siblings in a CoD 4 match on the 360.

I just don't get console fanboyism I guess.

17daysolderthannes

09-24-2009, 03:24 AM

Calm down there, Turbo.

I don't think the idea of a cartridge adapter is dumb, I think the fact that you're pissed off at Nintendo for not creating that imaginary product is dumb. Really really dumb. Damn you Ford for not giving me a condom dispenser in my car!!! See how ridiculous that sounds?

Last time I checked, when someone calls something "the future", they're saying that it's the next big thing. Not that it's just coming soon. I think you realized how ridiculous you sounded, but instead of backing down, you chose to take the "that's not what I really meant!" route. And I don't care if you didn't know it was $300, you should've. You don't research things, which is evident in most of your anti-Wii arguments, and you need to start doing so if you want to be taken seriously.

I'm not mad that they didn't make cartridge adapters, just pointing one of the many potential items they could make for the Wii that long time fans would appreciate that they didn't in favor of more blatant money whoring. PS3 lets you use any laptop hard drive that will plug in, any USB controller, any 3rd party accessories, you used to be able to install Linux, tell me if I'm blowing your mind with Sony's fucking phenominal support for what "hardcore gamers" want. Again, I'm being unreasonable for suggesting something incredibly similar to products released on previous consoles made by the same company? Calling catridge adapters far fetched from the company with Super GameBoy and the GBA player is like saying a controller with two joysticks and rumble is far fetched from the company that brought you the "dual shock" controller (and don't give me the BS about how it wasn't there at launch, that was strictly legal BS, Sony WANTED it there). The Wii is backwards compatible, just not in a useful way, only in a money grubbing douched out way.

I didn't research the Zeebo because it was an item of fleeting interest I thought people would find food for thought of what was going on in the rest of the world. And, in spite of your constant denial, that system IS very close to what we'll see in the future, just our version will be more powerful. Aside from that, it'll be the same shit. Sorry if I'm not the best at navigating pages in PORTUGUESE to figure out the price. Lets see you dig up the hot new Wii titles on a portuguese-only website. And, aside from the price, I really like the idea. Cell phones have some really fun games that are almost unplayable due to shitty keypad controls and a $50 console that could play mobile games would be awesome.

gamevet

09-24-2009, 03:24 AM

And I don't care what Mike from Gamecritics thinks of the Wii.

It's just one example of many, that shows the frustration of Wii owners that want to see a lineup of real games.

He's just as much of a gamer as I am. There is literally no difference between me and Mike, which just proves the point that value is subjective! Why can't people like what they like? Why do you or anyone else give a darn?

Why do I give a darn? I give a darn, because Nintendo is capable of so much more than what they're doing with the Wii. Just look at the DS; it's got a ton of great gaming ideas and cool software.

I was a big fan of Nintendo (and Sega as well) and they've pretty much lost the edge they had when they were creating games for the NES, SNES and Gameboy. Handing money to Nintendo for sub-par product, when everyone knows they are capable of so much more, is like telling Nintendo you're okay with the direction they are trying to take the industry.

I just don't get console fanboyism I guess.

Why does it have to be about fanboyism, because you don't agree about a products value?

I hold no loyalty to any of these companies. I spend my money on a product that has value and furthers the industry as well. I had all 3 consoles last generation, all 3 the generation before and all 3 during the 16-bit era as well.

17daysolderthannes

09-24-2009, 03:26 AM

My 2 Cents:

I like the Wii.
I like the Xbox 360.
I like the PS3.

You're all retards.

That is all.
-KD-

I like the Genesis, we still agree on that, right?

InternalPrimate

09-24-2009, 03:26 AM

I'm not mad that they didn't make cartridge adapters, just pointing one of the many potential items they could make for the Wii that long time fans would appreciate that they didn't in favor of more blatant money whoring. PS3 lets you use any laptop hard drive that will plug in, any USB controller, any 3rd party accessories, you used to be able to install Linux, tell me if I'm blowing your mind with Sony's fucking phenominal support for what "hardcore gamers" want. Again, I'm being unreasonable for suggesting something incredibly similar to products released on previous consoles made by the same company? Calling catridge adapters far fetched from the company with Super GameBoy and the GBA player is like saying a controller with two joysticks and rumble is far fetched from the company that brought you the "dual shock" controller (and don't give me the BS about how it wasn't there at launch, that was strictly legal BS, Sony WANTED it there). The Wii is backwards compatible, just not in a useful way, only in a money grubbing douched out way.

I didn't research the Zeebo because it was an item of fleeting interest I thought people would find food for thought of what was going on in the rest of the world. And, in spite of your constant denial, that system IS very close to what we'll see in the future, just our version will be more powerful. Aside from that, it'll be the same shit. Sorry if I'm not the best at navigating pages in PORTUGUESE to figure out the price. Lets see you dig up the hot new Wii titles on a portuguese-only website. And, aside from the price, I really like the idea. Cell phones have some really fun games that are almost unplayable due to shitty keypad controls and a $50 console that could play mobile games would be awesome.

No joke, I speak Portuguese. Soooo... that's just funny :D

And just for the record, I LOVE where Nintendo is headed in the industry. Too bad that you don't, since that's where the rest of the gaming industry is headed to.

kool kitty89

09-24-2009, 03:36 AM

That's a huge cop out though.

#1 a used Gamecube is like $20 and won't even sell at that price. You could even get them new at that price not too long ago

#2 It's virtually the same hardware as the Gamecube, it would be incredibly unnacceptable if it wasn't backwards compatible.

you would've done better just skipping the Wii and kept on truckin with your Gamecube. Hell, the Gamecube is known for being one of the most reliable video game systems to date, why not run it into the ground instead of buying a $250 console with motion controls you won't use?

Isn't it obvious yet why Nintendo isn't releasing Gamecube games? Duh! so they can FORCE their customers to buy new hardware, even if they don't like/want motion controls. I'd like to punch the CEO of Nintendo square in the balls for these shenanigans they've been up to lately.

Yeah, same thing for Xbox, even today the old Xbox hardware is pretty decent (probably the best overall of the lest gen). But wit the Wii it should be rediculously simple to port games to the GC (and vice versa), so yeah, that is kind of lame, and even with the relatively small GC userbase, it could still probably be profitable... (and any game not ported to the Wii specifically would still be playable as you mentioned) I wonder if the whole legal issue about producing the GC controller had anything to do with the decision.

We've got a couple dozzen GC games (including both Sonic Adventures), many of which we play fairly often, but the BC in the Wii is more of a bonus/convienience.
As to why we got a Wii... that's kind of a long story, involving a gift preordered Twilight Princess which we decided to upgrade to Wii when the release was delayed and due to heavy encouragement from my Grandpa (who gave us the preorder and subsequently a $250 GameStop gift card). Thogh we ended up buying our Wii online from Walmart as GS was chronically short... and we still haven't spent that gift card... Otherwise, I'm not entirely sure we'd have a Wii, maybe we'd have just stuck with the GC (and older stuff as well, our N64 and SNES is always set up, with NES occasionally, and the recent Genesis+CD collection slowly building). I have no idea to be sure, as I've stated before we tend to buy used (wii being the first exception besides our 1989 NES and I think a GBC and GBA -both being special pokemon editions for my little brother)
Hell maybe we'd have considered a PS2, though I really doubt that, particularly given the Xbox we got from my uncle a couple years ago. If anything we'd probably have continued to build the GC library, get some more Xbox stuff, and top that off with PC games. (which have always been fairly strong for us, though not so much as of late, but ~4 years ago my dad, brother, and I would often play LAN games, co-op Serious Sam/SS 2nd Encounter in particular) That and th emany games we started years ago and still want to finish. (MDK 2, and some of the Myst and Zork series in particular)

I have had my Wii since early 2007 and still do not own a single Gamecube game, take that to the bank. What is worth playing is WAY too expensive. Do all the RE games tend to be expensive? (RE4 being kind of a non factor, but the exclusives...) A lot of the common (especially 1st party) games tend to be pretty cheap, picked up Metroid Prime (1) at P&T for $4.99 a few weeks back. (used, but complete with manual in actual case, in decent condition)

But as long as you brought up the PS3, how much was it again when it launched? Back when the Wii (again, offering out-of-the-box WiFi and BC) was $250?

