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Thread: Digital Foundry has been doing retro analyses on Saturn/PS1/N64 games

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    Rebel Pizza Raging in the Streets Thief's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gamevet View Post
    Display lag is the problem. That's why my Samsung LCD has Tru-Motion plus. The LCDs refresh at 120Hz, while the image is still being output at 60Hz.
    Yeah, I too need one of those Tru-Motion 120Hz TVs. My friend has one and is unbelievably good. But he now lives in Ottawa, so I haven't witnessed it's greatness in awhile now. Just memories of being blown away by it's greatness.

    Congrats, I now envy you, gamevet.

  2. #422
    Raging in the Streets
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    Quote Originally Posted by Thief View Post
    But when was the last time you seen a game locked at 30fps?
    Forza Horizon 3 doesn't drop below 30fps on the Xbox One

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    That's because the Forza games as supposed to be running at 60fps.

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    I DON'T LIKE POKEMON Hero of Algol j_factor's Avatar
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    Any racing game should really be 60fps in this day and age. Actually, everything from Dreamcast on up should be.


    You just can't handle my jawusumness responces.

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    Death Bringer Raging in the Streets Black_Tiger's Avatar
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    When Dreamcast was near launch I thought, "finally, every game will be pop-up-free and run at 60fps. Devs will build off that minimum to determine the new standard in 3D graphics and gameplay will no longer need to be compromised".

    And then they continued to pretend that it's still the 32-bit gen and maximized up close visuals at the expense of framerate and draw distance... :/
    Quote Originally Posted by year2kill06
    everyone knows nintendo is far way cooler than sega just face it nintendo has more better games and originals

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    Master of Shinobi Blades's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Thief View Post

    ^ This is not videogame immersion.
    Lol can't rep.

    Display lag is the problem. That's why my Samsung LCD has Tru-Motion plus. The LCDs refresh at 120Hz, while the image is still being output at 60Hz.
    Why is this done? 60Hz is 60Hz. Does it cut down on LCD blur?

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    End of line.. ESWAT Veteran gamevet's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Blades View Post
    Why is this done? 60Hz is 60Hz. Does it cut down on LCD blur?
    It's pixel refresh lag. When looking at a display's specs, you'll notice a rating for pixel response time. My Samsung LCD display has a pixel response time of @5ms. What will happen is that the next image going to the pixel will have lag time (pixel response time) and when you have quick moving images it will start to blur. To remedy this, display manufacturers started making displays that could refresh the pixels twice that of the input frequency of the connected device. Plasma displays used refresh frequencies in the hundreds and I've seen some as high as 600Hz.

    https://www.cnet.com/news/what-is-600hz/
    Last edited by gamevet; 08-19-2017 at 04:35 AM.
    A Black Falcon: no, computer games and video games are NOT the same thing. Video games are on consoles, computer games are on PC. The two kinds of games are different, and have significantly different design styles, distribution methods, and game genre selections. Computer gaming and console (video) gaming are NOT the same thing."



  8. #428
    Raging in the Streets Team Andromeda's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Thief View Post
    I brought model 2 up, not model 3. Model 2 Daytona USA still had noticeable draw distance. Dreamcast version? None. That's what I call a 6-7 year generation gap. And one between two very different priced hardware.
    But Sonic Adv had tons of drawn in and Mario 64 had hardly any?. One can all pick the odd game here and there. The best looking XBox One and PS4 games are leagues above and beyond what is possible on the 360 or PS3, more so when you play the same game on the 360 and then play the XBox One or PS4 version.
    Yes the jump isn't as big but I think a lot of that is also because 3D tech and tools and developers ability to model and make worlds is now at such a high standard. Kind of like 2D on the 32 Bit systems wasn't as massive from going to 8 bit to 16-bit 2D
    Last edited by Team Andromeda; 08-19-2017 at 04:21 AM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Team Andromeda View Post
    But Sonic Adv had tons of drawn in and Mario 64 had hardly any?. One can all pick the odd game here and there. The best looking XBox One and PS4 games are leagues above and beyond what is possible on the 360 or PS3, more so when you play the same game on the 360 and then play the XBox One or PS4 version.
    Yes the jump isn't as big but I think a lot of that is also because 3D tech and tools and developers ability to model and make worlds is now at such a high standard. Kind of like 2D on the 32 Bit systems wasn't as massive from going to 8 bit to 16-bit 2D
    I can't find enough simplified context for Sonic Adventure. I used Daytona since the Dreamcast version is basically a Remaster of the Model 2 arcade board created in 1993 or 4. And then comparing that to TLoU Remaster. Both Remasters are also first gen games. Context, context, context.

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    Death Bringer Raging in the Streets Black_Tiger's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Team Andromeda View Post
    But Sonic Adv had tons of drawn in and Mario 64 had hardly any?. One can all pick the odd game here and there. The best looking XBox One and PS4 games are leagues above and beyond what is possible on the 360 or PS3, more so when you play the same game on the 360 and then play the XBox One or PS4 version.
    Yes the jump isn't as big but I think a lot of that is also because 3D tech and tools and developers ability to model and make worlds is now at such a high standard. Kind of like 2D on the 32 Bit systems wasn't as massive from going to 8 bit to 16-bit 2D
    Mario 64 is an open world platformer with fixed camera angles for every inch of the game. Racing games wouldn't have popup if you could only look towards the road and tilt the camera a bit left and right before it snaps back in place.

    But outside of confined spaces, you still see a steady stream of popup, they just prioritized the base structure of areas over everything else and on the opposite end, objects and enemies are lowest priority. So you can be running up a hill and a second before it hits you, a giant bowling ball will fade into view, flying right at you.

    The end result of both the limited view of objects and the constantly twisting camera is compromised gameplay.

    That's why the DS version is such a big improvement. Not only do you get digital control, your limited control of the camera actually works more like Tomb Raider. But hop on a turtle shell in the first stage and you'll still have gombas popping into view right in front of you, a splitsecond before you collide.
    Quote Originally Posted by year2kill06
    everyone knows nintendo is far way cooler than sega just face it nintendo has more better games and originals

  11. #431
    Raging in the Streets Team Andromeda's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Black_Tiger View Post
    Mario 64 is an open world platformer with fixed camera angles for every inch of the game. Racing games wouldn't have popup if you could only look towards the road and tilt the camera a bit left and right before it snaps ba.
    Open world I would think makes pop up more of an issue than a racer, given the player has complete freedom to go anywhere and look anywhere. And I not knocking Sonic ADV, just saying even with the power of the DC we got a pop-up and in many of its games and even racers, that's all but gone this gen. The CPU's aren't a big jump, but the GPU's were over those inisde the 360 and PS3. I mean all the HALO 360 games are running in native 1080 and 60 fps. Drakes IV is a huge leap over Drakes III gfx, Forza Horzion II on 360 is a shadow of the XBox One version and can't even handle dynmaic weather, and that's before we move on Forza Horzion III
    Last edited by Team Andromeda; 08-20-2017 at 03:40 AM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Thief View Post
    That's because the Forza games as supposed to be running at 60fps.
    Yeah I would agree Horizon 3 should be 60fps, but all the Motorsport games do run at stable 60.

    GTAV is another one I just remembered that maintains it's 30fps.

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