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Thread: [What if] Chaotix Remaster

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    Stuck in the Past Shining Hero The Jackal's Avatar
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    32X [What if] Chaotix Remaster

    I was thinking of this earlier, what if Sega pulled their finger out and hired Whitehead and his gang to do a remaster of Chaotix? Hear me out here:

    The game sucks, I know that. Opinions aside, it really is a rushed game and it's really unpolished. It would really benefit from the remaster treatment. S3&K isn't going to happen.

    - Add Sonic & Tails back in. Reuse their sprites from the Crackers beta.
    - Allow for normal, traditional gameplay aka no stupid ring tag. Just one character.
    - Rework the stage layouts.
    - Add in extra modes like a boss rush and time attack.
    - Lock-on to Sonic Mania so you can use Espio and the rest of the Chaotix characters in that game. Vice versa, Ray can be added to Chaotix.
    - Bring Encore mode to Chaotix; this just seems natural given the large cast and the standard gameplay revolving around character swapping as it is.
    - Fix the awful ring tag controls, and allow you to use the original if you're a purist.

    Thoughts?

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    Heat Guy WCPO Agent Lync's Avatar
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    What makes Chaotix isn't necessarily what breaks Chaotix: The rubber-band mechanic.

    If you remove it, then you don't have Chaotix at all. You just have another Sonic game.

    When I used to play Chaotix as a kid, I wanted so badly to be able to just play as a single-player.
    Even as an option I thought how much better it would have been.

    However, "remastering" the game by removing its core gimmick wouldn't be a remaster and doesn't resolve the game's real problem: Level design.

    I'm not sure about rushed, but I am fairly sure the part of Sonic Team that developed Sonic CD had the bigger hand with Chaotix.
    And this is clear with the level design.

    The stages in each game were wildly expansive, non-linear, almost overwhelming in scope.
    For the time-travel mechanic: it works okay, but not great for many looking to play in the style of Sonic 1/2/3.
    For the rubber-band mechanic: it is a total miss. The amount of empty nooks and dead ends are brutal, pause/break lifts and travel systems crippled the pace of the sling-shot/run-and-gun style I think Chaotix was meant to be.

    If someone could redefine the stages to enable that, then I'd consider it a "remaster."
    Otherwise, it becomes a solution in search of a problem.

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    I can't see Sega spending another penny on Knuckles Chaotix. Maybe if you get a big kickstarter you could strike a deal with Sega for the license and hire Whitehead. More realistically maybe try hacking the ROM? There was a (partial?) disassembly on Sonic Retro years ago.

    If it had been up to me the rubber band gimmick would have been used in only a few areas, make it like a puzzle that you have to use both players to get through a maze or something. The rest of the time have one player with the option of switching between them to use the different abilities. The stages feel unfinished. The coolest part of the game was the 3D special stages, it would be nice if you could make more of those.

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    Stuck in the Past Shining Hero The Jackal's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lync View Post
    What makes Chaotix isn't necessarily what breaks Chaotix: The rubber-band mechanic.

    If you remove it, then you don't have Chaotix at all. You just have another Sonic game.

    When I used to play Chaotix as a kid, I wanted so badly to be able to just play as a single-player.
    Even as an option I thought how much better it would have been.

    However, "remastering" the game by removing its core gimmick wouldn't be a remaster and doesn't resolve the game's real problem: Level design.

    I'm not sure about rushed, but I am fairly sure the part of Sonic Team that developed Sonic CD had the bigger hand with Chaotix.
    And this is clear with the level design.

    The stages in each game were wildly expansive, non-linear, almost overwhelming in scope.
    For the time-travel mechanic: it works okay, but not great for many looking to play in the style of Sonic 1/2/3.
    For the rubber-band mechanic: it is a total miss. The amount of empty nooks and dead ends are brutal, pause/break lifts and travel systems crippled the pace of the sling-shot/run-and-gun style I think Chaotix was meant to be.

    If someone could redefine the stages to enable that, then I'd consider it a "remaster."
    Otherwise, it becomes a solution in search of a problem.
    Good points. Very good points. I was thinking this "remaster" would be split in two: original, which keeps the game as is, and remastered, which would have completely changed level layouts, all round game re-balancing and the option to play the game like any other Classic Sonic title BUT to get around that, the ring tag/rubber band gameplay would need to be reworked. I was thinking something along the lines of switching between ring pull when you needed it, and then turning it off via a button press. Like in Mania's Encore mode.

    TBH, I just feel Chaotix had potential, and it got squandered. A Whitehead-eque Remake in the vain of Sonic 1/2/CD/Mania would be perfect to address the issues.

    Quote Originally Posted by axel View Post
    I can't see Sega spending another penny on Knuckles Chaotix.
    Yeah, sadly this is probably true.

