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Thread: Gaming Historian covers the 32X.

  1. #16
    Rebel scum Shining Hero MrMatthews's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gryson View Post
    But I guess if you care about the history, you really shouldn't be looking to Youtube videos that fail to cite a single source (which is most likely this site)
    Norm has a couple of episodes reviewing Sega history books. I have a feeling a lot of his information came from those, although it is a bit odd that he doesn't cite his sources.


    Quote Originally Posted by Gryson View Post
    excessively promote shaving products. Just saying...
    Alright, cheap shot... most YouTubers are promoting stuff now.

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    Mega Driver Hedgehog-in-TrainingWCPO Agent Gryson's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MrMatthews View Post
    Norm has a couple of episodes reviewing Sega history books. I have a feeling a lot of his information came from those, although it is a bit odd that he doesn't cite his sources.
    There's no excuse for it. Melf has expressed frustration before that Youtubers are not crediting him for his interviews, which cost a lot of time and money over the years. This Youtuber is simply trying to drive a profit off of the hard work of the community. I don't care how well put together his videos are, if he can't be bothered to cite the people that did the actual research, then he's a leech on the community.

    His videos are also full of half-truths and speculation passed off as fact. I guess it's easier to do that when you don't list any of your sources.

    I may be a bit harsh, but I can only hope he reads this and understands that it's very low to not give credit.

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    My recollection:

    Late 1994: 32X appears, it has a mediocre port of Doom and some other obscure titles at the same time PCs are running Doom II and Nintendo has the biggest hit of the year with Donkey Kong Country.

    Mid 1995: The 32X is gone, now the Saturn is on store shelves with like no games. My friends and I took one look at the Saturn and figured it was the same thing as a Genesis+Sega CD+32X, since Sega had been running an ad campaign on upgrading the Genesis only months earlier.

    The only people I knew who bought either console were the die-hard Sega fans. Everyone else continued to play on their Genesis, SNES or PC until the PSX and N64 came out.

    For what it's worth, I don't think the 32X hardware was THAT bad. You have to do everything in software, but that wasn't so unusual in the early '90s, anyone who programmed on a PC back in the day would have been used to that. There's not enough RAM but you could have added more on the carts if you wanted it.

    I think the biggest issue was that people were expecting it to deliver way more than it could, it was billed as a brand-new 32 bit system to consumers while most developers were using it essentially as a Genesis with more colors and rudimentary 3D capabilities. It needed a killer app and Sega didn't deliver. Knuckles Chaotix is probably the closest it came, but the game feels unfinished and 90% of it could have been done on the Genesis.

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    The Gaming Gangsta Master of Shinobi profholt82's Avatar
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    I've stated this before, axel, but Doom on the 32x was a big deal in late 94/95. If you didn't have a high end PC or an Atati Jaguar, you weren't playing Doom. And the ability to play it on your Genesis on a tv was a big selling point. There was only one kid in my entire grade who had a Jaguar and he didn't have Doom. Sure, in retrospect, the 32x was handled poorly and fizzled out fast, but at the time of its release, it was everywhere, and actually sold quite well for a time.

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    Quote Originally Posted by profholt82 View Post
    I've stated this before, axel, but Doom on the 32x was a big deal in late 94/95. If you didn't have a high end PC or an Atati Jaguar, you weren't playing Doom. And the ability to play it on your Genesis on a tv was a big selling point. There was only one kid in my entire grade who had a Jaguar and he didn't have Doom. Sure, in retrospect, the 32x was handled poorly and fizzled out fast, but at the time of its release, it was everywhere, and actually sold quite well for a time.
    I have to agree, Doom was a big deal when the 32X was released (late '94) despite Doom 2 being already available on the PC. Every FPS style game was compared to it, and every upcoming system was expected to have a version as if it was the herald of next-gen gaming, but in late '94 the 32X and Jaguar were the only ways you were experiencing this landmark game without spending $$$ on a PC. At that point it hadn't really been surpassed as the prime example of an FPS game, but its impact probably gets understated because while it was the hot title for a time, and sold very well, by '96 it looked quite dated compared to up and coming titles.

