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Thread: Why do people have issues with others not being fans of the SNES?

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    Hero of Algol TrekkiesUnite118's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Blades View Post

    The difference is that evildragon was a bizarre socially retarded idiot and sheath just disagrees with you about video games.
    I think it's safe to say that sheath has the issues here. It's obvious he's been dwelling on his personal issues with myself and Barone for the past 2 years he's been absent from the forum. Otherwise I doubt he would have made one of his first posts after returning an unprovoked shit flinging fest.

    Sheath doesn't just disagree with Barone and myself. He disagree's in the face of facts and will go out of his way to conjure up and grasp at any straws he can find to try and back up his warped view of reality to try and prove actual facts wrong.

    We all debate here and will argue over petty things. I've even made an ass of myself quite a few times. The difference however is that when faced with overwhelming factual evidence I will admit I was wrong and move on. The same is true for Barone, stu, and just about any other rational person on this forum. sheath instead chooses to see the facts that don't align with his preconceived bias as personal slights against him and decides to wage a personal war against them.

    Quote Originally Posted by gamevet View Post
    I guess you're not a fan of Street Fighter Alpha 2 then.
    I'm fine with Street Fighter Alpha 2 because the instrument choice is well done, just like the CPS-2 renditions of Street Fighter 2's music. Though I personally prefer the Saturn renditions of Alpha 2's music. The SNES version of Street Fighter 2 Turbo just uses really bad sample choices in my opinion. Same is true for Alpha 2 on the SNES.

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    End of line.. Hero of Algol gamevet's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TrekkiesUnite118 View Post



    I'm fine with Street Fighter Alpha 2 because the instrument choice is well done, just like the CPS-2 renditions of Street Fighter 2's music. Though I personally prefer the Saturn renditions of Alpha 2's music. The SNES version of Street Fighter 2 Turbo just uses really bad sample choices in my opinion. Same is true for Alpha 2 on the SNES.
    Yeah, Alpha 2 and Super Street Fighter sound like ass on the SNES, because of the limitations of the cartridge. The Saturn version is absolutely great.
    A Black Falcon: no, computer games and video games are NOT the same thing. Video games are on consoles, computer games are on PC. The two kinds of games are different, and have significantly different design styles, distribution methods, and game genre selections. Computer gaming and console (video) gaming are NOT the same thing."



  3. #123
    I remain nonsequitur Shining Hero sheath's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Jackal View Post
    Barone have you ever thought that guy (LastBronx) might of been someone else who didn't like you, and maybe, just maybe wasn't an alt of Sheath's like you claim?

    I see nothing else to connect the two.
    The sad truth is Barone and I were friends and all of this is the worst kind of bullshit.
    "... If Sony reduced the price of the Playstation, Sega would have to follow suit in order to stay competitive, but Saturn's high manufacturing cost would then translate into huge losses for the company." p170 Revolutionaries at Sony.

    "We ... put Sega out of the hardware business ..." Peter Dille senior vice president of marketing at Sony Computer Entertainment

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    Quote Originally Posted by gamevet View Post
    I guess you're not a fan of Street Fighter Alpha 2 then.
    Alpha 2 and Street Fighter 2 Champion Edition are pretty much the only two I care about. Do you not hear the off key instruments in SNES games though? It has been long enough that I was wondering if I just thought the "right" key was just one version.
    "... If Sony reduced the price of the Playstation, Sega would have to follow suit in order to stay competitive, but Saturn's high manufacturing cost would then translate into huge losses for the company." p170 Revolutionaries at Sony.

    "We ... put Sega out of the hardware business ..." Peter Dille senior vice president of marketing at Sony Computer Entertainment

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    ESWAT Veteran Team Andromeda's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Thief View Post
    Would a snapshot of ZSNES sound settings do?
    I thought we proved it was Capcom's fault with those new Driver patches by Stephane for Genesis SS2 & SSF2?
    No its a Hardware issue as the Mega Drive only as one sample channel for playback . It's not just Street Fighter II that suffers any game that uses multi Samples at the same time suffers from it. But in most cases the speech for one character or sound effect is cut out - SF II doesn't do that and so suffers.
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    Quote Originally Posted by sull56ivan2010 View Post
    Here are my thoughts on the games I have, beginning with third party.