Yeah, and Wii lacks ethernet... So the PS3 is the only one that does both out of the box.

And just for the record, I LOVE where Nintendo is headed in the industry. Too bad that you don't, since that's where the rest of the gaming industry is headed to.

If you mean cheaping out on hardware in favor of shifting the market to a specific different gamer crowd (granted, parts of which Nintendo had pushed for in the past), I dissagree. What they've done with the Wii is great from a buisness aspect, and probably the best thing they could have done to break through Sony and Microsoft, but I sure hope the industry evolves past this with th enext gen, Nintendo in particular. Now, if they push some cutting endge consoe hardware, along with refinements of what motion (and pointer) controlls have brought (and reducing the major flaws), along with realizing certain types of games play better without motion controlls (or at least providing th eoption for conventional controls). If they can bring all that together, with a system not focusing mainly on the family/kid freindly, casual, or "hardcore" markets specicially, but really creating a diverse gaming experience, well... That would be awsome, and It's the best I can hope for.

Knuckle Duster

09-24-2009, 03:38 AM

I like the Genesis, we still agree on that, right?

:ok:

old man

09-24-2009, 06:39 AM

I'm thinking of getting a wii. There's lots of cool looking software coming out for it. To IP's list of stuff that I'm also interested in I'll add:

Murasamasa: the demon blade
The house of the dead: overkill
Little king's Story
Metroid Prime Trilogy (new controls for the old games)
Punch Out

And this neat looking little game that I think will be awesome if hudson doesn't screw it up.

http://nintendo.joystiq.com/2009/09/01/tower-of-shadow-renamed-lost-in-shadow/

MrMatthews

09-24-2009, 09:59 AM

Yeah, and Wii lacks ethernet... So the PS3 is the only one that does both out of the box.

No, the Wii still does both out of the box. Just because it doesn't have an ethernet port doesn't take away its Wifi functionality.

TheEdge

09-24-2009, 10:23 AM

how can someone have a piece of hardware fail FOUR times and still buy software for it? I have been a Mac fan all of my life, if my computer suffered catastrophic failure 4 times in a short time span (a year or less) and it wasn't somehow directly my fault, I would never buy a Mac again. Do you enjoy the prospect of not being able to play your XBOX 360 library once Microsoft discontinues the system and won't repair it for free anymore? Do you plan on continuing to buy them used one after another? One of the things I love most about Sega hardware is how resilient it is (with few exceptions like the eventual failure of capacitors in GameGears and the alleged laser problems of the DC). I simply cannot understand why anyone would continue to support the XBOX 360. Am I crazy for finding the PS3 the only worthwhile system of this generation? Say what you will about the games, the PS3 works, the controllers aren't garbage, you can buy accessories for less than half the price of the console ($100 Wi-Fi adapter for 360, woot!), and mini-games are nowhere in sight. How that isn't an epic win for this generation is a mystery to me.

I think I've said the same sentiments over and over again on this and many other forums but I guess I will say it again.

If you buy something and it continually breaks do you continue to buy it? The answer dear consumers is a resounding NO.

You don't continue to buy something that breaks. Its not worth buying. There is only one good system out there and that is the PS3 which is drowning in irony because the only system worth buying has been literally crippled since its release by a HUGE price tag.

Wii on the other hand was a great idea gone bad because we COULD have had a console that was just as good as the other ones XFAIL and PS-Small fortune but was ruined by the developers because they based the whole dam system on motion controls. Yes, we get the gimmick. Move the remote and your character moves. WOW! We are impressed.....ten years ago when it was on the Dreamcast.

I don't know which system I'm more pissed off about. The Wii because it had the potential to be great and had Sega's support behind it or the PS3 because it IS the best system of this generation but for some reason the top corporate exec's think that everyone has a few grand to blow on a weekend shopping spree.

but back to the point. Consumers. STOP BUYING THINGS THAT BREAK. If your friend, his friend, his friend's friend, His friend's father, His friend's mother, his friend's sister, cousins, roomates, uncle, aunt, grandfather ALL had their XBOX360's fail on them.....then I think its safe to say that maybe the quality isn't there and should not be bought.

The prosecution rests

Devil N

09-24-2009, 10:59 AM

And what about the thousands of people who have had their Xbox 360 for years without any kind of hardware failure? Should they also stop supporting the machine, just because mr. Internet says so?

WarmSignal

09-24-2009, 11:11 AM

Well, I'll be getting one...

I've been waiting for this price drop for a while actually, just didn't know it would come this soon.

It's funny seeing people try to sell used Wiis in the paper that came out yesterday for $270, and their crappy fat ps3s and non-elite 360s for about $400 - $500.

TheEdge

09-24-2009, 11:13 AM

just because mr. Internet says so?

Let me tackle your snarky remark first. I didn't learn about RROD's on the internet. I learned of RROD's from my friend who had to mail back in XBOX360 5 times. After that I started to do some research on it and found that quite a lot of people have been experiencing the same problem. So the first thing I said was..."I'm glad I didn't buy that"

My brother in law actually has an RROD Xbox360 in his basement collecting dust. Its not his, it belongs to his friend that just gave it to him because it died (RROD) and he didn't know what else to do with it.

People on this forum sure do love being corrected :roll:

And what about the thousands of people who have had their Xbox 360 for years without any kind of hardware failure? Should they also stop supporting the machine,

I'm happy for those people. They got what they paid for, a working system. Not a giant useless hunk of plastic that turns red when you plug it in.

Problem is that those people seem to be the minority.

gamevet

09-24-2009, 11:24 AM

I'm happy for those people. They got what they paid for, a working system. Not a giant useless hunk of plastic that turns red when you plug it in.

Problem is that those people seem to be the minority.

Actually, that's the worst thing that can happen to you. I know a guy that bought his system at launch, was lucky enough to have it last until this past month and got screwed over, because he system was out of the warranty period. You're better off having a system that fails once a year, so that the warranty keeps going.

The system has 3 key components that fail. It could be the DVD drive, the power supply, or the X-clamp. Mine had two components fail, before it finally lit up the RROD.

TheEdge

09-24-2009, 11:33 AM

Actually, that's the worst thing that can happen to you. I know a guy that bought his system at launch, was lucky enough to have it last until this past month and got screwed over, because he system was out of the warranty period. You're better off having a system that fails once a year, so that the warranty keeps going.
The system has 3 key components that fail. It could be the DVD drive, the power supply, or the X-clamp. Mine had two components fail, before it finally lit up the RROD.

Wow, that really sucks, maybe he should have traded it in for a Wii or PS3 while it was still working.

Devil N

09-24-2009, 11:47 AM

Let me tackle your snarky remark first. I didn't learn about RROD's on the internet.

...

