Making The Best Of The Worst

[chessage]

To those who have purchased a lousy VA0/1/1.8 model 2 with a bad video encoder and audio circuit, what's the best option for fixing up the system at a low cost? I know the video encoder can be replaced and the audio can be upgraded with the crystal clear audio mod, but wouldn't that end up costing more than a replacement model 2? Also, can the KA2195D be modded to output better quality composite video (I know it can't do S-video)?

--A note to all PAL Mega Drive II owners:--

The Samsung KA2195D video encoder is a chip designed ONLY for NTSC consoles and video equipment. It can only be found in Japanese Mega Drive 2s and North American Genesis model 2s. Unless you've imported a model 2 from North America or Japan, you should not have to worry about video quality.

[kool kitty89]

If you paid someone else to do the modding it could cost a lot (particularly with shipping), but if you can do it yourself it's fairly cheap. Finding a compatible encoder might be a bit difficult (in non-bulk orders), though cannibalizing a dead console is a way to go. if you find a dead (or pretty damaged) Genesis 3, that's guaranteed to have a nice CXA1645. (surface mounted chips can be a bit tricky to work with though)

Replacing the encoder is probably a good deal simpler than the CCAM, at least in terms of soldering

[Nunzio]

For some reason I thought this thread was about women.

[Elusive]

Dismember it and mount it on the wall, as a warning to the others.

For some reason I thought this thread was about women.

Works for this, too!

[chessage]

If you paid someone else to do the modding it could cost a lot (particularly with shipping), but if you can do it yourself it's fairly cheap.

I'd do the mod myself, but finding the necessary components locally is a bit of a challenge.

Finding a compatible encoder might be a bit difficult (in non-bulk orders), though cannibalizing a dead console is a way to go. if you find a dead (or pretty damaged) Genesis 3, that's guaranteed to have a nice CXA1645. (surface mounted chips can be a bit tricky to work with though)

1). Buying a dead console would cost the same as buying a replacement Genesis, so it's not a practical option.

2). Finding a 'dead' Genesis 3 is about as likely as finding a dead Nomad or dead 32X. If I were to find one, I'd fix it up and make it my main system. It's far too hard to come by.

--

Again, is there any way to soup up the KA2195D rather than taking it out?

Is there a "poor man's CCAM"?

[Baloo]

Genesis 3's are actually very cheap and easy to come by. 32x is uncommon, and Nomad would be the only one truly worth saving as it has a high resale value. But Genesis 3's can't use 32x or Sega CD, so it's not really worth having it as your main console.

[kool kitty89]

The Genesis 3 can be modded to be compatible with VR 32x PBC but not Sega CD... It also has cleat (but mono) sound out of the box. So I definitely wouldn't canabalize one unless I thought it was really gone. Canabalizing other models could work too (though the earlier "good" encoders like CXA1145 or MB3514 still aren't as nice as the 1645 -softer/blurrier, and I think the 3514 might be a bit dark), but it would probably just be easier to find a functioning one cheap anyway... (even the VA7 with crappy sound has a good encoder, usually an 1145 it seems, if not always)

And chessage, why would obtaining th ematerials to do CCAM be that difficult, isn't it pretty much all soldering resistors? (and some other, common, discrete components)

I think there are other, compatible commercially available video encoders available as well, I need to remember what they are though.

Edit: I was thinkig of the CXA2075M, but from the discussion I remember it from it was mentioned it was rather uncommon:

No, it was a replacement. There was a MB3514, and I swapped with a ubber rare cxa2075m, the top notch rgb encoder from sony...

however I did a quick search and found this on ebay (international):
http://cgi.ebay.com.my/SONY-Encoder-...3286.m63.l1177 Supposedly very high quality

As well as some CXA1645's http://shop.ebay.com.my/i.html?_nkw=...1145&_osacat=0

However, the prices aren't that great, and the 2075 is actually cheaper... (and you could probably seach around and find a nicer loose genesis on the cheap)

Not sure if ~$15 ($9.50 each plus $5 flat rate shipping) would be worth it for a CXA2075M, I'm not sure just how "top notch" they actually are... (or if they're any better for S-Video)

Oh, and apparently PSXs (and Saturns) use CXA1645s as well, so if you find a cheap/free junk PlayStation, that's one route as well.


