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Thread: Genesis' real sale numbers.

  1. #61
    Hero of Algol kool kitty89's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Thenewguy View Post
    I guess this makes the SNES total make more sense now though, as out of that 23.3 million I would guess that at best only ~1 million can be realistically attributed to South America, Canada and Mexico combined

    So the Mega Drive probably sold somewhere between 21 and 22 million in the US (not including Nomad) whilst the SNES sold somewhere between 22 and 23 million in the US.

    Brazil pushed "The America's" to an overall Mega Drive win
    Brazil was still a relatively small niche and the SMS was still a major competitor as well when Sega licensed the rights to TecToy... (unless you want to include TT sales ) I wouldn't say Sega necessarily had a huge advantage in SA necessarily given Brazil was their only dominant market... then again it was likely the NES that would be more notable otherwise and not the SNES. (I wouldn't be surprised if the SMS in Brazil was still outselling the MD when Sega sold the rights to TecToy)

    Regardless of one outselling the other, it's clear the 29 million figure is still far, far too low...

    There are more specific figures for Majesco as well (including software sales), but I forget what Pimpuigi's sources were for those.
    6 days older than SEGA Genesis
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    Quote Originally Posted by evilevoix View Post
    Dude it’s the bios that marries the 16 bit and the 8 bit that makes it 24 bit. If SNK released their double speed bios revision SNK would have had the world’s first 48 bit machine, IDK how you keep ignoring this.
    Quote Originally Posted by evilevoix View Post
    the PCE, that system has no extra silicone for music, how many resources are used to make music and it has less sprites than the MD on screen at once but a larger sprite area?

  2. #62
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    The one wikipedia uses.


    Quote Originally Posted by Rusty Venture View Post
    It's not "I like big boobies, where's a pic of Jennifer Love Hewitt!" it's "I like big boobies, and this Sonic character has them. Score!!"

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    Master of Shinobi Thenewguy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kool kitty89 View Post
    I wouldn't say Sega necessarily had a huge advantage in SA necessarily given Brazil was their only dominant market... then again it was likely the NES that would be more notable otherwise and not the SNES.
    No I don't think so. Brazil is by far the biggest market in South America, and from what I've read Tectoy's success there was pretty much considered a miracle, people did not buy officially licensed consoles in South America, illegal clones push all official consoles out of the market.

    Sega most certainly had a huge advantage in South America, in that they sold 2 million whilst everybody else probably sold pretty much nothing.

    At least thats what I've heard, I'm sure some of the Brazilian members of Sega-16 could correct mistakes and shed a lot more light on it.

    If you count all the SNES or NES clones together you'd probably have a very large number of Nintendo machines in SA though, but bootleg clones aren't usually counted in total sales.

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    From Tec Toy's website:

    1993 - Reached 1 Million videogames sold
    1996 - Reached 2 Milions videogames sold

    Those numbers probably include Master System, Game Gear, Sega CD, 32X and Saturn.

  5. #65
    Hero of Algol kool kitty89's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Thenewguy View Post
    No I don't think so. Brazil is by far the biggest market in South America, and from what I've read Tectoy's success there was pretty much considered a miracle, people did not buy officially licensed consoles in South America, illegal clones push all official consoles out of the market.

    Sega most certainly had a huge advantage in South America, in that they sold 2 million whilst everybody else probably sold pretty much nothing.

    At least thats what I've heard, I'm sure some of the Brazilian members of Sega-16 could correct mistakes and shed a lot more light on it.

    If you count all the SNES or NES clones together you'd probably have a very large number of Nintendo machines in SA though, but bootleg clones aren't usually counted in total sales.
    And TecToy's licensed clones aren't counted either.

    Again, it would be good to have a definitive date for when the MD really got popular in Brazil compared to the SMS. (if the SMS was still dominant in the mid 90s, that would likely mean the vast majority of MD sales in the 90s were from TecToy and not Sega -let alone the additional sales in the past 10 years)
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    Quote Originally Posted by evilevoix View Post
    Dude it’s the bios that marries the 16 bit and the 8 bit that makes it 24 bit. If SNK released their double speed bios revision SNK would have had the world’s first 48 bit machine, IDK how you keep ignoring this.
    Quote Originally Posted by evilevoix View Post
    the PCE, that system has no extra silicone for music, how many resources are used to make music and it has less sprites than the MD on screen at once but a larger sprite area?