People on this forum sure do love being corrected :roll:
First, you assumed I meant you in particular with my 'snarky' remark, but I didn't. You're not the only one crying murder over the 360's failure rate, there are dozens of people like you on the internet. That's the whole point. If it were just you, we could just ignore you and move on.

Second, whether you like it or not, from my point of view you are part of mr. Internet. I haven't met anyone in real life yet who has their 360 fail on them, so every story I've heard has only come from the internet, including yours.

I'm happy for those people. They got what they paid for, a working system. Not a giant useless hunk of plastic that turns red when you plug it in.

Problem is that those people seem to be the minority.
Are you really so certain about that? The only solid numbers I have seen so far, even the most pessimistic, seem to suggest the number of people with problems are still a minority. Of course, many of those people are very vocal about it, especially on the internet, so it is easy to assume that they are a majority. But in reality, it's just jumping to conclusions based on speculation.

Let me get something straight: I'm not denying that the problems with the 360 are bad. Of course, the failure rate is much much higher than it should be. But you're making it sound like every single Xbox 360 out there will keel over and die if you only so much as look at it. That's exaggerated of course. If my 360 still works well after three and a half years, without any special treatment on my part, then is it so strange to assume that there are thousands, perhaps millions, of other people out there with the same positive experience? Besides, the problems have not been nearly as bad after Microsoft retooled the console's design.

Now, I'm not saying you shouldn't be allowed to express your opinion on the Xbox 360's malaise, but you should understand one thing: the scare tactics that you and others like you are using hurt the enjoyment that people like me are getting from the machine, for no good reason. It may also scare away people who would otherwise have found many years of pleasure from the 360. Are your convictions so important that you would deny them their fun?

TheEdge

09-24-2009, 12:15 PM

First, you assumed I meant you in particular with my 'snarky' remark, but I didn't. You're not the only one crying murder over the 360's failure rate, there are dozens of people like you on the internet. That's the whole point. If it were just you, we could just ignore you and move on.

First off let me just say you ignored nearly 90% of my post. Ok, now that that's said......

lol, Dozens? Try hundreds of thousands....all saying the same exact thing. Sounds like a consensus to me.

Second, whether you like it or not, from my point of view you are part of mr. Internet. I haven't met anyone in real life yet who has their 360 fail on them, so every story I've heard has only come from the internet, including yours.

Then I guess you don't know a lot of people.

Are you really so certain about that? The only solid numbers I have seen so far, even the most pessimistic, seem to suggest the number of people with problems are still a minority. Of course, many of those people are very vocal about it, especially on the internet, so it is easy to assume that they are a majority. But in reality, it's just jumping to conclusions based on speculation.

17days, literally repairs these things for a living. So there is enough XBOX360's failing in the wild to actually create a vocation just repairing them. Not to mention all of the stories my friends and people on the web have told me. Its a pandemic of hardware failure.

Let me get something straight: I'm not denying that the problems with the 360 are bad. Of course, the failure rate is much much higher than it should be. But you're making it sound like every single Xbox 360 out there will keel over and die if you only so much as look at it. That's exaggerated of course. If my 360 still works well after three and a half years, without any special treatment on my part, then is it so strange to assume that there are thousands, perhaps millions, of other people out there with the same positive experience? Besides, the problems have not been nearly as bad after Microsoft retooled the console's design.

ummmm......I'm not saying that every single XBOX360 will fail. Only most of them, thus making them a bad investment.

Now, I'm not saying you shouldn't be allowed to express your opinion on the Xbox 360's malaise, but you should understand one thing: the scare tactics that you and others like you are using hurt the enjoyment that people like me are getting from the machine, for no good reason. It may also scare away people who would otherwise have found many years of pleasure from the 360. Are your convictions so important that you would deny them their fun?

lol, Its called Freedom of Speech. We here on planet earth like to use it occasionally. What would happen if there was a toaster or something that constantly broke. If you owned that toaster and were getting "enjoyment" out of it would you be upset that I would be telling you the facts?

XBOX360's fail and they fail in HIGH numbers. This is not "scare" tactics. This is a fact. Kind of like those cars that used to blow up when they would experience rear end collisions. If you owned that car would it "RUIN YOUR ENJOYMENT" if I warned you against buying one or keeping it?

In conclusion, I'm not denying anyone of their video gaming enjoyment. I'm just discussing the reality of the situation. If that bothers people who are attached to a machine they play video games on then so be it. Those people need to seek help if they covet a material possesion so much.

They don't call XBOX360's - XFAIL's for no reason. :cool:

Devil N

09-24-2009, 01:06 PM

First off let me just say you ignored nearly 90% of my post. Ok, now that that's said......
What part exactly did I ignore? Just because you personally know a couple of sob stories doesn't change my point.

lol, Dozens? Try hundreds of thousands....all saying the same exact thing. Sounds like a consensus to me.
Consensus is when everyone more or less agrees on something. You're conveniently ignoring the hundreds of thousands of people who don't violently thrash the internet with their complaints, simply because they have nothing to complain about.

By the way, it's very petty when you're trying to correct me on semantics. 'Dozens' isn't meant as an exact number, it's just a figure of speech. You know that.

17days, literally repairs these things for a living. So there is enough XBOX360's failing in the wild to actually create a vocation just repairing them. Not to mention all of the stories my friends and people on the web have told me. Its a pandemic of hardware failure.
It's considerably higher than average and I'll readily admit that. Even Microsoft does. And yes, there will certainly be people making a living out of 360 repairs, but the same goes for any piece of hardware. Hardware dies and needs repair. If 17days has found his niche by specializing in 360 hardware, then that's great for him. Of course, it also means that every 360 he gets in his hands is broken, so it's easy for him to get pessimistic about the console in general. But it doesn't tell me anything about the actual numbers. 17days isn't the only person repairing 360's and not every broken 360 gets sent to 17days, so I cannot call that representative.

Which makes me wonder, can you back up your statements that the 'majority' of 360's fail with any sound statistics, plus a reliable source? If so, then we are actually talking about something here.

ummmm......I'm not saying that every single XBOX360 will fail. Only most of them, thus making them a bad investment.
Just a few posts back you said that the Xbox 360 continually breaks (period) and vocally proclaimed that people should stop buying them. I think that's a slightly less nuanced statement than the one above. 'Bad investment' is something that's still arguable. Also, I'm still not sold on the 'most' part.

lol, Its called Freedom of Speech. We here on planet earth like to use it occasionally. What would happen if there was a toaster or something that constantly broke. If you owned that toaster and were getting "enjoyment" out of it would you be upset that I would be telling you the facts?
You're touching on an interesting subject that's getting a lot of attention in my country as of late. Freedom Of Speech is not the same as the Right To Insult. I will never deny you your freedom of speech, and I explicitly said so. But when you're openly insulting something that I hold in a positive light, can you understand that I become agitated? Especially since you're presenting it as FACT, while you're actually only basing your statements on stories you've heard.

XBOX360's fail and they fail in HIGH numbers. This is not "scare" tactics. This is a fact. Kind of like those cars that used to blow up when they would experience rear end collisions. If you owned that car would it "RUIN YOUR ENJOYMENT" if I warned you against buying one or keeping it?
Maybe, yes. If I bought a classic car that holds a special nostalgic value to me, and the chances of me getting a collision really aren't that big, then these sort of nightmare stories would probably ruin part of my enjoyment.

Same thing happens with the 360. All these stories floating around on the internet are making me ever so slightly hesitant to buy new games for the console, out of fear that it might break at some point. At the same time, I know I shouldn't let myself get scared like that, because so far everything has worked out fine for me.