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    Mega Driver Hedgehog-in-TrainingWCPO Agent Gryson's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Silanda View Post
    I have to agree, Doom was a big deal when the 32X was released (late '94) despite Doom 2 being already available on the PC. Every FPS style game was compared to it, and every upcoming system was expected to have a version as if it was the herald of next-gen gaming, but in late '94 the 32X and Jaguar were the only ways you were experiencing this landmark game without spending $$$ on a PC. At that point it hadn't really been surpassed as the prime example of an FPS game, but its impact probably gets understated because while it was the hot title for a time, and sold very well, by '96 it looked quite dated compared to up and coming titles.
    This was true in my experience as well. Everybody I knew was drooling over Doom 32X when it came out.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Gryson View Post
    This was true in my experience as well. Everybody I knew was drooling over Doom 32X when it came out.
    That's interesting all of you saw it differently. Maybe my friends and I were a bit different, we liked PC gaming already so we didn't mind running Doom on the computer. If you had a 486 the framerate was already better than the 32X. There were decent PC joypads at the time so you didn't have to play with the keyboard.

    On the other hand if you didn't own a fast PC or you preferred to keep your gaming in the living room I can see where the 32X version would be a big deal.

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    Quote Originally Posted by axel View Post
    That's interesting all of you saw it differently. Maybe my friends and I were a bit different, we liked PC gaming already so we didn't mind running Doom on the computer. If you had a 486 the framerate was already better than the 32X. There were decent PC joypads at the time so you didn't have to play with the keyboard.

    On the other hand if you didn't own a fast PC or you preferred to keep your gaming in the living room I can see where the 32X version would be a big deal.
    This was right around the time when more and more people started buying PCs. The internet really started to become big in around 1995 and PC prices were dropping.

    When Doom 32X came out, my family didn't have a PC, but within a year we did and yeah, at that point, Doom 32X couldn't hold a candle to games like Dark Forces. However, up to that point, I was really satisfied with Doom 32X.

    I do feel sorry for anybody with access to the PC version that purchased Doom 32X... must have been a disappointment.

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    Death Bringer Raging in the Streets Black_Tiger's Avatar
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    Doom alone justified the 32X as an end user. It was a lot of fun and I never got to see Doom running smooth with sound on a PC at anyone's home until around the time of the Dreamcast.
    Quote Originally Posted by year2kill06
    everyone knows nintendo is far way cooler than sega just face it nintendo has more better games and originals

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    Mega Driver Hedgehog-in-TrainingWCPO Agent Gryson's Avatar
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    The magazine reviews of Doom 32X were also really high at the time. From EGM:

    "Oh, yeah! Hours of fun! Just the thing a person needs after a rough day! This isn't the PC version, but it still does a great job with the first-person, point-the-weapon-and-shoot idea. This has to be the ultimate stress reliever! 8.4/10"

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    Master of Shinobi Bottino's Avatar
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    Imagine a world without the 32X: no endless forum discussions about this blasted add-on, with "experts" trying to rewrite history ( this happens in pretty much any area, but still...); perhaps we could have saved a couple of trees and marine animals with the energy spared and without the plastic and electronic parts used to make it.

    Yeah, the world would definitely be a better place ( about 0,001 %, give or take ). Sadly, that would mean no Virtua Racing DeLuxe as well...

    Then, we could devote all of our energy discussing why the Saturn failed and the reasons why CEOs are one of the worst class of people on earth.
    [ QCF, HCB + K ]

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    Mega Driver Hedgehog-in-TrainingWCPO Agent Gryson's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bottino View Post
    Imagine a world without the 32X
    I can already see it: there would be arguments about how the 32X would have saved Sega had it only been released, and assertions that Sega of Japan obviously forced its cancellation to spite Sega of America.