Hmm, did a general search on ebay for RGB encoders an dthese came up:
http://cgi.ebay.com/MC1377-MC1377P-R...item2ea7804b07
http://cgi.ebay.com/AD722-RGB-to-NTS...item19b1f729af

I have no idea what they're like though, need to look at data sheets on them.




one more thing, if you're pretty good with homebrew electronics (or following a diagram/instructios and soldering), you might be able to make your own RGB to YUV component video transcoder from discrete components. (way simpler circuitry involved than with S-Video and composite)
I did a seach a while back and didn't come up with any simple tutorials, though I seem to remember TmEE posting a circuit diagram for one a while back.

[Devil N]

--A note to all PAL Mega Drive II owners:--

The Samsung KA2195D video encoder is a chip designed ONLY for NTSC consoles and video equipment. It can only be found in Japanese Mega Drive 2s and North American Genesis model 2s. Unless you've imported a model 2 from North America or Japan, you should not have to worry about video quality.

I have a VA1.8 PAL MD2, and it has a very poor quality composite signal, matching Ace's description of the KA2195D in this topic. So while the PAL machine may not actually have a KA2195D, it's still got a bad video encoder. Of course, the solution for all PAL Mega Drive owners should be to get an RGB SCART cable and bypass the video encoder entirely. Even the HDG MD1's high quality composite signal is no match for RGB, and it leaves only the audio to worry about.

[TmEE]

There are KA chips in PAL machines, I have encountered one and it did not really give any worse composhit image than CXA1145 or the Fujitsu chip... but then again, all composhit looks bad to me :P

[Devil N]

Well, there is some noticeable difference in composite signal quality. The composite from my VA4 MD1 is what you'd typically expect - dot crawl, soft and oversaturated. The composite from my VA1.8 MD2 however, is far worse. It adds a lot of noise and shows three or four dark vertical lines running across the screen. It is so bad you'd have to be a near-sighted gnu not to notice something's wrong.

[chessage]

The Genesis 3 can be modded to be compatible with VR 32x PBC but not Sega CD... It also has cleat (but mono) sound out of the box. So I definitely wouldn't canabalize one unless I thought it was really gone. Canabalizing other models could work too (though the earlier "good" encoders like CXA1145 or MB3514 still aren't as nice as the 1645 -softer/blurrier, and I think the 3514 might be a bit dark), but it would probably just be easier to find a functioning one cheap anyway... (even the VA7 with crappy sound has a good encoder, usually an 1145 it seems, if not always)

That's the issue, it's cheaper to buy a replacement console than to spruce up the one already in possession. Most places (even thrift stores) wont sell broken consoles, and even if they do, it would cost about the same as a working console, so the practicality just isn't there.

And chessage, why would obtaining th ematerials to do CCAM be that difficult, isn't it pretty much all soldering resistors? (and some other, common, discrete components)

To be honest, I've never bought such materials. Not only that, the stores in my area don't even deal in electronics, aside a low-end Radio Shack...

I think there are other, compatible commercially available video encoders available as well, I need to remember what they are though.

Edit: I was thinkig of the CXA2075M, but from the discussion I remember it from it was mentioned it was rather uncommon:
however I did a quick search and found this on ebay (international):
http://cgi.ebay.com.my/SONY-Encoder-...3286.m63.l1177 Supposedly very high quality

As well as some CXA1645's http://shop.ebay.com.my/i.html?_nkw=...1145&_osacat=0

However, the prices aren't that great, and the 2075 is actually cheaper... (and you could probably seach around and find a nicer loose genesis on the cheap)

Not sure if ~$15 ($9.50 each plus $5 flat rate shipping) would be worth it for a CXA2075M, I'm not sure just how "top notch" they actually are... (or if they're any better for S-Video)

For $15 I could buy a replacement Genesis. Those prices are far too steep.

Oh, and apparently PSXs (and Saturns) use CXA1645s as well, so if you find a cheap/free junk PlayStation, that's one route as well.

This gives me an idea. Would it be possible to solder a KA2195D into a PlayStation and keep it in a working condition? If so, I would be able to sell it and get my money back from the original purchase.

one more thing, if you're pretty good with homebrew electronics (or following a diagram/instructios and soldering), you might be able to make your own RGB to YUV component video transcoder from discrete components. (way simpler circuitry involved than with S-Video and composite)
I did a seach a while back and didn't come up with any simple tutorials, though I seem to remember TmEE posting a circuit diagram for one a while back.