They don't call XBOX360's - XFAIL's for no reason. :cool:
Calling things or people names isn't really that cool.

InternalPrimate

09-24-2009, 01:06 PM

WarmSignal and Old_Man, I think you'll really enjoy your purchase :)

17daysolderthannes

09-24-2009, 01:09 PM

It's just one example of many, that shows the frustration of Wii owners that want to see a lineup of real games.

Why do I give a darn? I give a darn, because Nintendo is capable of so much more than what they're doing with the Wii. Just look at the DS; it's got a ton of great gaming ideas and cool software.

I was a big fan of Nintendo (and Sega as well) and they've pretty much lost the edge they had when they were creating games for the NES, SNES and Gameboy. Handing money to Nintendo for sub-par product, when everyone knows they are capable of so much more, is like telling Nintendo you're okay with the direction they are trying to take the industry.

Why does it have to be about fanboyism, because you don't agree about a products value?

I hold no loyalty to any of these companies. I spend my money on a product that has value and furthers the industry as well. I had all 3 consoles last generation, all 3 the generation before and all 3 during the 16-bit era as well.

I think I've said the same sentiments over and over again on this and many other forums but I guess I will say it again.

If you buy something and it continually breaks do you continue to buy it? The answer dear consumers is a resounding NO.

You don't continue to buy something that breaks. Its not worth buying. There is only one good system out there and that is the PS3 which is drowning in irony because the only system worth buying has been literally crippled since its release by a HUGE price tag.

Wii on the other hand was a great idea gone bad because we COULD have had a console that was just as good as the other ones XFAIL and PS-Small fortune but was ruined by the developers because they based the whole dam system on motion controls. Yes, we get the gimmick. Move the remote and your character moves. WOW! We are impressed.....ten years ago when it was on the Dreamcast.

I don't know which system I'm more pissed off about. The Wii because it had the potential to be great and had Sega's support behind it or the PS3 because it IS the best system of this generation but for some reason the top corporate exec's think that everyone has a few grand to blow on a weekend shopping spree.

but back to the point. Consumers. STOP BUYING THINGS THAT BREAK. If your friend, his friend, his friend's friend, His friend's father, His friend's mother, his friend's sister, cousins, roomates, uncle, aunt, grandfather ALL had their XBOX360's fail on them.....then I think its safe to say that maybe the quality isn't there and should not be bought.

The prosecution rests

this^

If Microsoft offered the quality other brands offered, I would probably love them, but there is a consistent pattern of epic failure with everything Microsoft I buy. Anyone with half a brain forms an opinion of a brand or product for a reason, only retards support Nintendo because it's Nintendo or Microsoft because it's Microsoft and they somehow feel like they should. I am a die hard Apple computer fan but that didn't stop me from laughing at people spending exorbitant amounts of money for iPods when similar functioning MP3 players existed at half the price. However, when the iPhone came along and offered great functionality with a great user interface and bulletproof reliability, I jumped for it and it was the best decision of my life.

Like I keep saying, it's not the motion controls I don't like (though I don't always feel like jumping around after a long day, I like to relax when I play games), it's the half-assed use of them. If you support the Wii, you are saying "good enough for me!" and it will not get any better. If you boycott it, Nintendo will have no choice but to do something to make it deliver on what people know it can do.

And what about the thousands of people who have had their Xbox 360 for years without any kind of hardware failure? Should they also stop supporting the machine, just because mr. Internet says so?

I would argue that most of those people either don't play it often or don't play it for long enough periods of time to make it happen. Not only did I have stock piles of broken 360s, some that looked like they were fresh out of the box, to fix at my Play N Trade job, but I have had plenty of friends at school tell me about their 3rd or 4th 360 RROD (1, 2, and 3 light, 3 totally separate epic failures) but even at my engineering job at a company of SEVEN people one of the shop guys has had his fail at least once, maybe twice. The other one that has a 360 does all kinds of voodoo dances in hopes his won't. The shop manager and the draftsman said "f-that" and both have PS3s. Hell, even at the Play N Trade I worked for EVERY SINGLE EMPLOYEE except for ONE had RROD. They all were on their high horse "oh, its not that bad, people are making a big deal out of nothing" and then BAM! all of them got RROD within a few days/weeks of each other. I am not making this up, this is shit beyond belief. I understand your denial, I didn't want to believe the pre-cat failure prevalent on my car was as widespread as it probably was, but it didn't stop me from putting in a catless performance header to rid myself of the possibility. It sucks because there is no way in hell I could ever pass inspection in California or New England (Louisiana doesn't give a fuck, lol). At least with that failure, however, the recall worked somewhat (see less and less reports since the recall happened) and it didn't happen until 100,000+ miles, and my car is 7 years old with just under 40,000.

InternalPrimate

09-24-2009, 02:02 PM

Buying an iPhone was the best decision of your life? Yikes.

Da_Shocker

09-24-2009, 02:04 PM

I do have to jump in on here in Microsoft's defense the original Xbox never had any issues like the 360 so it's not like M$ has a long standing of horribly designed consoles. Remember the the first PSx and the PS2 weren't exactly the most sturdy systems and they easily had the highest failure rate during those generations.

TheEdge

09-24-2009, 02:06 PM

What part exactly did I ignore? Just because you personally know a couple of sob stories doesn't change my point.

So you admit you omitted a large percentage of my post. :cool:

Consensus is when everyone more or less agrees on something. You're conveniently ignoring the hundreds of thousands of people who don't violently thrash the internet with their complaints, simply because they have nothing to complain about.

#1 - I'm not violently thrashing anything.

#2. I think most of the gaming / technological community are in agreement that there is something wrong with most of Microsoft's products ESPECIALLY the XBOX360

By the way, it's very petty when you're trying to correct me on semantics. 'Dozens' isn't meant as an exact number, it's just a figure of speech. You know that.

"Dozens" is a very low ball estimate considering the huge number of RROD cases. I wasn't correcting you I just wanted to give you a number that I thought would be closer to the truth.

It's considerably higher than average and I'll readily admit that. Even Microsoft does. And yes, there will certainly be people making a living out of 360 repairs, but the same goes for any piece of hardware. Hardware dies and needs repair. If 17days has found his niche by specializing in 360 hardware, then that's great for him. Of course, it also means that every 360 he gets in his hands is broken, so it's easy for him to get pessimistic about the console in general. But it doesn't tell me anything about the actual numbers. 17days isn't the only person repairing 360's and not every broken 360 gets sent to 17days, so I cannot call that representative.

Hardware dies? I've had a Genesis model 1 (no high definition graphics claim) for 20 years, I've had a Dreamcast for 10 years since launch date and it still works like a charm. Yes, hardware sometimes dies but low quality hardware dies more often. Microsoft should have recalled and fixed the problem instead of ignoring it and allowing it to fester for so long.

Which makes me wonder, can you back up your statements that the 'majority' of 360's fail with any sound statistics, plus a reliable source? If so, then we are actually talking about something here.

Just type in RROD. Use a search engine and see how many hits you get. I'm no tech reporter.

Just a few posts back you said that the Xbox 360 continually breaks (period) and vocally proclaimed that people should stop buying them. I think that's a slightly less nuanced statement than the one above. 'Bad investment' is something that's still arguable. Also, I'm still not sold on the 'most' part.

RROD claims are well known thus making the hardware "continually break". That's the reason why I think XBOX360's are not good investment. I would rather by a Wii or PS3 any day of the week other than a XBOX360.