    Addams Family Values: Looks decent, but got lost early and had no clue what to do, so I gave up
    Adventures of Rocky and Bullwinkle: Meh game that is very difficult for the wrong reasons. Got pretty far, though.
    Animaniacs: Not too great of a game. Genesis version is much better.
    Batman Forever: Mortal Kombat type of game but a side-scroller. Pretty awful.
    Batman Returns: Pretty fun, but no two player. Clean and bright look (excellent, though) compared to the film.
    Battletoads/Double Dragon: Seems decent enough compared to most beat-em-ups.
    Beavis and Butt-head: Forgettable side-scroller. Get the Genesis version.
    Chuck Rock: Decent platformer with good music. Almost Flintstones like.
    Contra III: Haven't played enough, but seems very difficult.
    David Crane's Amazing Tennis: Not amazing.
    The Death and Return of Superman. Decent from what I've played. Seems competent.
    Doom: Very faithful port despite some cut levels. Enjoyable.
    Earthworm Jim: Very fun action game but very difficult.
    Final Fantasy Mystic Quest: Haven't played enough to form an opinion
    Final Fight: Decent game, but lack of two player hurts it.
    Final Fight 2: Feels improved in every facet. A better game.
    Frank Thomas Big Hurt Baseball: Okay game.
    Frogger: Decent, but could be a generic Windows 95 game
    Home Alone 2: Not as bad as people make it out to be. Not bad, but not great either.
    Izzy's Quest for the Olympic Rings: Far from mediocre, but questionable hit detection when attacking enemies.
    John Madden Football: I like sports games, but this is choppy.
    The Jungle Book: Forgettable game. Genesis version is better.
    Lemmings: Fun in short bursts.
    The Lion King: Controls not as crisp but very good.
    Madden 93: Plays better, but still a little work needed.
    Madden 95, 97: Play a lot smoother and better. Good attempts at football.
    Mega Man Soccer: Have not played enough to form an opinion.
    Mega Man X: Good, but challenging game with cool powers and weapons
    Mighty Morphin Power Rangers: Fun action game. Want to get the Fighting Edition game.
    Mortal Kombat: Decent and playable, but no blood.
    Mortal Kombat II: Delivers on every front.
    Mortal Kombat 3: Okay game. Not as polished as the first two
    NBA Jam: Best of the series.
    NBA Live 96: Plays just as well as the Genesis version.

    Next set of games in the next post I'll make.
    Quote Originally Posted by sull56ivan2010 View Post
    Third party games, Part II

    NHL 94: Not as smooth, but very playable
    NHL 96, 98: Fun attempts at hockey.
    NHLPA Hockey 93: Choppy game, but playable. No blood, but not a deal breaker.
    Populous: Can't say much on it.
    Porky Pig's Haunted Holiday: Pretty decent considering most Looney Tunes games.
    Prince of Persia: Altered game, but still good.
    Radical Psycho Machine Racing: Okay game that is tough to control.
    Rocko's Modern Life: Seems decent enough.
    R-Type III Competent shooter.
    The Simpsons: Bart's Nightmare: Enjoyable set of mini-games.
    Sonic Blastman II: Fun beat-em-up similar to Final Fight and Streets of Rage 2.
    Speedy Gonzales in Los Gatos Banditos: Decent Sonic the Hedgehog clone.
    Spider-Man X-Men: Arcade's Revenge: Fun in certain sections, but way too difficult.
    Street Fighter II: Good fighting game.
    Super Buster Bros.: Great arcade fun.
    Super Castlevania: Great action and danger at every corner.
    Super High Impact: Okay game. Never been a fan of Midway's football games.
    Taz-Mania: Repetitive, but stupid fun. Not much you can do with Taz.
    Tecmo Super Baseball: Not bad, but fielding perspective is not great.
    Tecmo Super Bowl III: Expanded game that doesn't lose its arcade roots.
    Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles IV; Fun, but very overrated port.
    Tiny Toon Adventures: Buster Busts Loose: Great platformer
    Tiny Toon Adventures: Wacky Sports Challenge: Good, but punishing game
    WWF Super Wrestlemania: Okay game. I hear the sequels are better.
    Zero the Kamikaze Squirrel: Decent game with some nifty moves
    Man, you owned a ton of shitty or seemingly, shitty, shitty & mediocre games. Should of read some gaming magazines & made some rental to make at least some informed buying decisions, lol. (no offense either). As I only owned like one shitty or mediocre game and that's because my mom bought it for me (it was Sports Talk Football 92 or something).