Unfortunately, the TV sets at my house are too old to accommodate component video. They only allow composite and RF (not even S-video), so I usually shoot for the better of the two, composite.

Genesis 3's are actually very cheap and easy to come by... it's not really worth having it as your main console.

Not true for me.

There are KA chips in PAL machines, I have encountered one and it did not really give any worse composhit image than CXA1145 or the Fujitsu chip... but then again, all composhit looks bad to me :P

Then could you explain why the datasheet says it's "Available only NTSC system"?

Well, there is some noticeable difference in composite signal quality. The composite from my VA4 MD1 is what you'd typically expect - dot crawl, soft and oversaturated. The composite from my VA1.8 MD2 however, is far worse. It adds a lot of noise and shows three or four dark vertical lines running across the screen. It is so bad you'd have to be a near-sighted gnu not to notice something's wrong.

Exactly, the first time I brought my VA1 to a friend's house everybody noticed how bad the video quality was. It's that awful vertical line distortion!

[TmEE]

Then could you explain why the datasheet says it's "Available only NTSC system"?

acdc has one such European MD2 with the KA encoder in it, and it showed composhit nicely in color...

[kool kitty89]

There are KA chips in PAL machines, I have encountered one and it did not really give any worse composhit image than CXA1145 or the Fujitsu chip... but then again, all composhit looks bad to me :P

According to Ace there's even more blu and a fair bit of distorsion and noise. One other issue would be the incapability for S-Video modding. (still not an issue for you ) The pre TMSS models also have added "rainbow" noise in composite (and RF), but I think that's related to other video circuitry rather than the encoder. (inless a different revision of CXA1145 was used on later models) My Model 1 definitely has that problem. (along with the noisier RF -thick diagonal scrolling lines on top of static) Hopefully that won't show up in S-Video once I get around to modding it.

That's the issue, it's cheaper to buy a replacement console than to spruce up the one already in possession. Most places (even thrift stores) wont sell broken consoles, and even if they do, it would cost about the same as a working console, so the practicality just isn't there.

Yeah, if possible I'd look around for cheap loose consoles. (of course, you only have hookups for M2, so getting a M1 could be problematic for that -though I found a cheap power supply at a local thrift store, sufficient voltage amperage and connector, just needed th epolaity swapped, and you might find an approprate DIN connector you could hack your own video cable from, plus a standard 1/8" phono stereo y-cable for sound) DIN connectors are fairly common (from scrap/spare electronics and cables as well, like very old keyboard connectors or CB radio handsets), and standard arcing 5-pin, 7-pin and 8-pin would all be fine for composite (and mono), though you'd need an 8-pin one for a 32x mixing cable. I recently got a pair of new 8-pin DIN connectors off ebay for $5 (shipped), so cheaper than buying an actual av cable online. (plus standard M1 AV cables are usually DIN-5, so no good for 32x)
Inless you've got a TV with really nice RF quality (some older high-end TVs with automatic fine tuning make my noisy early Model 1 look almost as good as composite) Of course you'd need the separate stereo phono cable hooked up to speakers/stereo system in this case. (with RF outputting mono to the TV)

Preferably a non-VA7 model 1 of course (as described in ace's thread), otherwise it should get the CCAM.

To be honest, I've never bought such materials. Not only that, the stores in my area don't even deal in electronics, aside a low-end Radio Shack...

Hmm, even a simple radio shack should have some basic electronics supplies (common switches, resistors, capacitors, transistors, fuses, voltage regs, potentiometers, diodes, various connectors -maybe not DIN though- etc) And even if not, they should have a catalog to order from. Fry's would be ideal though. (I assume those aren't around there though)

This gives me an idea. Would it be possible to solder a KA2195D into a PlayStation and keep it in a working condition? If so, I would be able to sell it and get my money back from the original purchase.

Possibly, but you'd loose S-Video support on the Playstation if it worked. (inless the PSX has a separate S-Video encoder, which wouldn't make much sense)

Unfortunately, the TV sets at my house are too old to accommodate component video. They only allow composite and RF (not even S-video), so I usually shoot for the better of the two, composite.

