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View Full Version : Water Margin - The Tales of Clouds and Winds (by Piko Interactive)



Barone
02-08-2015, 05:23 PM
Jp4-MfSpB2E

SEGA.GENESIS1989
02-08-2015, 05:41 PM
Huzzah!!! An official release! No need to seek out a bootleg with a thick board anymore! Great news!

It looks like he has also kept his promise and found a manufacturer who can produce superior clamshell cases. As announced on his web site:

Source: http://pikointeractive.com/blog/



http://pikointeractive.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2014/12/Case-2-genesis-880x390.jpg (http://pikointeractive.com/blog/newly-manufactured-sega-genesis-cases-black/)
Newly Manufactured Sega Genesis Cases (Black) (http://pikointeractive.com/blog/newly-manufactured-sega-genesis-cases-black/)

piko (http://pikointeractive.com/blog/author/piko/)+ (https://plus.google.com/110406820842828553639/posts)

Posted on December 26, 2014 (http://pikointeractive.com/blog/newly-manufactured-sega-genesis-cases-black/)



We have been a bit silent for the past couple of months; but that does not mean we have been sleeping.We have been working a lot on new products, games, and accessories to bring to the store!We are glad to announce the newly manufactured Sega Genesis Cases. These cases are very similar to the quality of the ones found on many of Genesis games released in the 90s. The plastic material we used for the case is very durable but flexible at the same time. Some Homebrew developers have released some of these cases with a hard plastic that easily breaks with stress; but our new cases can be easily bent and would not easily break.

The film used to protect the case cover is lighter than the original Genesis cases ones, but still very durable if you are careful and not throw the cases around like a Frisbee! The cases are ready to order and available of the store. We will sell them in bundles of 10 cases, however if you need more we can adjust the pricing and shipping for you http://pikointeractive.com/blog/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_biggrin.gif (meaning we will wholesale discount them).As you can see on the picture (http://pikointeractive.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2014/12/Case-2-genesis.jpg), you have a booklet holder tab and a cartridge holder tab on the other side. These things were are not available on the clear Universal Game Cases.

If you have any questions or inquiries, do not hesitate to email us!

Barone
02-08-2015, 05:44 PM
I just wished they had polished the game a bit more.
The visuals and the voices could be improved IMO.

But great news anyway.

JumpingRyle
02-08-2015, 05:44 PM
Alright, no more FF6 music!

NSNGbi3M478

SEGA.GENESIS1989
02-08-2015, 05:50 PM
I just wished they had polished the game a bit more.
The visuals and the voices could be improved IMO.

But great news anyway.

Who knows! He may just decide to do it. The thing that I like about this guy is that he at least has taken the time to interact with us and to get our feedback! Superior customer service is the backbone of a nascent company! I wonder if he'll decide to include a color manual.

=-=-=

JumpingRyle, good observation. I remember alot of the long standing members on SEGA-16 mentioning about the stolen assets found in this game. It will be imperative that he makes the necessary changes before the game is released!

Well, I'm a happy camper and am sure alot of people are too! :mrgreen:

LinkueiBR
02-08-2015, 06:01 PM
This is the best Chinese bootleg game EVER!!! Unfortunately, have some bad colors choice. :(

Zebbe
02-08-2015, 06:32 PM
Great news!

I also noticed the absense of the FFVI music. But the Street Fighter 2 flamed bodies are still there. I guess editing out all stolen stuff would leave the game too empty, though :P.

SEGA-Jorge
02-08-2015, 11:57 PM
This is great. I am looking forwarded to this.

OverDrone
02-09-2015, 08:44 AM
I just wished they had polished the game a bit more.
The visuals and the voices could be improved IMO.

But great news anyway.

First port of call would be to fix stage 2's music volume bug.

maxi
02-09-2015, 08:51 AM
I'm looking foward about all the small adjustments they did to this game. Let's see if I'll spend my money on this.

Zebbe
02-09-2015, 11:10 AM
Pardon me for being a nitpicker (again), but I think the font on the translated text looks a bit too "futuristic", fitting more to a sci-fi themed game. A more suited font for this game would perhaps be Old English, or perhaps something that strikes a resemblance to kanji. With that said, I'd like to take all the feathers left from the chickens Link has killed and put them in the hat of Piko for doing this release :). I've been longing for a re-release of this game for many years, probably since Beggar Prince was released and Brandon Cobb turned it down.

Arm
02-09-2015, 11:55 AM
Looks nice, but the characters poses are ripped off from Capcoms Knights of the Round:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2u-yjKHMJPw

Assman
02-09-2015, 12:10 PM
Water Margin, really? That's what this thing translates to? That's gotta be the worst name I've ever heard for a beat 'em up. It sounds like a bottled water investment simulator.

Anyway, it's awesome that this game is finally going to get a proper translation and release. A big kudos to the people doing this. I'd love to see them tweak things a little bit more, but even if they don't, it's still awesome.


Looks nice, but the characters poses are ripped off from Capcoms Knights of the Round

I take it you're new to this game.

Arm
02-09-2015, 12:28 PM
I had seen this game like 10 years ago and had already noticed the similarities. But I've never really played it. I'm glad people are bringing it officially for those who look for new beatemups.

JumpingRyle
02-09-2015, 12:35 PM
Water Margin, really? That's what this thing translates to? That's gotta be the worst name I've ever heard for a beat 'em up. It sounds like a bottled water investment simulator.


It seems that the story is also known as "Outlaws of the Marsh": http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Water_Margin

That sounds a bit better. But I guess "Water Margin" is the most common English translation.

goldenband
02-09-2015, 01:24 PM
I suppose if it had been localized in the freewheeling 1990s, they might've called it "Extreme Swamp Fighters", or "Bandit Bayou Beatdown", or something else that sounds like a Discovery Channel/Animal Planet show.

I'd like to buy this in principle, but I've already beaten the game! Can't say I'm smitten with the replacement music; too frenetic for my taste. At least the "Mars" ripoff they had before had a stately, Golden Axe quality to it.

Assman
02-09-2015, 02:47 PM
I had seen this game like 10 years ago and had already noticed the similarities. But I've never really played it.

Yeah, there's stolen content from all over the place in this game. It's sort of infamous for that reason; the stuff you noticed is just the tip of the iceberg.


It seems that the story is also known as "Outlaws of the Marsh": http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Water_Margin

That sounds a bit better. But I guess "Water Margin" is the most common English translation.

Oh hell, that sounds way better. At least it sounds like it could be an action game. That's kinda funny, though; even the name of the game is stolen from another source.

Barone
02-09-2015, 03:08 PM
Maybe something like "Brawlers Megamix" would work better for this game. :p

Pyron
02-09-2015, 03:36 PM
Cool they bring it to english language. I like this game cuz they use alot of bkgs/sprites of KOD and KOTR.
And ofc is fun to play.

goldenband
02-09-2015, 09:09 PM
Maybe something like "Brawlers Megamix" would work better for this game. :p

It's not good form to laugh at my own jokes, but the more I think about "Bandit Bayou Beatdown" the more it amuses me. :D

EDIT: My wife says she prefers "Bayou Bandit Beatdown". Fair enough, it's certainly more...syntactically correct.

vintagegamecrazy
02-09-2015, 09:38 PM
Very cool to see and I'd probably buy a copy myself. I do hope that they eliminate more of the stolen content though, that way it would actually be an real game and not a hack.

pikointeractive
02-10-2015, 12:06 AM
Hey guys! Reading all suggestions!

Well actually this is only one of the games that we have acquired that are Taiwan exclusive.

And yes it does have some "stolen" art. However through some research, I was able to find out that at least the art wasn't just directly ripped from one game to another, but used as design reference.

It is very common for pixel artist to use other art to make their "new" design; and lot/most of the time you can definitely see where they get it, or ends up being too similar (specially with amateur pixel artist, look it up, is a thing!). Heck just check Jim Power's song that sounds VERY similar to one of the Y's series game (can't recall!), similar tune, but Jim's was all made from scratch. Even Mr. Huelsbeck addressed this on interviews.

I am personally working on a couple of sound effects (for Water Margin) to change them, and MAY be changing some of the sprites too. But since this is just a small project I wouldn't like to spend all our time on this one and concentrate more on Original stuff :D.

Look it as a project we use to stay relevant in the "industry" while we work on original and much more consuming projects.

Also, I'd like to address another thing, I sort of feel like we bombarded everyone with lists and lists of new releases; (and yet I have to make another announcement soon) The reason why this is happening, is because the structure of the how the company is going to work (or we hope it will work).

We want to basically become a sort of Online KB-toys, where people can come in and see a bunch of games for a bunch of platforms available for purchase (like back in the day! remember EB games, Funcoland, KB-Toys, ToysRus and Walmart). With NO rush whatsoever to the consumer to buy them all quickly because they are "limited runs". We will launch the store with over 10 different games to choose from, and will keep them available until the day Retro gaming is no longer a "thing" (or I die?).

We'll try our best to provide the product line we can, but we will make sure to prioritize and pick our battles for the best.

goldenband
02-10-2015, 12:56 AM
We want to basically become a sort of Online KB-toys, where people can come in and see a bunch of games for a bunch of platforms available for purchase (like back in the day! remember EB games, Funcoland, KB-Toys, ToysRus and Walmart). With NO rush whatsoever to the consumer to buy them all quickly because they are "limited runs". We will launch the store with over 10 different games to choose from, and will keep them available until the day Retro gaming is no longer a "thing"

Now that's awesome. Rep given, as well as my strong interest as a customer.

P.S. If you rename it "Bayou Bandit Beatdown" I'll buy 10 copies. (In binary, that is.)

SEGA.GENESIS1989
02-10-2015, 01:49 AM
Hey guys! Reading all suggestions!