    - Earthworm Jim a difficult game? Maybe I just played it too much or something, but I don't recall it ever as that difficult?

    - Final Fight 2 better then 1? Wrong. Despite being single player and a weaker port, FF1 definitely is still the best FF on SNES. FF2 is also way too easy (but FF3 is easier still). So if you like easy play and forget games, sure. Otherwise I would of felt ripped off if I owned FF2 instead of 1 back in the day. FF2 is just a weak remake of FF1 with 2 players and everything else being, well, weaker (down to the setting/enemy re-skins that lost that really cool 80s atmosphere vibe). Also, those jumping/tossing knife guys from FF1 have been greatly weakened; aka; we're the biggest pain in FF1, now a joke in FF2 with a missing move set or something? Think he got split between two enemies + the knife throw is missing? But basically the careful enemy design chemistry is gone.

    - Jungle Book I rented both version back in the day. First the SNES version and only version I was able to beat back then (which is strange because in a recent replay of these games, I have zero idea why I was stuck at King Loui in Genesis version). Not sure how much that contributed for me preferring SNES version back then. But my new opinion is that I prefer the Genesis version, despite being easier too. I also prefer Genesis graphics and music... did you ever beat the SNES version? Doesn't seem that forgettable to me... maybe I need to play it more to know for certain...

    - Lion King I didn't enjoy the movie much (Aladdin was last Disney movie I really enjoyed). So my opinion on the game wasn't that high & worth owning from the get go. But I did rent and beat both versions of the Lion King. And not sure how much enjoying original Jungle Book movie affects this, but if I couldn't only own one, it would be Genesis Jungle Book. Either way, Genesis version is the one Lion King version to own. Gameplay reason included. Heck. All Disney/Virgin/Westwood games are superior on Genesis anyway. Anybody says otherwise in an objective manner is automatically labeled blind SNES fanboy by me.

    - The hardest thing in MMX is that last boss battle. Way harder the the rest of the game hard... yeah, that's right. I never beat it. Just a ton of failed attempts. I'm not worthy, yada, yada.

    - MK1 for Genesis is very nostalgic & preferred version for me (seeing it at a friends house for first is what got me into the MK craze in the first place). MK2 for SNES (my only pre-ordered game) was my preferred version over Genesis. But for MK3 they really messed up the SNES version. Genesis by a wide margin over SNES and obviously my to go version for MK3 fix. Therefore SNES fanboys saying SNES MK3 is again better over Genesis really pisses me off more so then any other game this being said for. I really was disappointed with assuming and trusting he SNES version to be better again by buying the SNES version of MK3. Especially when I rented Genesis version and it was superior to my surprise (this was like one of the final straws that turned me into a Genesis fanboy over SNES). Lucky, I right away bought the Genesis version soon right after. So scratch that. I owned two shitty games back in the 90s (so Sports Talk Football & SNES MK3). But at least I had a lot of fun comparing the heck out of these two versions (I owned and compared the heck out of all SNES/Genesis MK games).

    - owned SNES NBA Jam first. Had a password list that went over a 100 games (still have the passwords somewhere stored with the game). So I basically played this game enough that I don't care about it or this series anymore. As I result I think this game is overrated. I only might fire a game from this series like for one game curiosity or nostalgia and that's it.

    - I'd say R-Type 3 is more then a competent shooter. Definitely one of the best in it's genre for SNES.

    - Played Sonic Blastman 2 recently and made much more progress this time. And my stance switched from pretty decent beat'em up to mediocre or shit beat'em up.

    - Bought Super Castlevania IV late, as it was during the 32-Bit era thanks to EGM buyers guide ranking it so high in their top 10 list. Only played and beat it once back in those day... I'm a much bigger Castlevania fan now. My only regret not having bought it when it was new. As the graphics impressing the heck out of everyone at first had no impact on me during laet SNES/32-Bit era. That, and I now I have a thing for first gen or two games.

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    I say lets drop this Sheath debate for now and move on. ... Anyway, moving on...