Ah, OK, but not necessarily that old either, but some might be cheaper, or just with less features (at least for S-Video, composite being a baseline, some lower-mid-range modern TVs actually have component but no S-Video...)
Out ~1991 27" Sony Trinitron had s-video (even though it didn't even have stereo) while I noticed my freind's old ~32" Trinitron with stereo had composite only for whatever reason.

Getting off topic, but also (at the same freind's house) an old 25" Zenith advanced system 3 (loooked like late '80s, maybe 1990, but with lots of wood grain finish) actually had composite, S-video, and stereo imput and output (to pass through to an amp). Along with that it had some really nice automatic fine tuning. (with great looking RF with the crappy output from my Model 1) On top of all of that it had been calibrated with basicly no vertical overscan, with the border outside the usual 224/448 lines visible. The piscture was awsome, almost no color bleeding, even at full saturation (and this is through RF), no noticable dot crawl, and pixels were quite clear (blocky) with sharpness all the way up as well -the comb filter in it must be amazing.
Unfortuantely it needs a remote to switch to comp/s-video output channels, and it was missing... (not sure about universal remotes)

[TmEE]

...and I want my TVs to show all possible overscan, otherwise I lose too much screen in regular TV channels :P

One can't just swap a KA chip with CXA one, there's some additional modding needed, because these 2 chips use slightly different external circuitry.

[chessage]

Yeah, if possible I'd look around for cheap loose consoles. (of course, you only have hookups for M2, so getting a M1 could be problematic for that -though I found a cheap power supply at a local thrift store, sufficient voltage amperage and connector, just needed th epolaity swapped, and you might find an approprate DIN connector you could hack your own video cable from, plus a standard 1/8" phono stereo y-cable for sound) DIN connectors are fairly common (from scrap/spare electronics and cables as well, like very old keyboard connectors or CB radio handsets), and standard arcing 5-pin, 7-pin and 8-pin would all be fine for composite (and mono), though you'd need an 8-pin one for a 32x mixing cable. I recently got a pair of new 8-pin DIN connectors off ebay for $5 (shipped), so cheaper than buying an actual av cable online. (plus standard M1 AV cables are usually DIN-5, so no good for 32x)
Inless you've got a TV with really nice RF quality (some older high-end TVs with automatic fine tuning make my noisy early Model 1 look almost as good as composite) Of course you'd need the separate stereo phono cable hooked up to speakers/stereo system in this case. (with RF outputting mono to the TV)

Preferably a non-VA7 model 1 of course (as described in ace's thread), otherwise it should get the CCAM.

I've already been looking for cheap, loose consoles. I still have yet to find a cheap model 1 or model 3, but I've been preparing just in case I find one. I already have the necessary hook ups for the model 3 and I know of some places that have the necessary supplies for a model 1.

I've already used Ace's guide to help get one of my friends an excellent VA3 model 2 with a CXA1145 encoder. I even noticed some stuff that he didn't mention: on the VA3 it mentions the patent #s for Germany and France, but on my VA1 it does not.

Hmm, even a simple radio shack should have some basic electronics supplies (common switches, resistors, capacitors, transistors, fuses, voltage regs, potentiometers, diodes, various connectors -maybe not DIN though- etc) And even if not, they should have a catalog to order from. Fry's would be ideal though. (I assume those aren't around there though)

I see, though there are Radio Shacks that are structured like a hardware store and wont carry anything more complex than flashlights and extension cords.

Possibly, but you'd loose S-Video support on the Playstation if it worked. (inless the PSX has a separate S-Video encoder, which wouldn't make much sense)

As well as the issue of adding additional circuitry.

Ah, OK, but not necessarily that old either, but some might be cheaper, or just with less features (at least for S-Video, composite being a baseline, some lower-mid-range modern TVs actually have component but no S-Video...)
Out ~1991 27" Sony Trinitron had s-video (even though it didn't even have stereo) while I noticed my freind's old ~32" Trinitron with stereo had composite only for whatever reason.

Our TV sets are both old and cheap. We have one 13" B&W Sears Solid State from 1980, a 20" Magnavox Digital Control System from 1986, a 19" RCA ColorTrak from 1986, a 13" Emerson ECT 1300 from 1988, and a 13" RCA ColorTrak from 1994.

One can't just swap a KA chip with CXA one, there's some additional modding needed, because these 2 chips use slightly different external circuitry.

There goes that idea...

Can't the KA2195D be modified for cleaner composite video output?