Well actually this is only one of the games that we have acquired that are Taiwan exclusive.

And yes it does have some "stolen" art. However through some research, I was able to find out that at least the art wasn't just directly ripped from one game to another, but used as design reference.

It is very common for pixel artist to use other art to make their "new" design; and lot/most of the time you can definitely see where they get it, or ends up being too similar (specially with amateur pixel artist, look it up, is a thing!). Heck just check Jim Power's song that sounds VERY similar to one of the Y's series game (can't recall!), similar tune, but Jim's was all made from scratch. Even Mr. Huelsbeck addressed this on interviews.

I am personally working on a couple of sound effects (for Water Margin) to change them, and MAY be changing some of the sprites too. But since this is just a small project I wouldn't like to spend all our time on this one and concentrate more on Original stuff :D.

Look it as a project we use to stay relevant in the "industry" while we work on original and much more consuming projects.

Also, I'd like to address another thing, I sort of feel like we bombarded everyone with lists and lists of new releases; (and yet I have to make another announcement soon) The reason why this is happening, is because the structure of the how the company is going to work (or we hope it will work).

We want to basically become a sort of Online KB-toys, where people can come in and see a bunch of games for a bunch of platforms available for purchase (like back in the day! remember EB games, Funcoland, KB-Toys, ToysRus and Walmart). With NO rush whatsoever to the consumer to buy them all quickly because they are "limited runs". We will launch the store with over 10 different games to choose from, and will keep them available until the day Retro gaming is no longer a "thing" (or I die?).

We'll try our best to provide the product line we can, but we will make sure to prioritize and pick our battles for the best.

I had a feeling that the "stolen" art may not be an exact copy of the original work. As you may be aware, this information has been echoed on numerous sites and forums over the past couple of years. Although it has been discussed, I've not seen a clear comparison of the art, sprite work, music, and sound effects to the "original" source material. It might be wise to fact check everything now before the game goes into print. As you may be aware, there are quite alot of SEGA-16 members who are great at compiling info and fact checking. If you are able to illicit their help, you may be able to avoid any foreseeable copyright issues in the future.

With respect to the sound effects (and maybe improved music), I was wondering if you would be willing to post a few samples here on the forum in order to get our feedback?

I'm glad that you've made the business decision to keep the game in stock. I always hated the idea of "limited editions" restricted to a few, limited print runs. It creates a climate of "haves" and "have nots". And gaming should not really be about that.

Anyways ... as others have stated, I will also be supporting your company. All the best! Cheers!

willis
02-10-2015, 01:52 AM
I really like the approach you are taking with the store, in an attempt to eliminate the 'limited run' madness that goes on with some games. Keep us posted on Water Margin as I will purchase a copy, even though the name is unbelievably laughable. It just sounds strange haha!

maxi
02-10-2015, 10:26 AM
I hope one of the releases is Ya-Se Chuan Shuo, the best unlicensed RPG after Beggar Prince.
Or Yang Warrior Family, if Piko can get rid of the slowdown.

pikointeractive
02-10-2015, 11:34 AM
I hope one of the releases is Ya-Se Chuan Shuo, the best unlicensed RPG after Beggar Prince.
Or Yang Warrior Family, if Piko can get rid of the slowdown.

Ya-se Chuan Shuo is a personal favorite, So I think we will concentrate alot on this one when the time comes.

xelement5x
02-10-2015, 11:41 AM
Yup, very cool of you to be forward about keeping games in stock. I know it is more overhead for you guys but I am looking forward to seeing a translated release of this.

Assman
02-10-2015, 02:28 PM
I am personally working on a couple of sound effects (for Water Margin) to change them, and MAY be changing some of the sprites too.

This is probably beyond the realm of possible alterations you'd consider, but it does bug me that certain animations are recycled multiple times. Specifically, I believe the female character has at least three moves using the same exact slash animation; I think there's a standing attack (part of her combo, maybe?), her jumping attack and her dashing attack which all appear identical, which seems sort of crazy to me (especially the jumping attack). I don't recall if the other characters get it that bad, but I'm just throwing this out there.

Thanks for dropping by for the update and, again, major kudos to you for what you're doing.

Pyron
02-10-2015, 03:13 PM
I had a feeling that the "stolen" art may not be an exact copy of the original work.
Yeah, thats it, is not 1:1 rip off but is very close.

http://www.spriters-resource.com/download/31471/
http://spritedatabase.net/files/snes/446/Sprite/Arthur2.PNG


http://lh4.ggpht.com/-YHBOAmjRVdU/UZl5B8tHXPI/AAAAAAAAKiM/wi8fMu2xVq0/king-of-dragon-fase1_thumb%25255B7%25255D.jpg?imgmax=800
http://www.arcade-museum.com/images/118/1181242124123.png
http://www.vizzed.com/videogames/gen/screenshot/Shui%20Hu%20-%20Feng%20Yun%20Zhuan-2.png

http://www.bghq.com/bgs/snes/k/kod/038.png
http://cantogamer.files.wordpress.com/2013/03/shui-hu-feng-yun-zhuanunl_013.jpg?w=614&h=429

JumpingRyle
02-10-2015, 03:47 PM
It looks like they used art from those other games as "inspiration" but re-drew everything.

Kind of like this: http://www.hardcoregaming101.net/tracing/tracing6.htm

synapse
02-10-2015, 04:09 PM
Hey guys! Reading all suggestions!

If this is true... Well, I'm REALLY happy that you decided to release this game, and not only just repro it to death but also tweak it here and there. So, seriously, congrats for that.

That being said, I don't like that there's no mention of the original (chinese) title at all, but I can live with that. Then again, I honestly, really don't like that you guys seem to have completely erradicated all Never Ending Soft logos. I understand it's Piko calling the shots here, but they were the original developers and it doesn't feel right that they're not credited since the very title screen.

Other than that... I'm eager to get myself a copy. I hope the cover artwork looks professional and polished enough.

pikointeractive
02-10-2015, 09:33 PM
If this is true... Well, I'm REALLY happy that you decided to release this game, and not only just repro it to death but also tweak it here and there. So, seriously, congrats for that.

That being said, I don't like that there's no mention of the original (chinese) title at all, but I can live with that. Then again, I honestly, really don't like that you guys seem to have completely erradicated all Never Ending Soft logos. I understand it's Piko calling the shots here, but they were the original developers and it doesn't feel right that they're not credited since the very title screen.

Other than that... I'm eager to get myself a copy. I hope the cover artwork looks professional and polished enough.


They all are in the credits, does that count? (the names of the original staff that worked on it.)

SEGA.GENESIS1989
02-10-2015, 10:11 PM
Thanks for posting a few screen shots Pyron and your feedback JumpingRyle. Based on those screens, I don't think the developer has anything to worry about.

At this point, I would say that the internet over imbellished the idea that artists ripped the artwork directly from other games. The spritework, although similar in the way the character is animated, is NOT the same. What can be said is that the artist probably used the spritework in KOTR as a point of reference in order to create unique character sprites for Shui Hu: Feng Yun Zhuan. Even the barrels are drawn differently. Is there anything else that could be construed as similar? In fact one could argue that they reinterpreted alot of the artistic ideas found in KOTR. Nothing wrong with that. The backgrounds are similar but are NOT the same: The depiction of the forest is totally different. The one thing that is suspect is the scene of the rocky cliff and the sandy shore ... Now that is very, very similar! One could argue that the artist either traced the original background and redrew the rock formations and shoreline.

Daria
02-10-2015, 11:31 PM
I hope one of the releases is Ya-Se Chuan Shuo, the best unlicensed RPG after Beggar Prince.
Or Yang Warrior Family, if Piko can get rid of the slowdown.

Personally I really liked Fengshen Yingjiechuan. Sort of a Chinese/Taiwanese Shining Force.

But I'm looking forward to an official announcement for Brave Battle Saga, started playing the translated version a few nights ago, and am excited to see what Piko Interactive does with it.

pikointeractive
02-11-2015, 12:19 AM
Personally I really liked Fengshen Yingjiechuan. Sort of a Chinese/Taiwanese Shining Force.

But I'm looking forward to an official announcement Brave Battle Saga, started playing the translated version a few nights ago, and am excited to see what Piko Interactive does with it.


Fengshen Yingjiechuan Is currently under translation :D

Daria
02-11-2015, 12:27 AM
Fengshen Yingjiechuan Is currently under translation :D

Ooooooooooooooh.

edit: I'm inferring that you're releasing it from your store then? That's awesome, you can count on my money.

pikointeractive
02-11-2015, 12:38 AM
Ooooooooooooooh.

edit: I'm inferring that you're releasing it from your store then? That's awesome, you can count on my money.

It will take a long time though :D. I have said too much.

Daria
02-11-2015, 01:09 AM
I can imagine, I'm patient though or I wouldn't keep preordering WM's games (hah!)

Seriously though, thanks for the hint. That is super exciting news.

pikointeractive
02-11-2015, 02:14 AM
I can imagine, I'm patient though or I wouldn't keep preordering WM's games (hah!)

Seriously though, thanks for the hint. That is super exciting news.

I hate the long Pre-order system. We will only take pre-orders when the game is ready to go; to help with logistics, but nothing of 1-2 years of wait time :D.

synapse
02-11-2015, 05:11 AM
They all are in the credits, does that count? (the names of the original staff that worked on it.)

Well, that is just the right (legal?) thing to do, but completely replacing their logos with yours from the title screen is too much. It just doesn't feel right. They appear in the final credits? Well, no wonder, they MADE the game, but just listing them there looks as if each one of them belonged/worked for Piko, which is not the case. A simple "Originally developed by Never Ending Soft Team, 1996" could do no harm. Even Super Fighter Team did that with their 3 RPG's for the Mega Drive. "Never Ending Soft Team, 1996 / Piko Interactive, 2015" sounds about right, don't you think?