You're touching on an interesting subject that's getting a lot of attention in my country as of late. Freedom Of Speech is not the same as the Right To Insult. I will never deny you your freedom of speech, and I explicitly said so. But when you're openly insulting something that I hold in a positive light, can you understand that I become agitated? Especially since you're presenting it as FACT, while you're actually only basing your statements on stories you've heard.[

Actually, the Freedom of Speech allows you to say just about anything. Insults included. You should read our (USA) Bill of Rights and Constitution. Its probably the best legal document ever created in the history of mankind.

And No, I'm not insulting the hardware. I'm just giving my take on how silly consumers are and how unreliable the hardware is.

That's not insulting. That's giving you opinion on something based on facts and experience.

Maybe, yes. If I bought a classic car that holds a special nostalgic value to me, and the chances of me getting a collision really aren't that big, then these sort of nightmare stories would probably ruin part of my enjoyment.

Same thing happens with the 360. All these stories floating around on the internet are making me ever so slightly hesitant to buy new games for the console, out of fear that it might break at some point. At the same time, I know I shouldn't let myself get scared like that, because so far everything has worked out fine for me.

Well, As I said in the first post I'm very happy for you and the rest of the 10 people who still have working XBOX360's. I hope you guys get your full enjoyment out of the hardware and wish no ill will on you but you have to face reality and see how your 'precious' white RROD machine has had numerous problems in its quality assurance history.

InternalPrimate

09-24-2009, 02:12 PM

Having Edge on ignore is so relaxing! Highly recommended. Now here's something way more valuable than anything Edge could say:

http://i226.photobucket.com/albums/dd281/nwing759/ricky_karl_steve.jpg

+1 to anyone who can complete this sentence: "I could eat a _____ at night."

TheEdge

09-24-2009, 02:15 PM

Having Edge on ignore is so relaxing! Highly recommended. Now here's something way more valuable than anything Edge could say

Vintage IP, passive aggresive comment! Also isn't it ironic that he has me on ignore yet still talks about me? Strange right?

All in favor of changing his name to Mr. Huffy Lumpkins? YAy!

runback22

09-24-2009, 02:16 PM

I own 2 xbox 360s...One is a launch model, the other is 1 year old. The launch model has died once a year and the other one has already gone out. I rarely touched my ps3 since launch. After this last RR, the 360 has made me do a 180 and now, I buy all my games on the PS3 unless it is a xbox exclusive.

I hardly touch my 360 now. It will be out of the extended warranty in 2 months. I'm sure it will break next year and I will not pay to fix it and I sure as hell wont reward MS by buying a new one.

On topic with the Wii, the new price point is still $198 to much. I would touch that crap with a ten foot wiimote. Even the virtual console, which would be the only redeeming thing on the wii, is overpriced.

Devil N

09-24-2009, 02:36 PM

#1 - I'm not violently thrashing anything.
Again, I'm not talking about you in particular, but about the internet in general, as per my first post in this discussion. You're not so bad in that respect and even if you were, I know when to ignore you. But it's hard to ignore the storm flood of overreactions on the internet.

#2. I think most of the gaming / technological community are in agreement that there is something wrong with most of Microsoft's products ESPECIALLY the XBOX360
Oh, I agree that there's something wrong with the Xbox 360. It's just not as bad as *some* would make it out to be. This isn't a black-and-white situation, where it's either good or bad, it's a shade of gray.

And when it comes to Microsoft products in general, my only real complaint is with their software. Not only the usual Windows complaints, but as a software developer I am often horrified by the quality of their programming APIs.

Hardware dies? I've had a Genesis model 1 (no high definition graphics claim) for 20 years, I've had a Dreamcast for 10 years since launch date and it still works like a charm. Yes, hardware sometimes dies but low quality hardware dies more often. Microsoft should have recalled and fixed the problem instead of ignoring it and allowing it to fester for so long.
I certainly agree there too.

But in their defense, Microsoft has already acknowledged most of the problems, stepped up their warranty and repair policies, and fixed most of the hardware's design flaws. For Microsoft in particular that's a pretty big thing. What more do you want them to do?

Even so, you can never expect the Xbox 360 to last as long as the Genesis or Dreamcast, simply because it has more moving parts, working at higher speeds and with higher temperatures. That's a problem with most cutting edge electronics nowadays.

Just type in RROD. Use a search engine and see how many hits you get. I'm no tech reporter.
Number of Google hits is anything but a reliable statistic. At the very least, you'd need the number of returned 360's vs. the total number of 360's that were sold. Preferably, those numbers should be divided over several time periods. Turn those figures into percentages and we've got something to talk about.

Actually, the Freedom of Speech allows you to say just about anything. Insults included. You should read our (USA) Bill of Rights and Constitution. Its probably the best legal document ever created in the history of mankind.
By that rationale, you should also be allowed to discriminate. And we both know that's not allowed (at least, not anymore). But I think we're moving too much into politics territory here, and there's a separate thread for that.

Well, As I said in the first post I'm very happy for you and the rest of the 10 people who still have working XBOX360's.
Again, if you could find the actual numbers, you'd be surprised how many of us are out there. You just don't hear much from us.

your 'precious' white RROD machine
Actually, mine's black. And no, it's not an Elite. ;)

Vintage IP, passive aggresive comment! Also isn't it ironic that he has me on ignore yet still talks about me? Strange right?

All in favor of changing his name to Mr. Huffy Lumpkins? YAy!
He has a NIN avatar, and that makes him cool in my book. Sorry, can't help it.

TheEdge

09-24-2009, 02:42 PM

By that rationale, you should also be allowed to discriminate. And we both know that's not allowed (at least, not anymore). But I think we're moving too much into politics territory here, and there's a separate thread for that.

Since we agree that most XBOX360's RROD and are not a good investment for gamers I think we should move the Freedom of Speech issue to the Politcal thread ..........but before you go there I have to say that Freedom of SPeech is for everything. If the KKK or Neo-Nazi's wants to assemble and trash on other races they are allowed to because if we would take their freedom of speech away then we lose ours as well.

Da_Shocker

09-24-2009, 03:16 PM

I'm more pissed off at M$ nickel and diming us rather than the RROD. I got a RROD and they fixed it for free no problems asked + a free moth of XBLG. No wireless out the box, gotta pay for XBLG, accessories that are overpriced way to high, no HD in every unit.

Nintendo has been doing this too. Sure the system is cheap but 39.99 for a Wiimote then another 19.99 for a nunchuck. There online service is terrible combined that with the fact that they have been making a killing off the hardware alone and man that 299 PS3 sure does look good rite now.

Deo

09-24-2009, 03:29 PM

Wiimote then another 19.99 for a nunchuck. There online service is terrible combined that with the fact that they have been making a killing off the hardware alone and man that 299 PS3 sure does look good rite now.

Don't forget the accessories, which are essentially required to play games and are never bundled with the game that needs them.

+1 to anyone who can complete this sentence: "I could eat a _____ at night."

Knob

TheEdge

09-24-2009, 03:33 PM

Chilly Willy

09-24-2009, 04:52 PM

^ This generation is the biggest rip off in video game history and consumers fell for it Hook line and sinker. Next time people should be smart enough to smell the bullshit and go back to PC gaming until the air clears.

I don't think the PS3 is a rip-off. It's got a decent game library, it plays a lot of different media (it's the best CD/DVD/BD player you'll find for the price), and the non-Slims can be used as a generic mid-level computer. If all you wanted was to play games, you might consider it a rip-off, but once you add up everything it does, if that's what you want, it's a great bargain.