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    Quote Originally Posted by The Jackal View Post
    I was thinking something along the lines of switching between ring pull when you needed it, and then turning it off via a button press. Like in Mania's Encore mode.

    TBH, I just feel Chaotix had potential, and it got squandered. A Whitehead-eque Remake in the vain of Sonic 1/2/CD/Mania would be perfect to address the issues.
    That's what it should have been from the beginning, have the second character following along like Tails, then let the player decide where they want to link up to slingshot through an area. If I had been designing it I would have made it so you start with one character (like Mighty) and you rescue the others as you go through the game, then you can switch between whoever you have. That way with the nonlinear design you can choose who you want to pick up first and take different routes as you go, have paths that are only accessible to certain characters or combinations. I think it would have added a ton of replayability.

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    Heat Guy WCPO Agent Lync's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Jackal View Post
    TBH, I just feel Chaotix had potential, and it got squandered. A Whitehead-eque Remake in the vain of Sonic 1/2/CD/Mania would be perfect to address the issues.
    Haha, I am right there with you.

    I've said it before, Knuckles' Chaotix is the best looking, best sounding, bad Sonic game in the series.

    However removed from the series, Chaotix itself is not awful. I did take the time one summer to replay it for the good ending and enjoyed it...

    Quote Originally Posted by axel View Post
    The coolest part of the game was the 3D special stages, it would be nice if you could make more of those.
    EXCEPT FOR GODDAMN THIS. THE 3D SPECIAL STAGES!

    Talk about wasted potential. As a kid I managed four of the six rings, but as an adult, I had to use tutorials!

    If you've ever collected all six, the special stage then become wire-frame which are really cool! And would have been playable, and my preference over the shading, had they thrown out the asinine idea of being in and out of bounds! Urghhh!


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    Here is my take on it, I know its popular to hate on Chaotix and Sonic CD these days, but I love them as they are.

    I like that they are a different game and a different experience, the last thing I wanted when they were released was another standard sonic game, I wanted something different I'm probably in the minority on that.

    Other than maybe adding Sonic and Tails as playables and a few bug fixes, I wouldn't want to see it changed.

    A standard sonic game in the Chaotix stages seems to be what you are proposing, but that isn't a remastered version of Chaotix, it's a new game altogether, and that's not necessarily a bad thing.

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    Stuck in the Past Shining Hero The Jackal's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Random Hajile View Post
    Here is my take on it, I know its popular to hate on Chaotix and Sonic CD these days, but I love them as they are.
    I've had the same opinion of Chaotix since the first time I played it back in 2006. Like Lync said, I don't think it's an awful game, but it is disappointing, to say the least, imo - you're free to disagree. I love Sonic CD, though.

    Quote Originally Posted by Random Hajile View Post
    I like that they are a different game and a different experience, the last thing I wanted when they were released was another standard sonic game, I wanted something different I'm probably in the minority on that.

    A standard sonic game in the Chaotix stages seems to be what you are proposing, but that isn't a remastered version of Chaotix, it's a new game altogether, and that's not necessarily a bad thing.
    I was proposing a rerelease of the game which allowed you full customization; one where you could play the game as it was like on the 32X, or you could have fully revamped with tweaked levels and changed gameplay. Think Sonic 3 Complete.

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    Video Game Modder Outrunner segasonicfan's Avatar
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    I think graphically, chaotix has some amazing 90s era sonic sprite graphics in many ways. some of the backgrounds (botanic base) and boss scaling are really gorgeous and showcase what 2D 32-bit Sonic games should look like. Honestly its more ambitious than Sonic Mania in some ways. I wish Whitehead and team had taken more inspiration from chaotix. Sigh, 32x really had potential.
    Last edited by segasonicfan; 04-07-2019 at 09:20 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by segasonicfan View Post
    I think graphically, chaotix has some amazing 90s era sonic sprite graphics in many ways. some of the backgrounds (botanic base) and boss scaling are really gorgeous and showcase what 2D 32-bit Sonic games should look like. Honestly its more ambitious than Sonic Mania in some ways. I wish Whitehead and team had taken more inspiration from chaotix. Sigh, 32x really had potential.
    It really did, which is what makes it so disappointing. The impression I get is that Sega realized the 32X was failing so they rushed to get Chaotix out the door, leaving the stages half-finished. So I'm happy we got anything rather than it becoming yet another canceled project. If anyone ever creates a level editor that would at least make it possible to fix most of the issues.

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    Sounds like a brand new game at that point akin to Sonic Mania which means more expensive development time. A digital re-release of the original seems more likely. Would be cool to see the 'SegaSonic the Hedgehog' Arcade game have a digital release.

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