I hope you take this as what it is, nothing more than constructive criticism, as I'll most probably be buying a copy. But that specifically is what bugs me the most.

That, and I hope that the cover/manual design is top notch. The horrendous cover artwork and ugly title screen is what's currently preventing me from buying Leona's Tricky Adventures, for instance (I know you guys have nothing to do with it, it's just an example). Your SNES covers are less than stellar. Don't get me wrong, please, it's just that they don't look professional enough, from the artwork itself to your logo ALWAYS in a white square even if the background is 100% black. I mean, come on, that's so simple to realize and improve... Skipp and Friends cover artwork (the part of the multicart cover/label, anyway) looks like something my little sister draws then and layouts using WordArt.

Seriously. I want to like and support your games, your initiative and the fact that you put your effort in producing (and localizing when needed) all this. But there's just these tiny details preventing your products from looking as good as they could. And they're not hard to improve.

Tronin
02-11-2015, 06:08 AM
Well, that is just the right (legal?) thing to do, but completely replacing their logos with yours from the title screen is too much. It just doesn't feel right.
I don't see this as a problem, at all.

synapse
02-11-2015, 07:12 AM
I don't see this as a problem, at all.

Nintendo replacing all Platinum Games logos with their own for Bayonetta 2 "but they appear in the final credits" would sound good to you?

Tronin
02-11-2015, 07:33 AM
That's what Nintendo did with Stadium Events/World Class Track Meet. So no, I don't see this as a problem.

synapse
02-11-2015, 07:51 AM
You don't see it as a problem because it's been done already.

Ok. End of debate, of course.

Tronin
02-11-2015, 08:05 AM
Cry me a river will you.

I don't see it as a problem because it's nothing wrong with just having the original team in the credits. It doesn't have anything to do with it being done already.

Edit:
Besides your example with Bayonetta 2 is a whole different thing.

synapse
02-11-2015, 08:20 AM
Bayonetta 2 is a different things because we're talking millions of dollars and well-known companies?

Good. Anyway. Pikointeractive said they wanted our feedback and I did just that. You have your opinion. I'm entitled to mine.

Tronin
02-11-2015, 08:24 AM
Bayonetta 2 is a different things because we're talking millions of dollars and well-known companies?
No. It's different because Nintendo didn't buy Bayonetta as they did with Stadium Events. It's a collaboration between companies.

synapse
02-11-2015, 08:28 AM
Man, it was an example. I haven't even played either game. I said, imagine Nintendo did that. You seemed to think it's ok just because it has been done. Whatever.

My 2 cents. Completely replacing Never Ending Soft Team logos doesn't feel right. If it does to all of you, that's great.

JumpingRyle
02-11-2015, 09:41 AM
Even in the early 90s, many Japanese first and second party developers did NOT get their logos at startup (and often used pseudonyms in the credits). In 1993, Treasure (a 2nd part dev) was one of the first to INSIST that Sega put their logo at the start of their games, and Sega finally relented. This is one reason why there's often a lot of confusion in Japan about who actually developed a game (rather than published it). You usually have to check the credits and match them up to developers that way.

I'd like to see the Never Ending Soft Team logo somewhere, even if it's at the end credits. But it's up to Piko.

pikointeractive
02-11-2015, 12:15 PM
Well, that is just the right (legal?) thing to do, but completely replacing their logos with yours from the title screen is too much. It just doesn't feel right. They appear in the final credits? Well, no wonder, they MADE the game, but just listing them there looks as if each one of them belonged/worked for Piko, which is not the case. A simple "Originally developed by Never Ending Soft Team, 1996" could do no harm. Even Super Fighter Team did that with their 3 RPG's for the Mega Drive. "Never Ending Soft Team, 1996 / Piko Interactive, 2015" sounds about right, don't you think?

I hope you take this as what it is, nothing more than constructive criticism, as I'll most probably be buying a copy. But that specifically is what bugs me the most.

That, and I hope that the cover/manual design is top notch. The horrendous cover artwork and ugly title screen is what's currently preventing me from buying Leona's Tricky Adventures, for instance (I know you guys have nothing to do with it, it's just an example). Your SNES covers are less than stellar. Don't get me wrong, please, it's just that they don't look professional enough, from the artwork itself to your logo ALWAYS in a white square even if the background is 100% black. I mean, come on, that's so simple to realize and improve... Skipp and Friends cover artwork (the part of the multicart cover/label, anyway) looks like something my little sister draws then and layouts using WordArt.

Seriously. I want to like and support your games, your initiative and the fact that you put your effort in producing (and localizing when needed) all this. But there's just these tiny details preventing your products from looking as good as they could. And they're not hard to improve.



1.- We can't use their logo because, although we paid for 100% full rights of the game. The sale did not included the company name or logo. By us using their logo on a commercial purpose, we owe them money; or put our selves out there for a lawsuit. If you are willing to buy enough copies for us to make a bunch of money and keep it as a retainer just in case a lawsuit comes, I'm Game! I'll put their logos everywhere :D.

2.- NeverEnding Softeam is a dead-long-gone-lost company, what good does it do if they don't exist. Now people that never played the game nor know that company will try to look'em up and find nothing but some old articles about the game.

3.- That's why the name of the people who worked on it are on the credits; to credit their original work.

4.- Please do not compare art of our crowd funded, very Amateur, indie, Noob, homebrew project. To our later games when we already have a company. If you haven't followed us, The art of Mr. Bloppy is ok (at least that's what I think), and I love the art of Apocalypse II (HD remake of the title screen).

5.- I agree, Skip and friends art sucks, I made it in like 5 minutes lol.

6.- We are doing all we can to provide the best possible product line.

synapse
02-11-2015, 02:46 PM
Valid points. What you said about the logo makes sense.

However, as I said before, Super Fighter Team mentioned C&E in the title screen for Beggar Prince. I don't see how this could be wrong:
http://www.beggarprince.com/images/bprince01.gif

I'm glad you accept criticism about the cover art and I'm eager to see what you guys are cooking :)

Barone
02-11-2015, 02:58 PM
However, as I said before, Super Fighter Team mentioned C&E in the title screen for Beggar Prince. I don't see how this could be wrong:
C&E INC. still exists, but it's not the case here (like he explained). It makes no sense to put the name of a defunct company there.

pikointeractive
02-11-2015, 03:17 PM
C&E INC. still exists, but it's not the case here (like he explained). It makes no sense to put the name of a defunct company there.

Yes, If they would still exist I would gladly leave the logos. Actually we have a collection of logos of the companies we have licenses/game rights or are working on the site. And I sort of love to have them there.

synapse
02-12-2015, 03:29 AM
You said you're noy using their logo because you'd have to pay for it then.
How can they charge you for it if they don't exist anymore?

Barone
02-12-2015, 04:22 AM
You said you're using their logo because you'd have to pay for it then.
How can they charge you for it if they don't exist anymore?
lol
Nobody, besides you, gives a flying fuck about the logo of a Taiwanese company which released UNLICENSED games in a far away land 20 years ago and which has closed down several years ago.
The only valid concern here is about the original team credits and the guy has already said it will be there, so no need for this nonsense.

Seriously, if you're about to bust some balls, go ask your friend Tulio when, if ever, WM pretends to release Project Y.
Or, better yet, ask your fellas from Fase Bonus when they will refund the money of people who payed for Magic Girl and never received it.

synapse
02-12-2015, 08:20 AM
I don't think there's any need to be disrespectful because I don't share the general opinion. It's what I think, I talked about it in a constructive way, and asked a legitimate question.

"My friend"? "My fellas"? Sure, I don't like ProjectY's delays either. And I don't have any kind of friendship or relation with Fase Bonus. Your point? Do I still have the right to express my opinion in a polite way, unlike you just did?

Barone
02-12-2015, 08:44 AM
I don't think there's any need to be disrespectful because I don't share the general opinion. It's what I think, I talked about it in a constructive way, and asked a legitimate question.
Your question has been answered several times at this point.



"My friend"? "My fellas"? Sure, I don't like ProjectY's delays either. And I don't have any kind of friendship or relation with Fase Bonus. Your point? Do I still have the right to express my opinion in a polite way, unlike you just did?
You have the right to express your opinion and I have the right to express mine.
My legitimate opinion: You're being anal about a stupid detail that doesn't really matter and I think we could use Piko's interest in the community feedback in a much better way.

synapse
02-12-2015, 08:52 AM
It doesn't matter to you and that's fine. People share their opinions about gameplay, sound, aesthetics and/or presentation, which I did. I'm still buying the game but I didn't know it was so offensive (to you, it seems) to dislike "a stupid detail".

Besides, my question about how can they charge you for using the logo if they don't exist anymore has not been replied, no.

Again, I don't see the need to be disrespectful. You disagree with me? Great. But why you react this way is beyond me.

Best regards.

SEGA.GENESIS1989
02-12-2015, 08:53 AM
I agree with Barone. That logo thing is a moot point. If the end credits acknowledges the company, I don't see it as an issue whatsoever.

I can understand pikointeractive's concerns. If sh*t hits the fan, he and he alone will face the reprocussions. As fans, all we'll be able to do is lament over the issue.

Barone
02-12-2015, 09:18 AM
It doesn't matter to you and that's fine. People share their opinions about gameplay, sound, aesthetics and/or presentation, which I did. I'm still buying the game but I didn't know it was so offensive (to you, it seems) to dislike "a stupid detail".

Besides, my question about how can they charge you for using the logo if they don't exist anymore has not been replied, no.

Again, I don't see the need to be disrespectful. You disagree with me? Great. But why you react this way is beyond me.