TheEdge

09-24-2009, 04:53 PM

Good point, like I said before the only one that I think has any worth is the PS3. Too bad Sony screwed up its launch.

Da_Shocker

09-24-2009, 05:00 PM

Yeah the PS3 launh was horrible but at least it wasn't as bad as M$ who didn't even work out all the kinks in it's system.

Baloo

09-24-2009, 05:19 PM

Did you already have a GameCube, or did you get GC games for the Wii?

We mainly end up using the Wii for GC since out GC is packed away currently, it was less so a while ago when we had it hooked up to a second TV, but we ended up packing it up a while back and haven;t set it up again.

I got a Gamecube around 2003-2004, so yeah I already had a Gamecube.

Knuckle Duster

09-24-2009, 05:30 PM

Would it be safe to assume that 'the haters' here would find the Wii more palatable if it generally was considered 'a gamecube addon' similar to SegaCD/32X among the masses?

I thought the Cube kicked as much ass as needed during it's generation. I've already opened myself to owning more than 1 console since the 32bit era was a shell shock for traditional VS mainstream content. You needed more than a playstation to play "franchises" for at least a little while. I do see the point of argument regarding price & content availability, but not the purpose of perpetually shitting on it once that point has been made.

The Wii could be better, the whole cycle could be. Boycotting them for quality sake isn't exactly worth bitching about on a forum where people are likely to know better anyway.

17daysolderthannes

09-24-2009, 06:22 PM

^ This generation is the biggest rip off in video game history and consumers fell for it Hook line and sinker. Next time people should be smart enough to smell the bullshit and go back to PC gaming until the air clears.

Like I've said before (hello, is this thing on? mic check...mic check), the shit-tastic Wii lineup and the inaccessibly priced 360 and PS3 are the #1 reason I started retro collecting. If there isn't a system that is worth buying to me, or worth buying games for for that matter, I'll find my games elsewhere.

Would it be safe to assume that 'the haters' here would find the Wii more palatable if it generally was considered 'a gamecube addon' similar to SegaCD/32X among the masses?

I thought the Cube kicked as much ass as needed during it's generation. I've already opened myself to owning more than 1 console since the 32bit era was a shell shock for traditional VS mainstream content. You needed more than a playstation to play "franchises" for at least a little while. I do see the point of argument regarding price & content availability, but not the purpose of perpetually shitting on it once that point has been made.

The Wii could be better, the whole cycle could be. Boycotting them for quality sake isn't exactly worth bitching about on a forum where people are likely to know better anyway.

I think the Wii being a Gamecube add-on would've made it even more laughable and pathetic. From a marketing standpoint, Nintendo made a smart move by making it a whole new system, but it doesn't change the fact that it blows. You know what would make the Wii better? GOOD GAMES. I wish I would've sold my Wii in the christmas of 07 for ~$300 and banked it so I could get a PS3 slim now. *sigh*

Knuckle Duster

09-24-2009, 06:47 PM

I think the Wii being a Gamecube add-on would've made it even more laughable and pathetic. From a marketing standpoint, Nintendo made a smart move by making it a whole new system, but it doesn't change the fact that it blows. You know what would make the Wii better? GOOD GAMES. I wish I would've sold my Wii in the christmas of 07 for ~$300 and banked it so I could get a PS3 slim now. *sigh*

Your best bet at this point is to mod it to find usefulness, or then sell it for the $300+ it would be worth with whatever you got going with it.

kool kitty89

09-24-2009, 06:48 PM

this^

If Microsoft offered the quality other brands offered, I would probably love them, but there is a consistent pattern of epic failure with everything Microsoft I buy.

Did you have problems with the original Xbox? (iirc the main problem was with one of the DVD drives of a specific manufacturer, -Samsung?)

I think the Wii being a Gamecube add-on would've made it even more laughable and pathetic. From a marketing standpoint, Nintendo made a smart move by making it a whole new system, but it doesn't change the fact that it blows. You know what would make the Wii better? GOOD GAMES. I wish I would've sold my Wii in the christmas of 07 for ~$300 and banked it so I could get a PS3 slim now. *sigh*

Yeah, that would have been really silly, and definitely would not have allowed the Wii to be derived from GC hardware the way it currently is. (using chips on newer processes at higher clock speeds, addding the full sized disc drive... the RAM expansion might have been possible though, along with connectivity, flash memory and SD interface, but otherwise no) Hmm, kind of like the argument of a Sega CD+Genesis derived (enhanced) system instead of 32x (and Saturn)....

I did think of one added advantage a Wii adds for GC owners, the AV capabilities added. Particularly for the large number of owners with the GC lacking the digital output port, though the VGA output capability is also nice. (again this doesn't apply so much for us as we've got an earlier model with the Digital port along with the component cable for GC, so not an advantage for us) And of course, for any European users there's RGB via SCART, present on the analog AV port.

InternalPrimate

09-24-2009, 09:33 PM

He has a NIN avatar, and that makes him cool in my book. Sorry, can't help it.

Trent Reznor is a genius, we can all agree on that. The picture is from their show at The Palladium in Hollywood on Sep. 2nd. One of their last shows ever. They played the entire Downward Spiral, plus ten more songs! It was fantastic.

And Deo gets the +1. "I could eat a knob at night" - Karl Pilkington. Everyone here should download the Ricky Gervais podcasts immediately!

Besides that, looks like 17days is still a sour-puss. No surprise there :p

MrMatthews

09-24-2009, 09:50 PM

Knuckle Duster

09-24-2009, 09:56 PM

Insight for the Wii's lack of features, It's archaic by design:

http://hackmii.com/2009/02/why-the-wii-will-never-get-any-better/

Food for thought, and more reason for Nintendo to push for a 2010/2011 Next Gen release, backfire-or-not from dissatisfied Wii adopters.

My only gripe would be total abandonment, and a lack of 'Content transfering' to the next console. I want developers to push the next 2 years with awesome games.

kool kitty89

09-24-2009, 10:59 PM

Food for thought, and more reason for Nintendo to push for a 2010/2011 Next Gen release, backfire-or-not from dissatisfied Wii adopters.

My only gripe would be total abandonment, and a lack of 'Content transfering' to the next console. I want developers to push the next 2 years with awesome games.

Yeah, but they've got no reason to push for new hardware as long as the current stuff is going strong, look at the NES (Famicom especially) or Game Boy. (SNES being a poor example as the N64 forced delays) Sure they'll take action when popularity declines (GB) or when stiff competition appears (PC Engine, then Genesis in the US), but I don't see Nintendo rushing out a new system. (developing, yeah, but not too soon unless current trends shift) 2011 would be perfectly reasonable though, right on schedual for standard lifespan, assume Nintendo doesn't stretch things out further like the NES/GB examples.

InternalPrimate

09-24-2009, 11:22 PM

Speaking of Trent Reznor, I think he wants to weigh in on the Wii argument right now:

How that applies to Nintendo, and I'm not saying they haven't fucked up a few times too, but they have this sense of here's this game, we're aware of the limitations, but we're going to make the game great with taste and integrity. Being honest, I'm not a huge fan of Sony. Their entire strategy behind the PlayStation is to focus on gaming as an experience last and getting a Blu-ray player in your living room comes first. Now, three years later they're trying to release a motion controller that's a little bit better than the Wii's.

You're aware you're flamebaiting Sony fanboys right now.

Trent. I don't care. I'm used to controversy. I make a living off of it. [Laughs.]

