Quantcast

Page 105 of 662 FirstFirst ... 55595101102103104105106107108109115155205605 ... LastLast
Results 1,561 to 1,575 of 9928

Thread: Paprium: Official Thread

  1. #1561
    Hero of Algol
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Posts
    7,701
    Rep Power
    174

    Default

    Using the very same algorithm and settings:

    WM's Blurred


    Kamahl's Blurred


    If that's anything to take as a parameter, I still prefer the WM's dithering.

    Also, I think some of you are jumping to conclusions way too quickly. We don't know which tools they use, we don't know if it's easier for them to auto-generate the kind of dithering they've chosen or even if they're doing this all manually (I doubt).
    If there's not a tool to generate the sort of dithering that Kamahl proposed, I really don't see and much less expect that they'll be re-doing all of their 4600+ frames of animation which they said to have used in the game IIRC.

    I like to think that there aren't just stupid monkeys working at WM and that they surely tested all the options they had prior picking this one for some good reason.
    I'm confident that the game will be great and look great too. And it's not the end of the world to have to use a composite cable since a lot of the Mega Drive games already require that.

  2. #1562
    Banned by Administrators
    Join Date
    Feb 2014
    Location
    Canada
    Posts
    200
    Rep Power
    0

    Default

    Coming up on 2 years since the genesis / pre-order$ of this project, I'm hoping to play it soon.

  3. #1563
    Smith's Minister of War Hero of Algol Kamahl's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Location
    Belgium
    Age
    29
    Posts
    8,437
    Rep Power
    137

    Default

    It's true, we don't know what tool the artist originally used and what conversion process was used.

    The game already looks excellent from just the bit of background they gave us (and the sprite itself is very good too).

    I don't agree with their choice of dithering, but what does it matter really. Comix Zone and Aladdin do it too and I play them anyway.
    This thread needs more... ENGINEERS

  4. #1564
    Road Rasher
    Join Date
    Jun 2014
    Posts
    477
    Rep Power
    10

    Smile

    the sprite looks cool now, the dithering is fine, Kamahl is good artist and I've drawn sprites before and its not easy and im pants at it, I can do 8 bit graphics, but 16 is pro level which Kamahl showed just by his use of changing it

  5. #1565
    Banned by Administrators
    Join Date
    Feb 2014
    Location
    Canada
    Posts
    200
    Rep Power
    0

    Default

    What is the big deal about vertical vs horizontal dithering on genesis or is it really a dithering pixel view for rgb vs "composhit" debate ? Eternal champions, comix zone and gunstar heroes had vertical dithering? And sor2, shinobi, sf2 others had horizontal ? I like all those games. What is really the big deal, how the colors or graphics come out ? I'm asking honestly, like games on Neo Geo looked great, but it had more colors than genesis and snes on screen and in it's palette (yes ?) so of course it looked better even though all 3 were 16 bit. Neo Geo could go from a Ikari warriors styled game like ninja commando to a sor type game to a sf vs snk style game very well. Neo Geo bowling and baseball were kiddy like but viewpoint was apocalyptic looking using akira like colors.

  6. #1566
    Smith's Minister of War Hero of Algol Kamahl's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Location
    Belgium
    Age
    29
    Posts
    8,437
    Rep Power
    137

    Default

    Vertical dithering looks great over composite but weird over RGB.
    Checkerboard dithering doesn't look as good over composite, but looks quite a bit better over RGB.

    It's a tradeoff, depending on which cable you're using you'll usually prefer one of the other.

    Since the genesis back in the day was mostly used with composite, the shift to vertical dithering actually improved quality.