Best regards.
Don't play the victim card with me, pal. It doesn't really work, it hasn't worked for anybody and it will not work for you.

You were scrutinizing pikointeractive's answers in a nasty way IMO.
I just called out your bullshit because it's nonsense, OK?

Fase Bonus guys aren't your fellas but:
http://www.sega-16.com/forum/showthread.php?27771-Storebonus-net-ignoring-emails-after-parcel-never-appeared-Help!&p=665095&viewfull=1#post665095

Tulio isn't your friend but:
http://www.sega-16.com/forum/showthread.php?22142-Project-Y-Official-Thread&p=705452&viewfull=1#post705452

There's so much more to scrutinize in WM's empty promises or Fase Bonus' atrocious customer service and their several potential copyright infringements - stuff that I fail to remember you're being critical about - that it really amazed me to see your attitude towards Piko in this thread.

Nightwolf
02-12-2015, 09:23 AM
There's so much more to scrutinize in WM's empty promises or Fase Bonus' atrocious customer service and their several potential copyright infringements - stuff that I fail to remember you're being critical about - that it really amazed me to see your attitude towards Piko in this thread.

But this post is about this game release, nor other publisher, isn't? Please, back to topic.

synapse
02-12-2015, 09:53 AM
...

I didn't say Tulio isn't my friend.
I said the guys are Fase Bonus are not my friends and I can say it again if you like. The only thing I did was emailing them in spanish, as I know there's a huge language barrier and thought I could give a hand to users here. It didn't work, though, and I've never tried to justified their poor customer service. Again, I don't see the point of discussing any of that in this thread. Again, you keep being disrespectful and I'm out of this debate. Which is what some of you wanted I assume, so congrats.

Bye.

Melf
02-12-2015, 09:57 AM
Yes, please take all discussions about other companies and their releases to PMs or another thread. This is not the place for it. Let's get this thread back on topic.

Barone
02-12-2015, 10:15 AM
I'm out of this debate. Which is what some of you wanted I assume, so congrats.
Thanks, you're welcome.



But this post is about this game release, nor other publisher, isn't? Please, back to topic.

Yes, please take all discussions about other companies and their releases to PMs or another thread. This is not the place for it. Let's get this thread back on topic.
I really don't see the problem of citing other companies and/or mentioning the way they handle their business in a comparative context, pikointeractive himself mentioned WM's "long pre-order" several posts ago.
Copyright, licensing, pricing, business model, etc; all those are subjects relevant to the discussion regardless the company and usually recurrent in threads like this. And comparisons are more than natural during discussions.

If I weren't interested in Piko's products I wouldn't have created this thread in the first place.

Barone
02-12-2015, 10:36 AM
We want to basically become a sort of Online KB-toys, where people can come in and see a bunch of games for a bunch of platforms available for purchase (like back in the day! remember EB games, Funcoland, KB-Toys, ToysRus and Walmart). With NO rush whatsoever to the consumer to buy them all quickly because they are "limited runs". We will launch the store with over 10 different games to choose from, and will keep them available until the day Retro gaming is no longer a "thing" (or I die?).

We'll try our best to provide the product line we can, but we will make sure to prioritize and pick our battles for the best.
One thing I would like to ask about one of the announced games is: do you intend to make any kinda of improvements on Duke Nukem 3D?

Do you plan to have promotional packages (IDK the proper term)? I mean, stuff like buying your complete MD catalog and having a discount in the final price.

pikointeractive
02-12-2015, 01:22 PM
One thing I would like to ask about one of the announced games is: do you intend to make any kinda of improvements on Duke Nukem 3D?

Do you plan to have promotional packages (IDK the proper term)? I mean, stuff like buying your complete MD catalog and having a discount in the final price.


Yes there would be coupon codes, sales etc.

However, as I explained before, the reason we licensed/acquired some of these games is to support the strategy we would take on the online store. So some would receive more attention than others.

For example, Battle Brave Saga would probably be the translation that has been around for ages (I've talked to the guys that did it and we would work out a deal with them), just some changes would be done to the text.

Water Margin got translated 100% and some things were tweaked.

Other titles would receive much more attention, some not so much.



Since we are a small company (I consider Piko Interactive to be even smaller than SFT, WM, and Collectorvision) I have to be very smart where we put our money. One bad choice, and we are gone!



And to the Logo guy. If the company doesn't exist and we use the logo, there might be a person (who might be on the credits) that kept the rights to use that logo and name. He sees for some reason that we are selling a game with his property and (Yay!) we got a lawsuit.

If you want I can explain it in Spanish:


Mira, en mi experiencia, es muy posible que alguien que trabajo o contrato a los programadores se quedo con los derechos de autor de el nombre "Never Ending Soft Team". Esa persona por casualidad se puede dar cuenta si usamos el Logo/Nombre al vender el juego; en tonces basicamente le estamos dando un caso ganado en la corte y miles de dollares pagados por daņos a su propiedad.

Es mucho mas prudente no utilizar el logo (porque no fue parte de la adquicision del titulo) para no prestarnos o arriesgarnos a que pueda suceder algo.

Al incluir los creditos del juego original, estamos dando el respeto que ellos se merecen. Ellos ya no son Never Ending Soft Team, ellos son personas individuales cuando la compaņia cerro.

Azathoth
02-13-2015, 02:22 AM
It looks like they used art from those other games as "inspiration" but re-drew everything.

That's kind of sugar coating a bit of it. The Michael Jordan sprite in Top Fighter 2000 is just a heavily edited Lucky sprite fro KoF '94, Giving him a bald head and different shirt design isn't "inspiration", it's MUGEN-style asset ripping with a bit of elbow grease. If I put a goatee and fez cap on the Mario 3 and sunglasses on a Goomba I don't think I could say I was just "inspired" by the SMB3 art style. Ripping assets and slightly changing them to fit into a smaller color palette isn't "inspiration" either.

While there is a ton of stuff that was plainly straight ripped or traced over then altered a lot of stuff exists that is 100% copied. The aforementioned SFII flaming body sprite, magic stolen from Golden Axe, Forgotten Worlds, and other places, digitized sound clips from Streets of Rage 2, and entire music driver is lifted from either High Seas Havok or Wonderboy (can't remember which). Seems like I remember Cobb saying one of the reasons they never bothered to release this & Brave Battle Saga was it would take too much effort to redo everything that was not original work.

spiffyone
02-15-2015, 08:07 PM
back to the topic at hand:

Any way the title of the game can be changed to "Outlaws of the Marsh"? That title sounds much better than "Water Margin" and more befitting of a beat 'em up.

goldenband
02-15-2015, 08:32 PM
Any way the title of the game can be changed to "Outlaws of the Marsh"? That title sounds much better than "Water Margin" and more befitting of a beat 'em up.

I agree with this 100%. (That is, if we can't have Bayou Bandit Beatdown.)

Daria
02-17-2015, 04:08 PM
For example, Battle Brave Saga would probably be the translation that has been around for ages (I've talked to the guys that did it and we would work out a deal with them), just some changes would be done to the text.


I've been playing the game and there's some things graphically that could use some tweaks as well. Specifically:

The paralax scrolling background inside the moon temple is improperly tiled.
And any chance of editing the party sprites to match their battle-sprites in terms of color? Maybe giving Cherie wings?

synapse
02-18-2015, 03:34 AM
back to the topic at hand:

Any way the title of the game can be changed to "Outlaws of the Marsh"? That title sounds much better than "Water Margin" and more befitting of a beat 'em up.

Agreed.

Barone
02-18-2015, 03:42 AM
Any way the title of the game can be changed to "Outlaws of the Marsh"? That title sounds much better than "Water Margin" and more befitting of a beat 'em up.
QFT.

OverDrone
02-18-2015, 04:26 AM
Don't know if anyone's mentioned it already, but the game is also known as Beneath the Clouds, which to me does sound better than Water Margin.

xelement5x
02-18-2015, 03:38 PM
back to the topic at hand:

Any way the title of the game can be changed to "Outlaws of the Marsh"? That title sounds much better than "Water Margin" and more befitting of a beat 'em up.

I like this translation too as it seems to make a bit more sense. Just my 2c.

Zebbe
02-18-2015, 05:49 PM
I have nothing against the decided title, to me it's more original than "Outlaws of the March", which sounds generic for a beat 'em up to me.

SEGA-Jorge
02-19-2015, 02:30 PM
Yeah, I have to say I like Water Margin. It's an interesting title.

Winterwolfen
08-11-2015, 04:58 PM
emm...do people know here you can buy the game now from piko interactive?

Jeckidy
08-11-2015, 05:25 PM
Isn't there a taiwanese RPG also named after The Water Margin? It used to be mislabeled as Tiger Hunter Hero Novel in the old GoodSet.

Zebbe
08-11-2015, 05:34 PM
Now I know... thanks! I just paid for my copy.

SEGA-Jorge
08-12-2015, 02:29 AM
Holy sh*t... That case art is a nightmare...I'll buy it, but I'm making my own case slip...
https://dpbfm6h358sh7.cloudfront.net/images/2585222/300229918.jpg

OverDrone
08-12-2015, 11:31 AM
I'll pass on this one since I've owned it for years, though the claims of bug and gameplay fixes sounds interesting. I'd urge anyone who hasn't played this to check it out, it's remarkably solid and fixes can only make it better.

maxi
08-12-2015, 12:59 PM
What exactly was fixed in the gameplay?
I'm tempted to buy the game, but I'm in a difficult position because the money in my country is in a really poor state now (US$1 = 3,50).

EPSYLON EAGLE
08-12-2015, 01:02 PM
What exactly was fixed in the gameplay?
I'm tempted to buy the game, but I'm in a difficult position because the money in my country is in a really poor state now (US$1 = 3,50).