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    Master of Shinobi Thenewguy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kool kitty89 View Post
    And TecToy's licensed clones aren't counted either.

    Again, it would be good to have a definitive date for when the MD really got popular in Brazil compared to the SMS. (if the SMS was still dominant in the mid 90s, that would likely mean the vast majority of MD sales in the 90s were from TecToy and not Sega -let alone the additional sales in the past 10 years)
    I'm not sure I understand, Tec Toy manufactured all of their Mega Drive's from their manufacturing plants in the free economic zone from the beginning, they were an officially licenced Sega hardware manufacturer after all.

    To be honest I'm not actually happy with the Tec Toy sales estimates anyway, I would like a much more concrete source than what we have, the same goes for Majesco, though at least there we've got the Sam Pettus article giving us an outline of 1-2 million in addition to that Gamehall Network source.

  7. #67
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    Quote Originally Posted by Thenewguy View Post
    I'm not sure I understand, Tec Toy manufactured all of their Mega Drive's from their manufacturing plants in the free economic zone from the beginning, they were an officially licenced Sega hardware manufacturer after all.
    Yes, officially licensed but they used cloned hardware... or at least that's what I understand. (maybe using exact licensed duplicates of Sega's ASICs initially, but later consolidatign them further themselves... unless those were exact copies of the ASICs used in the VA4 model 2 and Geneiss 3 -the external board circuitry is obviously different and resulted in poor audio quality and occasional video quality issues -hence why many modern clones have those same problems as they're based on TecToy's board design and using direct copies of Tectoy's clone ASIC -Yobo's FC3 is the primary exception of a new custom ASIC, @Games doesn't use clone hardware at all of course)
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    Quote Originally Posted by evilevoix View Post
    Dude it’s the bios that marries the 16 bit and the 8 bit that makes it 24 bit. If SNK released their double speed bios revision SNK would have had the world’s first 48 bit machine, IDK how you keep ignoring this.
    Quote Originally Posted by evilevoix View Post
    the PCE, that system has no extra silicone for music, how many resources are used to make music and it has less sprites than the MD on screen at once but a larger sprite area?

  8. #68
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    Quote Originally Posted by kool kitty89 View Post
    Yes, officially licensed but they used cloned hardware... or at least that's what I understand. (maybe using exact licensed duplicates of Sega's ASICs initially, but later consolidatign them further themselves... unless those were exact copies of the ASICs used in the VA4 model 2 and Geneiss 3 -the external board circuitry is obviously different and resulted in poor audio quality and occasional video quality issues -hence why many modern clones have those same problems as they're based on TecToy's board design and using direct copies of Tectoy's clone ASIC -Yobo's FC3 is the primary exception of a new custom ASIC, @Games doesn't use clone hardware at all of course)

    I had a TecToy's Mega Drive II (indeed, it was like the european Mega Drive I). My father gave it to me at Christmas, in 1992. The sound of that machine was great. I'm sure it's not a clone, and now it's part of a collection from a friend of mine. I think the clones began to appear after 1994. But the TecToy's fake Mega Drive without cart slot, the console-in-a-chip garbage... Just after 2003/2004. The "Super Mega Drive III" with "Show do Milhão 2" included was still a "real" Mega Drive.
    I think that don't count these sales it is a big mistake.
    Recently, one of the Tectoy's bosses gave an interview talking about the SMS launch time in Brazil and the success of SMS and Mega Drive in our market.
    The guy said, many times, that they were directly helped by SOA on the study of the video game market, including months of training and helped research at the USA with the SOA staff. For me, it's very clear that Tectoy was more than a enterprise with a license, they were partners!
    The guy said that one of the founders of Sega helped personally to choose line-up of SMS for its launch in Brazil.

    With that said, I think that Tectoy's numbers really count. And, being Brazilian, I'm pretty sure that by the end of 1993 (at maximum) Mega Drive have sold here more than SMS.
    You have to remember that SMS was launched here in 1989 and Mega Drive at 1990. SMS did not have many time to be the "king" of consoles in Brazil...

    Just take a look:
    http://jogos.uol.com.br/infograficos...uol-jogos.jhtm

    The guy talks about the partnership with Sega, Tectoy's history, Sega's history, etc...
    During the video, a photo with the guy, another guy from Sega and Ayrton Senna is showed...
    Last edited by Barone; 11-14-2010 at 02:46 PM.

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    Thing is, any officially licensed version/clone of the console counts towards sales.

    So hopefully ATgames will release some numbers at some point.


    Quote Originally Posted by Rusty Venture View Post
    It's not "I like big boobies, where's a pic of Jennifer Love Hewitt!" it's "I like big boobies, and this Sonic character has them. Score!!"

  10. #70
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    Just to add some information, Ayrton Senna's Monaco GP II was a Tectoy's idea.

  11. #71
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    [QUOTE=agostinhobaroners;316327]I had a TecToy's Mega Drive II (indeed, it was like the european Mega Drive I). My father gave it to me at Christmas, in 1992. The sound of that machine was great. I'm sure it's not a clone, and now it's part of a collection from a friend of mine. I think the clones began to appear after 1994. But the TecToy's fake Mega Drive without cart slot, the console-in-a-chip garbage... Just after 2003/2004. The "Super Mega Drive III" with "Show do Milhão 2" included was still a "real" Mega Drive.
    I think that don't count these sales it is a big mistake.
    Recently, one of the Tectoy's bosses gave an interview talking about the SMS launch time in Brazil and the success of SMS and Mega Drive in our market.[/qupte]
    I'd gotten the impression that Tectoy was a licensed distributor only with Sega supplying all the hardware and most software up to the mid/late 90s when (like Majesco) they fully sold of distribution rights without the same sort of royalties present earlier and eventually TecToy taking over full production as well. (not sure when the latter occurred, but it seems to have been after the release of the MD III -which still used actual Sega parts)

    I'm not totally sure on the actual license relationship or timelines for TecToy or Majesco... more info is needed. (especially any point where terms of the agreement changed -especially if/when Sega completely sold the distribution rights off without any continued royalties and when they did the same for hardware manufacturing)



    With that said, I think that Tectoy's numbers really count. And, being Brazilian, I'm pretty sure that by the end of 1993 (at maximum) Mega Drive have sold here more than SMS.
    You have to remember that SMS was launched here in 1989 and Mega Drive at 1990. SMS did not have many time to be the "king" of consoles in Brazil...

    Just take a look:
    http://jogos.uol.com.br/infograficos...uol-jogos.jhtm

    The guy talks about the partnership with Sega, Tectoy's history, Sega's history, etc...
    During the video, a photo with the guy, another guy from Sega and Ayrton Senna is showed...
    Interesting info there! But how did actual sales figures compare? (the SMS should have been far cheaper and thus more attractive early on... the NES was still selling strong in the early 90s in North America and the NES and SMS were still notable in Europe into the early/mid 90s as well for that matter and those were less price sensitive regions -especially the US) In fact I don't think it was until 1992 that the Genesis was outselling the NES, and that's market share, not including previous sales. (the NES peaked in '89/90 and started declining thereafter but still held a big chunk of the market in terms of sales -it became the defacto lower-end budget console of the early 90s just as the 2600 had been in the mid/late 80s, the SNES and Genesis would become in the late 90s, the PSX in the early/mid 2000s, and the PS2 from 2005 up to today more or less)







    Quote Originally Posted by PimpUigi View Post
    Thing is, any officially licensed version/clone of the console counts towards sales.

    So hopefully ATgames will release some numbers at some point.
    That's a rather different context though... I think it would be more fair to actually compare things with officially licensed sega designed hardware... albeit for the most part (before TECTOY shifted to their own ASICs in the late 90s) that would be using actual Sega manufactured hardware anyway be it the chips if not the complete boards. (in Majesco's case they were simply assembling the cases and packaging the things iirc -the internals are all branded with Sega)

    A reasonable cut-off date would be when the SNES and MD/Genesis were no longer being sold new in any major market region. (which would at least be up to 2000) Any other figures would skew that, officially licensed or not. (albeit I doubt the firecore's sales would even make a dent in that... TecToy's probably would though)
    Last edited by kool kitty89; 11-14-2010 at 08:20 PM.
    6 days older than SEGA Genesis
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    Quote Originally Posted by evilevoix View Post
    Dude it’s the bios that marries the 16 bit and the 8 bit that makes it 24 bit. If SNK released their double speed bios revision SNK would have had the world’s first 48 bit machine, IDK how you keep ignoring this.
    Quote Originally Posted by evilevoix View Post
    the PCE, that system has no extra silicone for music, how many resources are used to make music and it has less sprites than the MD on screen at once but a larger sprite area?

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