    Without the 32X, developers were unable to transition to 3D on the Saturn, and the resulting lack of good Saturn titles drove everybody to the PlayStation. In addition, without a low-cost way of prolonging the 16-bit lifespan, Mega Drive sales sputtered and died and left Sega with nothing.

  13. #28
    End of line.. Hero of Algol gamevet's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Black_Tiger View Post
    Doom alone justified the 32X as an end user. It was a lot of fun and I never got to see Doom running smooth with sound on a PC at anyone's home until around the time of the Dreamcast.
    I played DOOM on the SNES. I didn't get the 32X, or DOOM for, until it was in the bargain bin. I actually played DOOM on the PlayStation (before 32X) with Pro-Logic surround. It was the ultimate way to play the game.

    My 32X cart of DOOM died several years ago. It freezes up right after you start the game.
    A Black Falcon: no, computer games and video games are NOT the same thing. Video games are on consoles, computer games are on PC. The two kinds of games are different, and have significantly different design styles, distribution methods, and game genre selections. Computer gaming and console (video) gaming are NOT the same thing."



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    Quote Originally Posted by Gryson View Post
    I do feel sorry for anybody with access to the PC version that purchased Doom 32X... must have been a disappointment.
    That's the thing, if you had the PC version there was little reason to get Doom for the 32X. The 32X needed exclusive titles, not ports of games you could already play elsewhere.

    If I was making a port of Doom for the 32X it would have had custom levels that were made to work within the RAM limitations of the hardware, plus a couple of extra guns and new enemies. Don't just make a watered-down PC port with a lot of cuts. It looked like the 32X was struggling to keep up on day one.

    Beyond that, the games just weren't that much fun. VR Deluxe is very impressive technically, easily the best 3D racer available at the time. But my friends and I were already having too much fun playing Mario Kart, which has 8 playable characters, lots of tracks, multiplayer, a battle mode, etc. I don't know why Sega didn't make something similar with the Sonic characters.

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    Quote Originally Posted by axel View Post
    That's the thing, if you had the PC version there was little reason to get Doom for the 32X. The 32X needed exclusive titles, not ports of games you could already play elsewhere.

    If I was making a port of Doom for the 32X it would have had custom levels that were made to work within the RAM limitations of the hardware, plus a couple of extra guns and new enemies. Don't just make a watered-down PC port with a lot of cuts. It looked like the 32X was struggling to keep up on day one.

    Beyond that, the games just weren't that much fun. VR Deluxe is very impressive technically, easily the best 3D racer available at the time. But my friends and I were already having too much fun playing Mario Kart, which has 8 playable characters, lots of tracks, multiplayer, a battle mode, etc. I don't know why Sega didn't make something similar with the Sonic characters.
    You still don't get it. It's not like today where every system is getting Doom. To the average person, these console ports were their first experience. Not to mention, not everybody had an arcade near them or a computer store to instantly buy a Windows or Mac. Most were not going to fork over 2 to 3 grand on a computer just for one game. I get it if someone played the PC game when it first came out, but computers were an investment in 1993-95. And even then, it wasn't exactly silky smooth (high/low detail and screen size for anybody that played on Windows 3.1 or 95 back then will know that frustration) like it is today with modern PC's. Even Wolfenstein 3D wasn't smooth at times back then, either.

    Of course they have to make cuts to certain things. Every Doom port had cuts. Even with the phenomenal PlayStation version. The changes you're suggesting is not what people would have wanted with something as big as that game. It's like arcade games. Some compromises have to be made. You're only alotted so much memory for a cart.

    You also don't get Sega's arcade presence at the time, especially with racers. Virtua Racing was a huge deal to bring over to the Genesis and 32x. Just to have that kind of game on a home console was a selling point, regardless of whether you preferred Mario Kart.(SNES version is overrated, got better beginning with the 64 version) Bringing the arcade experience home was always what Sega had in mind. Look at Sega Rally on the Saturn. Such a great game and for many, an excellent port that you didn't have to wait or spend quarters at the arcade. You can play it at home any time. From Turbo to whatever they have today, they were a pioneer for racers.

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