Brazilian?

xelement5x
08-12-2015, 02:19 PM
Looks neat, Pico is pretty good about keeping stuff in stock though. Hopefully I can get funds next month and pick it up.

Black_Tiger
08-12-2015, 03:02 PM
I'm glad that it's finally available, but the cover art is disappointing. :/

Guntz
08-12-2015, 05:47 PM
If I were to buy a new Genesis game, which would be better? Oh Mummy! or Water Margin?

SEGA.GENESIS1989
08-12-2015, 07:12 PM
If I were to buy a new Genesis game, which would be better? Oh Mummy! or Water Margin?

In my humble opinion I would purchase Water Margin/Shui Hu Feng Yun Zhuan. I was surprised how good this game was especially when you consider that it is a unlicensed title.

maxi
08-13-2015, 11:00 AM
Brazilian?
Unfortunately.

SEGA-Jorge
08-13-2015, 11:06 AM
Is the combat in the game any good? Deeper than golden axe? SOR2? I'm interested in getting this, but I don't want to pay $40 for a bland game.

Where does this fall among other beat em ups in the system?

SEGA.GENESIS1989
08-13-2015, 12:44 PM
Is the combat in the game any good? Deeper than golden axe? SOR2? I'm interested in getting this, but I don't want to pay $40 for a bland game.

Where does this fall among other beat em ups in the system?

I would say that the game is above average. I wouldn't put it above SoR2 but in my opinion it is equal or better than Golden Axe. There is a repetition in terms of enemy attacks but when discussing this era of console gaming, that is to be expected. I would say that this game is fairly good. I have alot of fun playing it. :D

Here is the SEGA-16 thread where people have given their overall impressions of the game:
http://www.sega-16.com/forum/showthread.php?15238-Shui-Hu-Feng-Yun-Zhuan

Most long term members like Lan Di consider the game quite good. Kamahl's commentary about the visual effects are spot on. When I played the game for the first time, I was blown away.

I'm quite glad that we are getting a translated version of the game. In my opinion, anyone who is an avid fan of the system should really play this game.

Edit...

Here is a video that you may be interested in featuring content from the original game:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NSNGbi3M478

tbp
08-13-2015, 03:47 PM
In my honest opinion, it is the "Knights of the round" of the Genny but in a more dynamic way.
I love so much the Golden Axe series that I would never say it is better. Gameplay and mood are rather different.
Piko release is expensive because the quality of artwork seems average into my eyes : 71 $ (with shipping cost for a CIB copy*).
We are far from a WaterMelon quality release all the more their games are cheaper for a 100% crafted product from A to Z.
Piko did some light modifications of the content (mainly translation) but nothing more which can justify a such retail price.

* 40 $ is for a loose cartridge without any shipping cost.

Nightwolf
08-13-2015, 03:56 PM
Yeah 71 is too much to me. Dammit :(

matteus
08-13-2015, 04:12 PM
Everyone in this game walks like they're in need of a dump!

SEGA-Jorge
08-13-2015, 06:30 PM
Wait, what? The game is $70? GTFO with that... I though it was $40 complete, that I can live with...

OverDrone
08-14-2015, 02:45 AM
Is the combat in the game any good? Deeper than golden axe? SOR2? I'm interested in getting this, but I don't want to pay $40 for a bland game.

Where does this fall among other beat em ups in the system?

It's quite solid overall, if a bit limited move-wise given the year of release. You have your standard combo that you cycle through, jump attack, 'blown off attack' (FF style GTFO me move) and a double tap forward move that floors enemies, as well as the admittedly impressive magic attacks. That's about it. Oh, and there is a way of making enemies fly right off the screen but I'm not sure if it's random or executed through a pad motion. I'm leaning towards the latter but still can't get it out consistently.

The other gameplay quirk that stuck out a bit was that the chick, although the quickest and seemingly having the longest range, takes ages to kill enemies with longer life bars. It does become monotonous to grind them down later in the game or on higher difficulties.

Of course all this is based on the copy I've had for years, Piko Interactive may well have changed up certain elements in this new version, they did say gameplay fixes after all.

It could well be as good as Growl or maybe Mystical Fighter, but I wouldn't realistically put it higher than those.

Thierry Henry
08-14-2015, 03:10 AM
What exactly was fixed in the gameplay?
I'm tempted to buy the game, but I'm in a difficult position because the money in my country is in a really poor state now (US$1 = 3,50).

Don't complain too much. :p

Ours is 12.84

SEGA-Jorge
08-14-2015, 03:13 AM
It's quite solid overall, if a bit limited move-wise given the year of release. You have your standard combo that you cycle through, jump attack, 'blown off attack' (FF style GTFO me move) and a double tap forward move that floors enemies, as well as the admittedly impressive magic attacks. That's about it. Oh, and there is a way of making enemies fly right off the screen but I'm not sure if it's random or executed through a pad motion. I'm leaning towards the latter but still can't get it out consistently.

The other gameplay quirk that stuck out a bit was that the chick, although the quickest and seemingly having the longest range, takes ages to kill enemies with longer life bars. It does become monotonous to grind them down later in the game or on higher difficulties.

Of course all this is based on the copy I've had for years, Piko Interactive may well have changed up certain elements in this new version, they did say gameplay fixes after all.

It could well be as good as Growl or maybe Mystical Fighter, but I wouldn't realistically put it higher than those.

I actually just got Mystical Fighter and I was kinda underwhelmed... It was pretty bland all around. I'm glad I finally got it, but I was not too crazy about the game. I'll have to revisit it.

OverDrone
08-14-2015, 06:27 AM
Yeah, I sold off my Mystical Fighter a couple of years ago for the same reason. It wasn't totally without merit but bland is definitely the word that springs to mind. Graphics and sound were both super average, typical Taito on MD really.

I did like the spinning throws though.

tbp
08-14-2015, 11:17 AM
Oh, and there is a way of making enemies fly right off the screen but I'm not sure if it's random or executed through a pad motion. I'm leaning towards the latter but still can't get it out consistently.
It is indeed a pad motion. When I began to play the game, I though it was a recurent bug. But it is not.


It could well be as good as Growl or maybe Mystical Fighter, but I wouldn't realistically put it higher than those. Growl is BAD. Mystical fighter is rather average/good with a 2P mode and I will never sell my copy (even if this game is far from perfect with a lot of lacks/weak points).
Water Margin graphically and musically is far better. Magical powers are awesome. But yes the move set is limited (can't grab or catch ennemies) and the ennemies are a bit monotonous. Also there is always the same 2 or 3 screams when characters/ennemies die. There is no saynette within the game, only static interludes between stages. With more great details, surprises/obstacles/traps in the stages (too classic/linear/flat levels), Water Margin could have been better than Golden Axe.

SEGA-Jorge
08-14-2015, 01:48 PM
Golden axe is awesome though. from the looks of things, Water Margin needs a whole lot of stuff before it would be better than GA.

Assman
08-14-2015, 07:40 PM
Oh, and there is a way of making enemies fly right off the screen but I'm not sure if it's random or executed through a pad motion. I'm leaning towards the latter but still can't get it out consistently.

I did some more messing around with this and it turns out the button combination is way simpler (in theory) than anyone thinks; it's just forward+B. Yes, really. I'm 99% sure that's the right combination.

The problem is that the timing on it is strict and not really in line with your standard direction+button move. The only way I can pull it off with relative consistency is to focus on hitting B just a hair (a few frames, maybe?) before hitting the D-pad. Maybe that's just because I'm so primed to put a slight delay between a directional tap and an action button in fighting games that even "forward+B" will come out more like "forward, B" out of habit, but either way, it works for me.

OverDrone
08-14-2015, 08:48 PM
^ I thought it might have been forward+B but failed consistently enough to keep trying pad motions, so that's good to know. Makes sense it coming out at seemingly random times, too.

In all honesty I think this game could have benefited from one or two more gameplay elements to expand combat - something like a ground attack on floored enemies, and some sort of basic juggle system in place to deepen the enemy management element a bit more. But yeah, those would be major additions.

If the enemy AI was more aggressive earlier on in the game this might have been enough anyway.

tbp
08-15-2015, 05:53 PM
Here you can watch the Piko version : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WcbXGIbmB6w

SEGA-Jorge
08-16-2015, 12:47 AM
I'd like to see some 2 player footage. Does the game hold up well? BTW, was this essentially a rom hack of something? Did these guys actually write their own engine and just rip-off sprites? Or is this a GAIII/SOR/whatever rom hack? From looking at it, it really has a GAIII look to it, in regards to weight of the characters, running, jumping rhythm. It's just screaming GAIII.

Barone
08-16-2015, 12:33 PM
No, the engine is unique to this game AFAIK and as far as I've played. And it works well. It's a good brawler after all.

Regarding the Piko release, some let downs IMO:
- The color palettes weren't reworked.
- The voices weren't improved (they sound quite scratchy IMO, but tolerable for sure).
- No new game options AFAIK.
- The font used to the intro text doesn't make any sense.

QuickSciFi
08-16-2015, 08:39 PM
This was an instant purchase for me. But the article confused me. Is this the only Genesis release from Pico Interactive so far, or have they done another I did not know about?

SEGA.GENESIS1989
08-17-2015, 12:15 AM
This was an instant purchase for me. But the article confused me. Is this the only Genesis release from Pico Interactive so far, or have they done another I did not know about?

I believe it's an error. About a year ago Pikointeractive made the announcement that they were planning to release Duke Nukem 3d as their first SEGA Genesis title but as far as I know the company has yet to release the game. Shortly thereafter, they also announced that Jim Power the Lost Dimension was also going to be released for the SEGA Genesis. Again they have not released the game yet.

My belief is that since Shui Hu Feng Yun Zhuan requires very few changes, they decided to release this game first.