The point is, do I think motion controlled gaming is the next big thing? No. It's an interesting concept, it's cool to have, but it's an input thing where I don't think that's the future of gaming. The fact that the Wii came out and has been wildly successful is because they picked up on the thing I've been saying all along. They made something simple and fun. It's something that doesn't compete with "Halo: Whatever-The-Fuck," but is actually fun and can resonate with a bunch of people in a low brow way where they didn't focus on how many buttons they could pop into the controller.

Rob: Waving the Wiimote does get boring after a while, and after a bit you say, "Just give me a button!" So, when I see Microsoft's new motion controlled Natal and I see people play it, I say to myself, "Wow, that technology looks amazing, but how many people really want to stand there and flail about all the time?"

The nice thing about the Wii is that, if you want, you can sit back like a fat-ass and just barely wiggle your wrist to get the same gameplay effect. With all this motion-controlled stuff, there's nothing tangible anymore, you aren't touching anything, you aren't getting force feedback of any kind, and it all just seems like a tech demo. Something where you use it for a while, then go, "Just give me the controller back!"

Trent: The strength of motion controllers will be if there's a killer app that makes a person go, "Fuck yeah, all right!" That's always what it comes down to. I'm glad there's innovation in that field and maybe something great will come of it, but I'm not holding my breath that the technology will redefine gaming.

Rob: There's a difference between praising the Wii as an important step and saying that motion controls are the greatest thing in the world. What was great about the Wii is that it proved that they could do something that goes back to having just pure fun, that opens up the doors to people like my mom playing. This is something the fanboys cry about, "But who cares?" Those casual gamers aren't playing Halo, they aren't bothering you in your deathmatches. The Wii is just opening up the medium to so many more people using simple, pure fun. Something that original arcade games were all about. That doesn't mean it's the future necessarily, it just means that Nintendo found a tool to open the door to others and it could go a million different ways from there.

Trent: I remember the first time I played Wii Tennis, my immediate reaction was, "Whoa!" Then there's the sound coming out of your hand and I'm all, "How the fuck?" When you show it to your mom or to your friends who come over and you see their faces light up -- that's one of those whoa-moments. One of those moments when you hear a great song or watch a great movie and get chills. That can be attained.

Rob: The strength of the Wii isn't so much the motion controller it's that, regardless what it is, you can hand it over to your girlfriend. She'll go, "How do I play this?" You just show her, "Swing it, like this, see?" Two seconds later you're playing a heated game of tennis.

Is Trent Reznor IP? The world may never know :p

Here's the full interview (http://www.joystiq.com/2009/09/24/interview-trent-reznor/)

17daysolderthannes

09-24-2009, 11:36 PM

And Edge, loathe as he is to admit it, is Wii-curious.

There are games on the system that he knows he wants to play (the reviews coming in for Dead Space Extraction are positive, BTW). I don't know why he doesn't just borrow that dusty Wii of his sister's and spend a couple weekends with some rented games. I'm sure many of us can point him in the right direction of what games to check out.

I thought you said "retard games" for second there, funny how the brain knows what should be there when the eyes say otherwise. Are you trying to get him to try Wii or try Weed? "come on man, take a hit, you'll like it, come on man, just a little try, it won't hurt"

Say nope to dope and nope to games for dopes.

Is Trent Reznor IP? The world may never know :p

If IP is Trent Reznor I'm taking all of my sister's NIN CDs and breaking them in half.

InternalPrimate

09-24-2009, 11:42 PM

If IP is Trent Reznor I'm taking all of my sister's NIN CDs and breaking them in half.

Do it. :D

kool kitty89

09-24-2009, 11:47 PM

Say nope to dope and nope to games for dopes.

Hmm, that got me thinking, whit if you said yes to both? Is the Wii a good console for stoners? :lol:

That new Silent Hill game looks interesting though, hopefully one to meet the standards of the first 3 games. (although the realtime cutscenes look like they might weaken it visually compared to the predicessors) SH4 didn't seem that great, and I haven't seen much of the others, but have heard some dissapointing stuff. Well, Origins seemed promising, but it's only for PS2 and PSP... It was the PC ports of 2 and 3 that drew us in (in fact I much prefer the save mechanism of that platform), but still haven't played SH1, and it's gotten rather expensive now even though it'd easy to emulate it. (and I don't really want to pirate it, but at the same time I wish they'd have re-released it, even in a compilation set -meaning we'd have to re-buy some we already own...)

kool kitty89

09-25-2009, 04:22 AM

Hmm, 17days, I was looking around at some prices, and a rather fair amount of good (IMO) GC and Wii games apear to be available used at decent prices. (like on Amazon) RE 0, RE Remake, Mario Sunshine, Rogue Leader, and Rebel Strike (the best in the series IMO) were all pretty fairly priced for used games. Same apears to be true for others like Metroid Prime (both), and other games that you may or may not be interested in, like the 2 Star Fox titles. (I know you don't really care for adventure games so SF Addventures is probably out, and Assault is kind of hit and miss, I liked both though).

As for Wii, there seem to be a good number of possible games, except many of the good 3rd party ones are available in similar form on other platforms, like PS2 for Ghostbusters, and many others (including the new Silent Hill game), although they do tend to look signficantly better on Wii, and sometimes smoother as well. (and Ghostbusters uses both the motion and pointer controlls quite well IMO) But agian, the cheaper PS2 alternatives may be more attractive.

House of the Dead overkill might be worth looking into, maybe the Conduit, but that's not really that great compared to many other current FPS's. (including others on Wii, like Metroid Prime III)

Devil N

09-25-2009, 04:50 AM

Speaking of Trent Reznor, I think he wants to weigh in on the Wii argument right now:

...

Is Trent Reznor IP? The world may never know :p

Here's the full interview (http://www.joystiq.com/2009/09/24/interview-trent-reznor/)
That was a fun read, thanks for pointing that out. Loved the outtakes (http://superdunner.blogspot.com/2009/09/trent-reznor-interview-lost-questions_24.html) too:

Umm, to be clear, you guys don't really look up cocks for leisure ... do you?

Trent: Well, I'm not saying that I ...

Rob: Yeah, I do.

Trent: [Laughing] Yeah, Rob does!

Mr Smith

09-25-2009, 06:06 AM

Knuckle Duster

09-25-2009, 07:00 AM

I saw a Gamecube for £15 yesterday and thought "bugger me that's cheap" and then reminded myself that the Gamecube has no good games. The same is true of the Wii and no matter how cheaply it's priced nothing is going to make me want one. Genesis Knight summed it up nicely on the first page.

I would agree with you, but can't for the fact that as it was still alive, I took it upon myself to buy one packed with Zelda Windwaker & Ocarina of Time with faith that Nintendo's first party titles will justify the purchase.

Originally my friend bought a cube at launch to play Luigi's Mansion, & Eternal Darkness. I found both games worth playing through, but not buying a console for.

Metroid Prime came out, and it 'felt' like a Metroid game. All the backlash and hatred it got was from Halo fanatics who complained about controls, where the game was not "FPS-like" while completely remaining close minded to the experience itself. (Awesome game, one of the best of the generation.)

In a sea of 'Party games' and 'Multiplayer bullshit' since the N64, That one game justified dropping 200+ bucks on a Cube to me.

I would say that the GC & Wii combined have enough good titles to warrant the later's purchase without doubt.

TheEdge

09-25-2009, 09:41 AM

MrMatthews

09-25-2009, 09:59 AM

Metroid Prime came out, and it 'felt' like a Metroid game. All the backlash and hatred it got was from Halo fanatics who complained about controls, where the game was not "FPS-like" while completely remaining close minded to the experience itself. (Awesome game, one of the best of the generation.)

