Sega-16 Politics Thread

[Kamahl]

<WARNING> I am asking a serious question here <WARNING>

What voter suppression bill are you talking about? Is it one of the Voter ID laws?

http://www.pfaw.org/rww-in-focus/the...-from-the-ball

[Kamahl]

Why can't I post?
(EDIT: Oh look, I can again, see this: http://tinyurl.com/3egf627)

[Jimmy Yakapucci]

Why can't I post?
(EDIT: Oh look, I can again, see this: http://tinyurl.com/3egf627)

Based on the link, I am guessing that you are responding to my question. If there are that many people out there without IDs, I am wondering how they get through life. It seems like you need an ID to do just about anything. Maybe these people don't get out and do anything.

[j_factor]

Based on the link, I am guessing that you are responding to my question. If there are that many people out there without IDs, I am wondering how they get through life. It seems like you need an ID to do just about anything. Maybe these people don't get out and do anything.

What do you need an ID for if you don't drive?

[Televator]

So are we back now? No more of whatever the hell that was yesterday? I'm still on the fence as to whether I should bother posting here at all.

[AD2101]

What do you need an ID for if you don't drive?

Bars, movies, vidya games, alcohol, most times you use a credit card in person, jury duty, going to the doctor's office, I imagine applying for a loan etc, etc. I mean pretty much any place where anyone would possibly want to verify who you are or something about you is a good place to start. I've had an I.D. since I was 16 and I've only actually used it for driving related situations twice, compared to the likely hundreds of times I've had to use it for all the aforementioned.

I only read through the one section of Kamahl's link, the one specifically about ID's, so I won't touch that subject yet. Still though, why wouldn't you have an I.D. in this day and age? It takes a few hours of your time at the DMV, and not having one hinders you in so many ways that it would be crippling not to have one.

[j_factor]

Bars, movies, vidya games, alcohol, most times you use a credit card in person, jury duty, going to the doctor's office, I imagine applying for a loan etc, etc. I mean pretty much any place where anyone would possibly want to verify who you are or something about you is a good place to start. I've had an I.D. since I was 16 and I've only actually used it for driving related situations twice, compared to the likely hundreds of times I've had to use it for all the aforementioned.

Bars/alcohol - not everyone drinks, the drinking age is higher than the voting age, and older people generally don't get carded
Movies - only R-rated movies, only at theaters, generally only people who are right on the cusp of that age get carded
using a credit card - Many people don't have one, and nowadays they often have a photo on them so you don't need ID
Jury duty - You need an ID to serve on a jury? News to me, but that sounds like a good reason to NOT have an ID
Doctor - really? I haven't seen a doctor in quite some time, but I don't remember showing ID.
Loans - Plenty of people never get one.

Consider also that for the above purposes, alternative forms of ID are often acceptable. Especially the credit card one, I don't think any store is going to turn you down for a $30 Visa purchase when you show them a student ID or Veterans Affairs ID, neither of which are accepted by voter ID laws.

Still though, why wouldn't you have an I.D. in this day and age? It takes a few hours of your time at the DMV

DMVs are not open 24/7 and are not located on every street corner. For many working people, getting to the DMV for a few hours during their business hours does not fit their schedule. Plus, they're not free. Plus it requires documentation that you may not have, which isn't free either. Plus they expire.

[AD2101]

Bars/alcohol - not everyone drinks, the drinking age is higher than the voting age, and older people generally don't get carded
Movies - only R-rated movies, only at theaters, generally only people who are right on the cusp of that age get carded

Fair enough, these obviously weren't meant to apply to every person at all times in their lives, but I guess it needed to be said.

using a credit card - Many people don't have one, and nowadays they often have a photo on them so you don't need ID

True, however most don't have photos on the back.

Jury duty - You need an ID to serve on a jury? News to me, but that sounds like a good reason to NOT have an ID

AFAIK you do, actually I think in AZ once you get an I.D. you are automatically registered for Jury Duty and Selective Services, maybe Iron Lizard or another Arizonan could verify that if they see this. So you need an I.D. to even be involved in that kind of thing.

Doctor - really? I haven't seen a doctor in quite some time, but I don't remember showing ID.

Well consider yourself lucky then. Some people have health problems, for some people shit just happens to them, and ID's are useful there.

Loans - Plenty of people never get one.

True, but I never meant for these to be hard and fast rules, just ones that countered the narrow view that ID's are only for driving.

DMVs are not open 24/7 and are not located on every street corner. For many working people, getting to the DMV for a few hours during their business hours does not fit their schedule. Plus, they're not free. Plus it requires documentation that you may not have, which isn't free either. Plus they expire.

This is not a good argument, you'll have to do better here. People are busy, but to argue that it is too hard for them to make it to a DMV at some point in time over the span of months or years is lazy. Also ID's are pretty cheap, $25 in AZ is the most expensive unless you are going for a CDL. ID's can range from being valid for a few years, to over a quarter century, and can be renewed online or via the mail once you have one.

[Iron Lizard]

Registering to vote will put you in the Jury Duty pool as well as having a license or ID from the MVD.

Edit: I just checked the recorders website ,50% from voting 50% from the MVD

[Tanegashima]

[j_factor]

True, but I never meant for these to be hard and fast rules, just ones that countered the narrow view that ID's are only for driving.

I wasn't saying that ID's are only for driving. My point was that a lot of people have to drive, or view it as a necessity. Those people will necessarily have to have ID's. Whereas the other stuff that ID cards are commonly used for are generally optional. The post I was responding to was wondering how people "get through life" without an ID card. Well, it's not hard to do so if you don't drive. Re-read your list and consider whether you can "get through life" without them.

This is not a good argument, you'll have to do better here. People are busy, but to argue that it is too hard for them to make it to a DMV at some point in time over the span of months or years is lazy.

It's not lazy, a lot of people don't even get paid vacation days, maybe they're barely making it and can't afford to take time off work.

Also ID's are pretty cheap, $25 in AZ is the most expensive unless you are going for a CDL. ID's can range from being valid for a few years, to over a quarter century, and can be renewed online or via the mail once you have one.

So what if they're "pretty cheap", they still cost money. Plus, how much does a copy of one's birth certificate cost? And what about really old people that don't even have birth certificates?

I really don't understand the argument that people who are destitute don't deserve the right to vote.

[Tanegashima]

There are plenty of people who shouldn't be allowed to vote.

People who watch Storage Wars shouldn't be allowed to vote.

[sheath]

I shouldn't be allowed to vote.

[DarkDragon]

There are plenty of people who shouldn't be allowed to vote.

People who watch Storage Wars shouldn't be allowed to vote.

People who watch the Kardashians shoudn't be allowed to vote.

[jerry coeurl]

No one should be allowed to vote. We should just go back to a monarchy.