QuickSciFi
08-17-2015, 10:13 AM
Cool. Thanks

adhere2
08-18-2015, 04:08 PM
Bought. Yeah $55USD is a little rough but that seems to be around the going rate for physical releases these days. Does anyone know if they're shipping out right away? It says "in stock" on the site but I'm always a little skeptical after dealing with Super Fighter and WM.

QuickSciFi
08-18-2015, 04:23 PM
I received an instant email regarding my purchase. I think they will ship promptly.

netpredakonn
08-19-2015, 02:35 PM
I bought mine Monday and they have already shipped it. So, it's going pretty fast. Still US$ 55 dollars is bit steep, but they have it in stock. SFT is charging as much as that in they ship after 2 years (Legend of Wukong).

adhere2
08-19-2015, 03:04 PM
Just got an email today that said it's shipped. "Estimated delivery time is: 8 days."

Yeah no joke about the SFT taking two years. I probably won't pre-order anything from them again. Seems strange for a company to have pre-orders that far out as well as that vague ("shipping in...2015")

Raja
08-19-2015, 05:10 PM
Recently purchased as well and it is already in transit. We'll see how long it takes to get here (NY).

xelement5x
08-19-2015, 07:19 PM
Recently purchased as well and it is already in transit. We'll see how long it takes to get here (NY).

Cool! I am excited to hear some first hand remarks on the packaging and the gameplay.

pikointeractive
08-19-2015, 09:48 PM
Hey guys!

Thanks for all the comments and feedback. We are trying or best to bring the projects into all kinds of balances.

All the PCBs were assembled as orders were rolling in. So you can say that this batch was mostly made in USA.

I appreciate all the people that have purchased the game and will do our best to keep your business; and for the ones that haven't we will do our best to convince you into trying our products.

Zebbe
08-27-2015, 12:12 PM
I got the game :). It is very nice! Graphics look great and the music is mostly enjoyable too. I played through the easy difficulty setting with the sword guy, it was fun. The package of the game is on the level of Super Fighter Team (the boxes look exactly the same), it's OK. The manual artwork and layout looks great and almost compensate for the too small box insert size. Some criticism: there are a lot of spelling errors on the box and in the manual. I am offering Piko proof-reading to fix this for a second production run of the game, and for any other game they plan to release, completely free of charge.

adhere2
08-27-2015, 03:03 PM
Yep, I received the game too today. Haven't played it yet so I can only comment on the packaging... Not super impressed. I actually ordered a repro Wiley Wars recently and it came today as well. They both had the same cheaper repro cases– the ones that have the glossy plastic sleeve on the front and they don't close all the way. The sticker on the cart had peeled up on the top a bit but I've seen that happen before. The manual was pretty nice but felt a little flimsy. Overall, I'm still pumped to have a new release Genesis game.

Barone
08-27-2015, 04:04 PM
@Zebbe
I'm especially interested in the said bug fixes. What exactly was fixed in terms of gameplay compared to the unlicensed ROM we had played before?

Zebbe
08-27-2015, 04:29 PM
Sorry to disappoint, but I have no idea. Haven't played the ROM in many years. I tried to find some in the longplay on YouTube, but saw none. Among the new content I notice in Piko's release, I think the new intro theme is very good (actually better than the Terra theme ripoff of the original). The translation is good I guess, but it's a bit hard to read the titles of the stages which appear between levels. The new voice samples aren't as good as those in Streets of Rage II, but better bad than stolen :).

Overall, I must say Piko has done a fine job and this is a fine feather in their hat. The presentation of this release has its flaws here and there, but we finally got a fine new brawler to enjoy without having to buy a repro or an ultr@ r@re Taiwanese original, which is most important. I'm looking forward to their future Mega Drive games.

SEGA-Jorge
08-27-2015, 05:00 PM
I will probably get this band make new sleave/booklet for it.

Pico Interactive:
If you need graphic design and illustration work, feel free to ask. I'd be glad to help.

Barone
08-27-2015, 05:08 PM
Sorry to disappoint, but I have no idea. Haven't played the ROM in many years. I tried to find some in the longplay on YouTube, but saw none. Among the new content I notice in Piko's release, I think the new intro theme is very good (actually better than the Terra theme ripoff of the original). The translation is good I guess, but it's a bit hard to read the titles of the stages which appear between levels. The new voice samples aren't as good as those in Streets of Rage II, but better bad than stolen :).

Overall, I must say Piko has done a fine job and this is a fine feather in their hat. The presentation of this release has its flaws here and there, but we finally got a fine new brawler to enjoy without having to buy a repro or an ultr@ r@re Taiwanese original, which is most important. I'm looking forward to their future Mega Drive games.
Thanks a lot for the feedback, Zebbe.
I didn't know about the new samples. That's a good point.
Dollar is through the roof in Brazil but I'll see if I can snag a copy for myself based on what you said.

Thanks again. ;)

xelement5x
08-27-2015, 05:13 PM
I got the game :). It is very nice! Graphics look great and the music is mostly enjoyable too. I played through the easy difficulty setting with the sword guy, it was fun. The package of the game is on the level of Super Fighter Team (the boxes look exactly the same), it's OK. The manual artwork and layout looks great and almost compensate for the too small box insert size. Some criticism: there are a lot of spelling errors on the box and in the manual. I am offering Piko proof-reading to fix this for a second production run of the game, and for any other game they plan to release, completely free of charge.

Thanks for the review Zebbe!

That's too bad there are issues with the box/manual, a nice complete package is one of the main reason I'd want to get it :(

Zebbe
08-27-2015, 05:48 PM
No problem!

Well, I want to be honest, not a bootlicker, so Piko can improve for future releases. I may be nitpicking, but it's better to do that than to be silent. Still, I fully recommend a purchase.

cowboyscowboys
08-27-2015, 06:26 PM
Thanks for the review Zebbe!

That's too bad there are issues with the box/manual, a nice complete package is one of the main reason I'd want to get it :(

Seriously that would be the main selling point considering you can play the chinese version of the game already cheep or free.

adhere2
08-27-2015, 07:15 PM
Thanks for the review Zebbe!

That's too bad there are issues with the box/manual, a nice complete package is one of the main reason I'd want to get it :(

Yeah, the box/manual aren't terrible but I'm comparing it to the last release of Pier Solar which was super top notch IMO. This one feels a lot more inexpensive unfortunately. But like Zebbe said, its a small gripe when we just got a new brawler to enjoy.

Winterwolfen
08-29-2015, 03:03 PM
I received my copy yesterday, like Zebbe has already noted, the quality is not so good. However, for anybody out there who also have bought a copy, am I the only one here who has problem with the game freezing?
I'm playing it on a European MD1, modded to 50 and 60HZ

barneygumble
08-29-2015, 07:38 PM
Mine arrived now too, but I didnt had the time to play it more then a few minutes yet, so it didnt freeze on my US Genesis1 Model.
The gamecartridge is a quite tight fit to the cartridgeport. removing and inserting the cartridge is quite hard.

From Quality standards I would say its a bit better then 1985Alternativo / SuperFighterTeam Releases : only Cartridge shell (without screws, glued together with gluegun )
are also the thinner plastic , and the cheap snapcase is a bit disappointing. ( 10597 - but Print quality of the manual is nice ( but comes with typo / spelling errors 1059910600) . Im glad to see
Picko didnt used the cheap 4$ "blob" boards from china for the gameboards 10598.

I do hope Piko can upgrade a few quality points for their next releases, and you have my support for the future releases as well.

barneygumble
08-29-2015, 07:53 PM
10596

@Winterwolfen maybe your cartridge isnt glued in straight ( as in my case was hard to insert, but it may also lead to freezing during gameplay )

QuickSciFi
08-29-2015, 11:11 PM
The game plays beautifully. It is exactly what I was hoping it would be, from all the youtube reviews I've seen. I'm glad I have a hard copy.

P.S.> Just an observation: The clamshell case is longer than regular cases (as well as other cases such as Super Fighter Team and WaterMelon).
I don't mean taller, I mean longer (in depth). It sticks out amidst the rest in my collection, right alongside my copies of Shadow of the Beast and Fatal Rewind.

Winterwolfen
08-30-2015, 04:26 AM
This is really strange, the game will freeze randomly, often within the first 3 levels, on the MD1, both on 50 and 60HZ, with and without japanese languange setting.

However, I also own european MD2 (not modded), and on this it seems to work, I have played 4 levels and nothing happened, and also work on 32X

xelement5x
08-31-2015, 04:13 PM
Mine arrived now too, but I didnt had the time to play it more then a few minutes yet, so it didnt freeze on my US Genesis1 Model.
The gamecartridge is a quite tight fit to the cartridgeport. removing and inserting the cartridge is quite hard.

From Quality standards I would say its a bit better then 1985Alternativo / SuperFighterTeam Releases : only Cartridge shell (without screws, glued together with gluegun )
are also the thinner plastic , and the cheap snapcase is a bit disappointing. ( 10597 - but Print quality of the manual is nice ( but comes with typo / spelling errors 1059910600) . Im glad to see
Picko didnt used the cheap 4$ "blob" boards from china for the gameboards 10598.

I do hope Piko can upgrade a few quality points for their next releases, and you have my support for the future releases as well.

That doesn't look too bad, I'm not sure I see what the misspellings are though?

Seems like the best benefit would be getting djshok to make a custom insert though :P

Stef
09-01-2015, 05:34 AM
That doesn't look too bad, I'm not sure I see what the misspellings are though?

"Break open", you can probably get rid of the "open" word here.
Also i would have added a "s" to "treasure" or removed the one from "meals". Then a small mistake on "peices" which should be "pieces".

xelement5x
09-01-2015, 02:16 PM
"Break open", you can probably get rid of the "open" word here.
Also i would have added a "s" to "treasure" or removed the one from "meals". Then a small mistake on "peices" which should be "pieces".