    Nowadays, with RGB and emulators, it just makes the games look worse than they would otherwise.
    This thread needs more... ENGINEERS

  7. #1567
    Mastering your Systems Shining Hero TmEE's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    Location
    Estonia, Rapla City
    Age
    29
    Posts
    10,090
    Rep Power
    109

    Default

    Vertical dithering only works in NTSC where it blends nicely, as long as its composhit or RF, in s-video there's some color bleed. In PAL composhit you only get rainbow banding with composhit and RF and no blending at all in S-video and RGB.
    I prefer the checkerboard dithering, it is more universal and looks acceptable in RGB too.
    Death To MP3, :3
    Mida sa loed ? Nagunii aru ei saa "Gnirts test is a shit" New and growing website of total jawusumness !
    If any of my images in my posts no longer work you can find them in "FileDen Dump" on my site ^

  8. #1568
    Extreme Procrastinator Master of Shinobi Flygon's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Location
    Victoria, Australia
    Age
    27
    Posts
    1,976
    Rep Power
    35

    Default

    Tiido's right. Even on Composite, it's quite easy to pick apart individual pixels through my PAL Mega Drive, particularly in dithering patterns.

  9. #1569
    Hero of Algol
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Posts
    7,701
    Rep Power
    174

    Default

    Well, I'll rest my case then.
    But it's sad to read all these valid arguments, 'cause I expected only great things for this game.
    And given that we've had polls to choose stuff like points or money in the game, maybe we could have been asked about the dithering too.

  10. #1570
    Road Rasher
    Join Date
    Jun 2014
    Posts
    477
    Rep Power
    10

    Default

    im sorry if I insulted the original artists I was just having a moan at the dithering
    Last edited by Modelboard4; 09-07-2014 at 07:59 AM.

  11. #1571
    Wildside Expert
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Location
    Bordeaux, France
    Posts
    167
    Rep Power
    10

    Default

    I expected only great things for this game.
    In that case you are bound to be disappointed, the "perfect" game doesn't exist.
    People with such an outlook are impossible to please.
    Shinobi - the name means stealth.

  12. #1572
    VA1LT CHIP ENABLED Master of Shinobi OverDrone's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2012
    Posts
    1,556
    Rep Power
    45

    Default

    Our green man looks like a cross between Toxy as someone already mentioned, and Tessai from Ninja Scroll. Vertical dithering aside, the sprite looks good and should animate impressively as well by the sounds of what Fonzie is saying.

    We've seen some of the games graphics and heard the Groovemaster teaser, now I'm interested to hear some SFX.

    That's something WM need to get right for sure.

  13. #1573
    Hero of Algol
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Posts
    7,701
    Rep Power
    174

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Barman View Post
    In that case you are bound to be disappointed, the "perfect" game doesn't exist.
    People with such an outlook are impossible to please.
    You didn't understand my point. I'm not an idiot, I'm not expecting a perfect game.
    But, given all the info we have today and the easiness to test games in different systems, TVs, etc.; I didn't expect WM to release a game that may have rainbow artifacts all over the screen.

  14. #1574
    Wildside Expert
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Location
    Bordeaux, France
    Posts
    167
    Rep Power
    10

    Default

    You didn't understand my point. I'm not an idiot, I'm not expecting a perfect game.
    But, given all the info we have today and the easiness to test games in different systems, TVs, etc.; I didn't expect WM to release a game that may have rainbow artifacts all over the screen.
    Alright, but then again: if you're in the NTSC region, it won't be a problem (it blends nicely as TmEE said).
    And if you're in a PAL region, you probably stopped playing in composhit since the 90s, and use RGB instead, so there won't be any "rainbow artifact".
    Shinobi - the name means stealth.

  15. #1575
    Hero of Algol
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Posts
    7,701
    Rep Power
    174

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Barman View Post
    Alright, but then again: if you're in the NTSC region, it won't be a problem (it blends nicely as TmEE said).
    And if you're in a PAL region, you probably stopped playing in composhit since the 90s, and use RGB instead, so there won't be any "rainbow artifact".
    I'm in a Pal-M region actually. I have composite cables, S-Video converter and SCART to component box; but given that most of my systems are Pal-M, I'll have problems.

    Wait, uh, I think the JP 32X can save me... Well, no problems for me then; but there's a good share of Brazilian people in WM forums and they'll probably have rainbow artifacts if the dithering is really like that all through the game. As for people playing with SCART cable, the vertical dithering is way worse than the Kamahl's approach and that's why we're having this discussion.

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 6 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 6 guests)

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •