PS2 vs Dreamcast Graphics

[Yharnamresident]

this is a feature that died with DC. The games that use this are MSR, Sonic 1 and 2, Soul calibur on PS2 I only remember Tekken Tag

Yes I still remember Sonic Team going to South America to take pictures of the terrain.

[SegaAMD]

I think the Sega GT is a better comparison with the Ridge Racer 5, both were launched in the same period.

txr 1 and 2 both are lower than RRV I have no doubts, the 2 improved some things and moved back in other TXR 1 has better graphics in general.

Maybe Sega GT looks better if this is true so Dreamcast was showing better graphics than the PS2 in the period.

[Yharnamresident]

I think the Sega GT is a better comparison with the Ridge Racer 5, both were launched in the same period.

txr 1 and 2 both are lower than RRV I have no doubts, the 2 improved some things and moved back in other TXR 1 has better graphics in general.

Maybe Sega GT looks better if this is true so Dreamcast was showing better graphics than the PS2 in the period.

Sega GT came out 5 months after, I think the game is a dumpster fire, it was made by a Sega team that knew nothing about racing games.

[Yharnamresident]

I will do a comparison of NullDC and Makaron. Makaron is an emulator made in Poland and it doesn't use 1 line of NullDC code. Its harder to use than NullDC but some games have better compatibility.

Cloofoofoo posts a lot of good stuff, but he has this trait where he'll suddenly get super agitated out of nowhere and its not very pleasant. So its kinda good he isn't here to see this.



Evolution in Makaron:




First battle scene. 700,000 PPS



Mag is 3600 polygons.




In town. 1.6 million PPS

Evolution in NullDC:




First battle scene. 1 million PPS



Mag is 5700 polygons.




In town. 2.4 million PPS


Well I guess that solves it. NullDC gives too many polygons. But why don't we look at another game?

Super Magnetic Neo in Makaron:




Start of first course. 900,000 PPS



Player character is 1200 polygons.

Super Magnetic Neo in NullDC:




Start of first course. 700,000 PPS



Player character is 1700 polygons.


Both seem very realistic, however isn't 1200 polygons pretty low for a player character? Cloofoofoo was constantly saying "this character has too many polygons, this car has too many polygons" yes but you should be able to identify what the culprit is. When I showed him that PCSX2 was giving too many polygons, I could easily show him the culprit which was it was giving duplicate polygons and in very rare instances there would be junk polygons. You can't just say "this character has too many polygons" and not identify why that is the case.

And of course even though the box art for Evolution says the game runs at 60 FPS, since we gotta automatically believe what the emulator tells us then that means the game runs at 30 FPS:




I will post another thing. Sega Worldwide Soccer 2000 has character polygon numbers listed on IGN:

https://www.ign.com/articles/1999/11...de-soccer-2000

Graphically, Worldwide Soccer 2000 is promising to provide the most realistic football game to date, as no less than 2,500 polygons will be used for each individual player!

Match start. 1.7 million PPS



player is 1100 polygons. Yes thats right, NullDC gives so many polygons it can't even match what the IGN article stated!!! In all honestly you could easily tell these players aren't 2500 polygons, no where enough detail.




In match. 1.05 million PPS



Player is 1200 polygons.


Honestly I'm so sick of dealing with this BS. I will go back to discussing topics that are fun to discuss. Should we Look at Mortal Kombat 5?

[Team Andromeda]

I think the Sega GT is a better comparison with the Ridge Racer 5

SEGA GT was SEGA's shock moment. The company that was once the king of racers and where the game was going to be when SEGA got it driving crown back, it was a crushing letdown and really didn't look that good either had a terrible physics and handling model and the 30 fps was quite pathetic. Thank the maker for Yu 'GOD' Suzuki and F355 which really was and still is the ultimate driving sim (well along with Richards Burns Rally)

Yes I still remember Sonic Team going to South America to take pictures of the terrain.

Amazing to think that was all meant to be in Saturn Sonic Adv with the Team went on that trip in 96 for Project Sonic. Love to see what Sonic Adv actually looked and moved like on the Saturn.

[Yharnamresident]

So I got 2/6 posts done. Its time for 3/6.

Did any of you think I forgot about doing this comparison? Shameful. I remember how excited some of you were at the idea of this.

[SegaAMD]

Sega GT came out 5 months after, I think the game is a dumpster fire, it was made by a Sega team that knew nothing about racing games.

sega gt japan feb 2000
Ridge Racer V march 2000

Sega GT looks good

[Phantar]

So I got 2/6 posts done. Its time for 3/6.

What video output where these Screens made with? I don't remember the Rayman games looking that blurry on PS2; I use component Video, so maybe that's a factor there as well?

That being said, PS2 looks a bit more colorful, but I definitely prefer the sharper contrasts of the DC version in these pictures.

[SegaAMD]

I particularly prefer the graphics of Rayman 2 Revolution, except for the textures of the lawn everything else is better on the PS2, the lighting, the level of details, even some textures of the walls

https://youtu.be/Y3yVgUY-Qnk?t=976


his capture is very consistent with the best cables. at 3:44 the PS2 and Dreamcast version is shown side by side, he made a mistake and changed the names, the ps2 version the character has more poly and shadows, there is no denying that the textures are more vivid in DC, maybe they are in 16 bit and in PS2 in 8 bit, the difference is in the color gamut of each console.

[Team Andromeda]

While I'm not a fan of the Hardware. Silent Hill 3 was stunning and GT 4 was the best looking car game of that generation, the replays were out of this world, Polyphony Digital pushed that system to insane levels.

[SegaAMD]

what I like about Dreamcast is that despite being an older tech it was fully capable of making amazing look games, with good exclusives Dreamcast could end the generation ahead of the xbox and Gamecube in my opinion. atomiswave games show it as Hokuto no Ken, faster than speed

[Leynos]

So I got 2/6 posts done. Its time for 3/6.

Did any of you think I forgot about doing this comparison? Shameful. I remember how excited some of you were at the idea of this.

Bottom one hurts to look at . Just smear vasiline in my eyes. Same effect.

[Virtua Hunter]

The PS2 version seems a N64 game lol.

[Yharnamresident]

What video output where these Screens made with? I don't remember the Rayman games looking that blurry on PS2; I use component Video, so maybe that's a factor there as well?

That being said, PS2 looks a bit more colorful, but I definitely prefer the sharper contrasts of the DC version in these pictures.

Demul and PCSX2. It actually looks better than using Component Video. The reason its blurry is because its low-res 480i, might be something like 512x384. You guys know this was a common problem with early PS2 games, there was essentially no games running at 640x448.

what I like about Dreamcast is that despite being an older tech it was fully capable of making amazing look games, with good exclusives Dreamcast could end the generation ahead of the xbox and Gamecube in my opinion. atomiswave games show it as Hokuto no Ken, faster than speed

Yes during 1999-2001, the Dreamcast was selling at a faster pace than GameCube and OG Xbox.


With the Rayman 2 comparison, I'm not gonna tell you guys what you wanna hear. Its gonna be done in a partly subjective way.

[SegaAMD]

I find these contradictions present on the same hardware very interesting.

this is not about resolution, Half Life on PS2 has less DC resolution, RE4 on GCN same thing less resolution than PS2 but looks better because the textures are better, in essence the textures on the PS2 have high resolution but the colors are 8 bit even 4 bit palletized, on Dreamcast 16 bit compressed without losing quality, even in games with equal resolution there are differences in color depth. that's why the ps2 shows blurry and muddy images for 90% of its games. another reason are the filters that the PS2 uses to try to take out the flicker they blur even more, in true any AA blurs the image and removes sharpness.

but in later games, those that use smooth textures the PS2 version is shapper than GCN and XB as in Tony Hawk underground.