For someone from France you have a much more discerning eye for the English language than even I do. Maybe years of interaction with poorly written content has finally taken its toll on me :(

SEGA.GENESIS1989
09-01-2015, 07:34 PM
I believe the language used is fine: "Break open" indicates that you are "opening something forcefully".

"Peices" should read as "pieces". Nice job Barneygumble! :D

OverDrone
09-02-2015, 02:16 AM
I believe the language used is fine: "Break open" indicates that you are "opening something forcefully".

Yep, you hear it all the time. I'm about to break open a packet of mini-wheats right now, actually.


"Peices" should read as "pieces". Nice job Barneygumble! :D

'i' before 'e' except after 'c' is the rule.

Raistlin
09-02-2015, 05:12 PM
This is really strange, the game will freeze randomly, often within the first 3 levels, on the MD1, both on 50 and 60HZ, with and without japanese languange setting.

However, I also own european MD2 (not modded), and on this it seems to work, I have played 4 levels and nothing happened, and also work on 32X

Exactly the same happens to me. :-(

Raja
09-08-2015, 09:07 PM
Update on mine:

Game came assembled sort of backwards, meaning the insert was upside down so the hang tab was technically on the bottom (it was amusing) - but the game is flawless I played through it a few times and LOVE it. The game kicks ass. The quality is average - I'd say its better than Oh Mummy! for sure but not much. I'd prefer a higher quality box. Manual is exceptional - easily the highest quality part and I am happy about that. The cart isn't too bad either to be honest but isn't as sturdy as I'd like in build. All in all I'd say its worth the money if you are on the fence about getting it.

babulya
09-11-2015, 07:24 PM
https://youtu.be/NlikqwM55DU
Passage on the Grunt difficulties

pikointeractive
09-11-2015, 09:54 PM
https://youtu.be/NlikqwM55DU
Passage on the Grunt difficulties

It took them 3 weeks to dump the rom eh?

SEGA-Jorge
09-12-2015, 12:41 AM
That's rough. I was hoping this wouldn't be an issue. Sorry Piko Interactive. I'm going to have to buy this game. We need to support this stuff.

netpredakonn
09-12-2015, 10:53 AM
It took them 3 weeks to dump the rom eh?

Did they really dump it? At least, it doesn't seem like they made it public yet. Well, I've got my own copy to play. Just curious as to which protection is in place to dump this. Not that I'm planning, I don't want to and don't have the technical knowledge

pikointeractive
09-12-2015, 11:04 AM
Did they really dump it? At least, it doesn't seem like they made it public yet. Well, I've got my own copy to play. Just curious as to which protection is in place to dump this. Not that I'm planning, I don't want to and don't have the technical knowledge

He did dump it, or may be a friend.

http://www.emu-land.net/forum/index.php/topic,73855.msg1158617.html#msg1158617

the dumper is now banned from buying on our store. The only order from Belarus.

There is not protection. I didn't think people would be bad enough to pirate an indie project. We've had some good sales but we are way in red numbers still.

If people keep dumping and distributing our games, we won't have sales. If we don't make our start up investment, prices would be kept high; and we would not do more projects anymore.

It is a bit disappointing, but oh well.

Winterwolfen
09-12-2015, 05:22 PM
is there a chance you'll relese Brave Battle Saga- Legend Of The Magic Warrior this year?

babulya
09-12-2015, 10:27 PM
is there a chance you'll relese Brave Battle Saga- Legend Of The Magic Warrior this year?
With a new translation?

Rustybolts
09-13-2015, 05:30 AM
WM looks quite pretty but it doesn't look as if there is much variety to the moves offered to the player. I have been tempted to buy myself a copy but $70.99 to ship a boxed copy to the UK is the wrong side of expensive, converting to about Ģ46 on google. I would love to buy it to show support for producing new titles for our ageing tech, unfortunately there are other titles In this price range I desire more. So it will probably be awhile before I can give any.

Barone
09-13-2015, 11:30 AM
WM looks quite pretty but it doesn't look as if there is much variety to the moves offered to the player.
In terms of graphics it does have some beautiful tricks and the characters sprites are very well drawn IMO.

You don't have a lot of moves but you have all the necessary ones with running (something SOR2 lacks, for an example): Jump Attack, Running Attack, Regular Attack, Strong Attack (consumes energy) and Special Attacks (consumes spells and each one has its proper cool animation).
Also, the crowd control is very important in this game. I find the AI significantly better than on Golden Axe or Final Fight CD in terms of moving around you and trying to get your back all the time, for an example; so you do have good stuff in terms of gameplay too.

I also like that you can slice the items you find.

Each character has different strengths which do affect your gameplay.

You have some HUGE enemies too, which is quite cool. And you're not limited to only 3 on screen like on most of SNES beat'em ups or later 16-bit era generic stuff.

While I also find it a bit pricey, the shipment has been real quick for what the other members reported and that's a huge plus IMO. SFT and WM have taken ages to deliver their products after payment.
And some other obscure MD Beat'em Ups are quite pricey too: the JP version of Mystical Fighter goes for $70-80+ IIRC, probably more for Bare Knuckle III, etc.
Water Margin has several flaws but it's way better than Mystical Fighter IMO.

SEGA-Jorge
09-13-2015, 01:27 PM
Mystical Fighter is kinda trashy though, so it's not saying much. Still, I want to get this while I can.

pikointeractive
09-13-2015, 01:37 PM
Quick replies:

As far as BBS we do plan to release it but I don't think it needs a whole new translation only other than a couple of lines re-scripted. Don't know if it will be ready this year, I hope so.

Pricing and cases:

I am going to receive a new case that will have a (hopefully) stronger/heavier film, I think that is the aspect of the cases that make them look the way they look.

Pricing of the games will change in the future. Right now the products are priced the were they are (which is competitive compared to other releases) so we can make back the over all investment we have done (mostly buying copyrights of games, and licenses) once that is covered there would be a 15-20% or may be more drop on new releases.

Hopefully we can do that by Summer 2017-18.

:D

netpredakonn
09-14-2015, 09:50 AM
He did dump it, or may be a friend.

http://www.emu-land.net/forum/index.php/topic,73855.msg1158617.html#msg1158617

the dumper is now banned from buying on our store. The only order from Belarus.

There is not protection. I didn't think people would be bad enough to pirate an indie project. We've had some good sales but we are way in red numbers still.

If people keep dumping and distributing our games, we won't have sales. If we don't make our start up investment, prices would be kept high; and we would not do more projects anymore.

It is a bit disappointing, but oh well.

I think you needn't worry about this, man. People who support your work will buy it anyway, as I did. Heck, you might even get more sales as people discover the game. Even if there are shortcomings here and there, I can see that you're working hard to be nice to your customers and this really counts in this day and age. Really hope you get the sales you need for this.

Kamahl
09-14-2015, 11:05 AM
Your main market are collectors, they will buy your game regardless of any dumps that may be available. The people who want to play this on emulators wouldn't give you any money, they'd just play the untranslated game.

The only intersection (a small one) are people that enjoy playing on real hardware but don't like having too many boxes around, so they use the mega everdrive or such. You might have lost a few sales from those, but hopefully not much.

If you sell the ROM on steam and such you'll still make some money, even after the dump, from the people that explicitly want it in their "digital" collection. I mean, you must have made at least some money from Jim Power for DOS, and that game has been dumped for ages now.

Speaking of which, can we get a date for that one (Genesis/NES) :p ? I'm not gonna buy it for real hardware but I might just give you the money on steam or preferably GoG (more so if I can then extract the ROM and use it in my emulator of choice).

pikointeractive
09-14-2015, 03:49 PM
Steam release for Jim power has been submitted for review to be SEP 31, but at the moment it will only include DOS, original SNES, and a Re-worked SNES version that has (IMO) polished from the horrible original version.

Then I hope to add FREE as an update mutant planet for Amiga, and then Genesis Version (which we probably add once we hit a minimum carts sold) and then DLC will be added which is the NES and the Chris Huelsbeck album within 6 months.

Physical versions I hope they are ready for Christmas.

Honestly I want to make everyone our market, not only the collector. Hopefully we can change the direction and tradition on how these old games get released and we can have some sort of distribution network with retailers.

If all goes well this year and the next, you will be able to find our games in chain stores. It all depends on how soon we make our initial investment back, which we are about 35% recouped. As I mentioned, once all that is recouped we will change a lot of things and hopefully set the bar high for cart game releases, without mentioned that I am sure we would be able to offer better deals to developers making larger companies consider licensing their unreleased/JP games; killing little by little the repro market.

Daria
09-15-2015, 04:04 AM
I've been playing the game and there's some things graphically that could use some tweaks as well. Specifically:

The paralax scrolling background inside the moon temple is improperly tiled.
And any chance of editing the party sprites to match their battle-sprites in terms of color? Maybe giving Cherie wings?

Quoting myself because I noticed Piko never answered my old ass question. But I'm still curious since you mentioned Brave Battle Saga.

Kamahl
09-15-2015, 08:46 AM
Honestly I want to make everyone our market, not only the collector. Hopefully we can change the direction and tradition on how these old games get released and we can have some sort of distribution network with retailers.

If all goes well this year and the next, you will be able to find our games in chain stores. It all depends on how soon we make our initial investment back, which we are about 35% recouped. As I mentioned, once all that is recouped we will change a lot of things and hopefully set the bar high for cart game releases, without mentioned that I am sure we would be able to offer better deals to developers making larger companies consider licensing their unreleased/JP games; killing little by little the repro market.
I admire your optimism and sincerely hope you succeed.

pikointeractive
09-15-2015, 11:38 AM
Quoting myself because I noticed Piko never answered my old ass question. But I'm still curious since you mentioned Brave Battle Saga.

Totally missed it and I apologize, totally feasible. Will look into it.

Azathoth
09-16-2015, 09:48 AM
If all goes well this year killing little by little the repro market.

Ouch, harsh words.

pikointeractive
09-16-2015, 10:19 AM
Ouch, harsh words.

Well is not as killing them much but making those games officially which over all benefits the developers and the consumers. As an official products accrues more value over time, vs a repro that doesn't

Daria
09-18-2015, 12:59 PM
Totally missed it and I apologize, totally feasible. Will look into it.

Thanks (:

DSwizzy145
09-18-2015, 07:47 PM
@pikointeractive Hi, is there a chance you could do Korean or Chinese MS-DOS exclusive games soon? Translated to English of course :P if not then i'd understand.

pikointeractive
09-19-2015, 04:01 PM
Do you know any developeRs and if they are still reachable? It would be cool.

pikointeractive
09-19-2015, 07:14 PM
10702

What do you guys prefer more? Gold or Black? I like the Gold more.

I know the shell is a bit scuffed on the pic. It is mainly for using a larger drill tip. But once we start drilling the carts together it would be a more polished job.

This is more for screw color purposes.

Kamahl
09-19-2015, 08:20 PM
Attachment is broken piko. Attachments don't work very well on this site.

pikointeractive
09-19-2015, 09:48 PM
Attachment is broken piko. Attachments don't work very well on this site.

I've uploaded to our site:

https://pikointeractive.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2015/09/image1-2.jpg

SEGA.GENESIS1989
09-20-2015, 02:03 AM
I like the black screws better. But hey we`re only talking about cartridge screws. Not art deco! :p

synapse
09-20-2015, 07:50 AM
Black screws, please.

Zebbe
09-20-2015, 08:21 AM
Black ones look better (and more like original Mega Drive games).

pikointeractive
09-20-2015, 01:45 PM
Black ones it is.

Will post some news/details about Water Margin soon.

DSwizzy145
09-21-2015, 07:34 PM
Do you know any developeRs and if they are still reachable? It would be cool.

um, well... they're actually are sorta abandonware though the company that made Flame Dragon Knights are very currently active and their android release of the game came out for free! https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.hwg.flamedragon :-) so maybe perhaps you can try contacting Soft-World International Corporation for a localisation if possible.

P.S Do you speak &/or read chinese?

pikointeractive
09-21-2015, 08:20 PM
um, well... they're actually are sorta abandonware though the company that made Flame Dragon Knights are very currently active and their android release of the game came out for free! https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.hwg.flamedragon :-) so maybe perhaps you can try contacting Soft-World International Corporation for a localisation if possible.

P.S Do you speak &/or read chinese?

No I don't but the guy that does our translations is good.

DSwizzy145
09-21-2015, 09:18 PM
No I don't but the guy that does our translations is good.

oh cool! btw, do you only localise games on consoles or both (including PC)? just curious because there's tons of awesome chinese/taiwanese computer games released exclusive there more than what are available on their Sega Mega Drive in that country honestly.

Also, if you plan on localising more Mega Drive games later down the road you don't mind checking out Surging Aura, Star Cruiser & Ninja Burai Densetsu

pikointeractive
09-22-2015, 01:16 AM
oh cool! btw, do you only localise games on consoles or both (including PC)? just curious because there's tons of awesome chinese/taiwanese computer games released exclusive there more than what are available on their Sega Mega Drive in that country honestly.

Also, if you plan on localising more Mega Drive games later down the road you don't mind checking out Surging Aura, Star Cruiser & Ninja Burai Densetsu

One project at a time :D

DSwizzy145
09-22-2015, 08:15 AM
One project at a time :D

My fault lol i didn't actually mean it like that, just giving out a few suggestions for later on sorry if i came off the wrong way.

streetsofrage
09-23-2015, 07:47 AM
Asking for ROMS is not allowed on the forums, especially in a thread discussing a product where the seller is active participating.

- Melf

pikointeractive
09-29-2015, 12:10 AM
A couple of updates.

We will be using a bran new Genesis case which will be almost 1:1 quality to original Genesis ones for Duke Nukem 3D.

Also, we will be applying screws to the shells (will make shipping times to be a bit longer).

For those who ordered Water Margin, you will have the opportunity to claim a FREE Genesis case (the new model) and FREE screws (along with directions on how to make holes to your shell and apply screws) with your next purchase on the store.

Just whenever you make your next purchase, send us your Water Margin original order information and we will send along the Case and Screws on the new order.

Duke Nuke should be released in a couple of weeks, just waiting on the cases :D

Cheers!

SEGA.GENESIS1989
09-29-2015, 12:23 AM
A couple of updates.

We will be using a bran new Genesis case which will be almost 1:1 quality to original Genesis ones for Duke Nukem 3D.

Also, we will be applying screws to the shells (will make shipping times to be a bit longer).

For those who ordered Water Margin, you will have the opportunity to claim a FREE Genesis case (the new model) and FREE screws (along with directions on how to make holes to your shell and apply screws) with your next purchase on the store.

Just whenever you make your next purchase, send us your Water Margin original order information and we will send along the Case and Screws on the new order.

Duke Nuke should be released in a couple of weeks, just waiting on the cases :D

Cheers!

That's what I call great customer service! Thanks for offering the Free Genesis case to those users who purchased the original release of the game!
You rock dude!

Daria
09-29-2015, 01:18 AM
10702

What do you guys prefer more? Gold or Black? I like the Gold more.

I know the shell is a bit scuffed on the pic. It is mainly for using a larger drill tip. But once we start drilling the carts together it would be a more polished job.

This is more for screw color purposes.

Black.

RedAngel
09-29-2015, 05:19 AM
We will be using a bran new Genesis case which will be almost 1:1 quality to original Genesis ones for Duke Nukem 3D.
Do you plan to improve Duke Nukem 3D? I mean having a look at the diificulty, music, sample quality, colors and perhaps even the engine. A mode 1 hack would be great for example...

pikointeractive
09-29-2015, 11:46 AM
Do you plan to improve Duke Nukem 3D? I mean having a look at the diificulty, music, sample quality, colors and perhaps even the engine. A mode 1 hack would be great for example...

No, the game is just an official re-release in the US and UK. We are working in other projects.

Arjak
09-30-2015, 07:49 PM
Question: Are there plans for a version of Water Margin with the new cases and carts, and a proofread manual? I'm interested in buying a copy of the game, but am hoping for one that has all the problems people have mentioned fixed. I don't want to buy the game only to find out that an improved version is on the way.

zredgemz
09-30-2015, 09:14 PM
Question: Are there plans for a version of Water Margin with the new cases and carts, and a proofread manual? I'm interested in buying a copy of the game, but am hoping for one that has all the problems people have mentioned fixed. I don't want to buy the game only to find out that an improved version is on the way.
i feel the same.

pikointeractive
09-30-2015, 10:10 PM
i feel the same.

The only changes that WM will have for a looong time is the cases and screws.

xelement5x
10-01-2015, 05:29 PM
The only changes that WM will have for a looong time is the cases and screws.

I'm basically guessing the cost to reprint the manual is rather high then and you probably have a huge quantity of them already at this point.

Kind of a shame, but I guess when you do the second print run you will already have "variants" so many people might double-dip unless you're willing to sell updated manuals on the side too :P

pikointeractive
10-01-2015, 07:03 PM
I'm basically guessing the cost to reprint the manual is rather high then and you probably have a huge quantity of them already at this point.

Kind of a shame, but I guess when you do the second print run you will already have "variants" so many people might double-dip unless you're willing to sell updated manuals on the side too :P

Yeah, Have a bunch in stock. Unless we get a large wholesale order that knocks all of our current stock off, we wouldn't be doing another print run until well... it sells out.

The current rate of sales and it being dumped and distributed already tells me it will take a long time to do so.

zredgemz
10-01-2015, 08:19 PM
Just let us know when you set them up with new cases, ill be all in for that and duke 3d.

WaverBoy
10-03-2015, 05:29 AM
Two questions:

1. The name of this edition of the game is Water Margin: A Tale Of Clouds And Wind. Why is it misidentified as Water Margin: The Tales Of Clouds And Winds at not only the top of this thread but also in the product listing at Piko's website? Just curious. :-)

2. What specifically was changed for this release besides the text being translated? All I've seen so far in this thread is mention of some of the music changed/missing, but not really specified as to which part of the game, and some voice effects that had been ripped from Streets Of Rage that were replaced with different voice effects. Mention is also made on Piko's website of bug fixes and game play fixes. I would like to know what these are. I have the original version of the game, absolutely love it as it is, and would like to know if it might be worth my while picking up Piko's version.

WaverBoy
12-04-2015, 03:54 PM
What, no answers?

pikointeractive
12-04-2015, 05:56 PM
What, no answers?

Wups, sorry.

I think the bug fixes were very minor cant really recalled because I was not directly involved. The sound effects, music replaced and translation was the main re-work.

Barone
12-13-2015, 11:54 PM
I played through this game at a friend's house the other day and I can say that it's really good IMO.

From the easiest difficulty level to the hardest one there's some really good AI progression IMO. I like how the enemies try to go around you very often.
IDK but IMO it has far better AI than games like Golden Axe and in 2P it really shines.

xelement5x
12-14-2015, 01:58 PM
I played through this game at a friend's house the other day and I can say that it's really good IMO.

From the easiest difficulty level to the hardest one there's some really good AI progression IMO. I like how the enemies try to go around you very often.
IDK but IMO it has far better AI than games like Golden Axe and in 2P it really shines.

Nice! I keep inching closer and closer to getting a copy. Hopefully after the new year I will have some cash.