In a sea of 'Party games' and 'Multiplayer bullshit' since the N64, That one game justified dropping 200+ bucks on a Cube to me.

I would say that the GC & Wii combined have enough good titles to warrant the later's purchase without doubt.

I gotta disagree with ya Smith. The Gamecube was a great little console. The resident evil games were on it, the new metroid games were on it, and quite a few other big sellers. The hardware itself was powerful as well and the controller (althought strangely designed) fit very nicely in your hands. So even though it was cut short by Nintendo it was a great system.

Yup.

There are probably about 5 or 6 must-buy game for the Cube that I think made the console worth owning. Metroid Prime was first on my list, and is why I bought it in the first place.

TheEdge

09-25-2009, 10:03 AM

Yup.

There are probably about 5 or 6 must-buy game for the Cube that I think made the console worth owning. Metroid Prime was first on my list, and is why I bought it in the first place.

Even Ikaruga is on it!

MrMatthews

09-25-2009, 10:23 AM

And you will pay HANDSOMELY for it! I bought it here locally on eBay for ~$10 and sold it on eBay for nearly $60!

Devil N

09-25-2009, 10:29 AM

TheEdge

09-25-2009, 10:39 AM

The Gamecube is the only Nintendo console I ever came close to buying. It was perhaps the most 'normal' games console Nintendo ever made, and unlike most consoles from the previous generation, it still had that genuine 'games machine' charm to it. Much like the Dreamcast, actually.

In the end, I decided not to get one. Not because I didn't want to, but because I already had plenty of consoles at that time, and the GC sadly didn't have that much to offer.

By the time I gave some thought about purchasing one I already had a Dreamcast and a PS2 so I said 3 consoles is just too much. I do have good memories of playing it. It was a very solid system. I would say that NES and Gamecube were Nintendo's best systems.

Much like the Genesis and the Dreamcast on Sega's side.

kool kitty89

09-25-2009, 07:50 PM

Hey, not completely on topic, but I noticed something about VC, supposedly: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/240p
Similarly, the Wii switches to a 240p mode in the Virtual Console for games designed for it, excluding the N64, for which games are rendered with 480 lines. But I from what I've seen the games don't display in their native resolution, Sonic 3 is 480i on our SD set, so is SMB 3... And wiki isn't the only sourse to have listed that either. (that and the N64 statement is off since a large number of games are in 240p on native hardware)

Another thing I've been wondering is if it will deinterlace GameCube games that only support 480i, when the Wii is set to 480p of course. I haven't tested this yet, but it would be useful to know for use with TVs that do a poor jub with 480i displays. (or if used with a VGA monitor, which won't support interlaced displays at all) I'd immagine it would function similarly in 480p to the Dreamcast in VGA mode, but I'm not sure.

Christuserloeser

09-25-2009, 09:32 PM

I'd immagine it would function similarly in 480p to the Dreamcast in VGA mode, but I'm not sure.

Dreamcast renders practically everything in 640x480p60, and its VGA mode allows to output it.

-there is no deinterlacing or anything. It renders it natively.

It has a 240p mode though, but even that gets upscanned to 480p natively.

kool kitty89

09-25-2009, 11:20 PM

Knuckle Duster

09-25-2009, 11:24 PM

Maybe I'm remembering wrong about the GC, but I don't remember all games offering progressive scan in the options. (maybe there was an option in the start-up menu) Maybe it's just widcsreen I was thinking of.

Progressive Scan, You needed to hold B (or something like that) while powering it on or "booting" the game, i'm not sure. It wasn't an option in the menu IIRC.

kool kitty89

09-26-2009, 04:09 AM

I think some games automatically prompt you when start the game as well, I think holding B got you to the main menu, maybe that was A, it's been a while since I used our GC. (been using thw Wii instead as I mentioned)
I did get the prompt for running in interlaced or progressive after reseting Star Fox Adventures on the Wii. (and while still in GameCube mode)

If all games rendered in 480p, that would make things rather straightforward, as with the DC. (and Wii I assume)

sketch

09-26-2009, 09:57 PM

The GC was a decent machine; but the Wii is not. It has some good games (not great, but good), and they are just extensions of GC games (including similar graphics). There's nothing compelling about either console, although in the case of the GC, that's more software preference than anything else. I truly feel the Wii doesn't have much to offer anyone. I know so many people who bought one and never play it...

Christuserloeser

09-26-2009, 10:19 PM

Well, the Wii is a GC. It also is a N64, and a SNES, and a NES, and a Mega Drive / Genesis, and a Neo-Geo, and a PC-Engine / TG-16, and a Master System, and a C64, plus it has WiiWare stuff like Contra ReBirth. Of all of this generation's consoles it has by far the best selection of games - because it potentially replaces two billion other consoles.

Of course if you, like me, own some of these systems already, it looses quite a bit of its appeal, but no modded Xbox nor dedicated emulation PC replaces its N64 and GC compatibility.

And then there also are Nintendo's Wii games - like Paper Mario or New Super Mario Bros.

I don't really get it. The Wii's a wet dream of a retro gamer, yet people keep complaining.

kool kitty89

09-26-2009, 10:21 PM

Also, I noticed some of the emulation is off on VC games, while some things are blatent, like Commodore 64 stuff, there are some problems with more coomon things like Genesis titles. I noticed the ring sound is slightly off pitch while playing Sonic 3, and the spindash significantly so, probably not something the average gamer would notice, and nothing as bad as th eaudio problems on some clone systems (and model 2 consoles), but it did annoy me one I noticed it.
Of course the games are all in 480i/p not original resolution as I noted already, plus there're the issue of the controller. (d-pad in particular, with Classic controller being the best bet, but still not ideal)

Edit:

Well, the Wii is a GC. It also is a N64, and a SNES, and a NES, and a Mega Drive / Genesis, and a Neo-Geo, and a PC-Engine / TG-16, and a Master System, and a C64, plus it has WiiWare stuff like Contra ReBirth. Of all of this generation's consoles it has by far the best selection of games - because it potentially replaces two billion other consoles.

Of course if you, like me, own some of these systems already, it looses quite a bit of its appeal, but no modded Xbox nor dedicated emulation PC replaces its N64 and GC compatibility.

And then there also are Nintendo's Wii games - like Paper Mario or New Super Mario Bros.

I don't really get it. The Wii's a wet dream of a retro gamer, yet people keep complaining.

The problem is, only GC titles are directly supported by the original media and with real hardware compatibility, along with controllers and memory cards. The emulation is sometimes questionable, and in th ecase of newer systems (ie N64) not emulation at all, but ports, just like OOT/Master Quest on GameCube.

On top of that many of th eprices are rather unreasonable for VC games, while it would make sense to make more popular/desirable games a bit more expensive, they're too high across the board, so much so that some are even cheaper to buy in the original format. not to mention the hastly the limited 512 MB of flash imposes, with frequent deleting necessary to make room for anything new. (either backing it up to SD or wiping the games completely and having to download again later -albeit for free)

If it really was backwards compatible with real hardware, with similar (or greater) quality to that of the original hardware, and using the original media (even if a cart adaptor accessory was required), that would be very cool, but it's not the case, so we'll be keeping the N64 and SNES set up along side the Wii. (which of course doubles as GC, and sits in place of where the GC had been in out entertainment center)

One thing I'm both looking foreward to and am aprehensive about is a possible Star Fox Wii game, mainly on the issue of controls after what happened with the DS game.

Edit: plus there's quite a lot of games unavailable, even common ones like Star Fox. (SNES)