    Quote Originally Posted by Team Andromeda View Post
    No its a Hardware issue as the Mega Drive only as one sample channel for playback . It's not just Street Fighter II that suffers any game that uses multi Samples at the same time suffers from it. But in most cases the speech for one character or sound effect is cut out - SF II doesn't do that and so suffers.
    Isn't the more sample focused SNES sound chip setup more of a negative since it's way too costly on cart space? A couple of SNES ports having lots of cuts compared to Genesis versions do come to mind (though I would like a more thorough comparison on cart space efficiency between both systems that include other areas)... but think about other SNES exclusive games that could of had extra content too.


    Also what this guy said here about SNES/Genesis music;
    Quote Originally Posted by zetastrike View Post
    Is there a list anywhere of the top selling SNES games in NA/Europe that's accurate?

    I had a SNES growing up and played the Genesis occasionally at friends' houses. I used to love everything about it. Games like Mario Allstars, DKC, Gradius 3, Starfox, Yoshi, Power Rangers, F-Zero, Ninja Warriors used to be my favorites but since really delving into the Genesis and to a lesser extent the NES/FC, it just doesn't hold up. The games that I used to love just don't hold my attention, the music that used to sound so good to me now sounds hollow and bland, and I know that there are equivalents on the MD/FC that are more fun to me. Once I went MD/MCD I never went back.
    I'm also finding rings more and more true to me too. As I really only listen to videogame music anymore, and am just discovering what zetastike said here for myself too. Seems like the only SNES playlist I can put up with outside of gaming is select tracks from Donkey Kong Country 1 and 2. Everything else sound too hollow and bland or gets boring too fast outside of a gaming environment.
    Last edited by Thief; 09-11-2016 at 09:29 AM.

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    ESWAT Veteran Team Andromeda's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Thief View Post
    Isn't the more sample focused SNES sound chip setup more of a negative since it's way too costly on cart space? A couple of SNES ports having lots of cuts compared to SNES version do come to mind (though I would like a more thorough comparison on cart space efficiency between both systems that include other areas)... but think about other SNES exclusive games that could of had extra content too.
    My only issue with the Snes sound chip is a lot of games tended to sound very similar when it came to sound effects . The Mega Drive had a hardware issues with one Sample channel and so that mean that even in a game like Greatest Heavyweights which was a Huge game with great sound, it was impossible for both players to taunt each other at the same time due to the Mega Drive single sample Hardware channel .

    Also when it came to music I think the Snes was better due to it being better able to emu real instruments that bit better . Both sound chips have their plus and minus points
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    Quote Originally Posted by Team Andromeda View Post
    Also when it came to music I think the Snes was better due to it being better able to emu real instruments that bit better . Both sound chips have their plus and minus points
    Surprised to hear this point. We're at a point where it's a all real instruments or really well emulated. Personally, I miss the more unique one of a kind videogame sounds and music off unique console sound chips and the creativity they've inspired. Even Yuzo Koshiro misses making music like this. Seems like everything is created in a studio and streamed off the CD these days.

  10. #130
    Mega Driven Raging in the Streets cleeg's Avatar
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    I've come to think that if the two consoles' strengths could be combined we'd have the ultimate 16 bit box. If the SNES could make games run as fast as the MD while still looking as pretty as they do (transparencies in particular enhance things I reckon) you'd have had some really great looking titles.

    Every SNES game I have played (not that many, admittedly) has sounded nice, but muffled sometimes; but it has to be admitted that it does, in general, create better sounding music than the MD in terms of all round realism. Most instruments sound more real.

    That is not to say it is intrinsically better than how the MD sounds, which generates music quite differently and personal opinion counts for a lot when comparing multiplats (MK springs to mind, SNES is more faithful to the arcade, but the MD sounds really really ace. This thread is good... http://www.sega-16.com/forum/showthr...ack-ever/page2). I think that SFII games illustrate this the best; it really does sound better on SNES, even though the MD version sounds fairly good.

    Imagine a machine that sounded as clear as a lot of MD games but sampled as nicely (most of the time) as the SNES.

    I may actually have just described the PlayStation, making all of this a pointless read!

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    Hero of Algol Kamahl's Avatar
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    One of the best SNES songs, the same song covered by currently the best (IMO) YM2612 composer (Hi Gecko!).
    A lot closer than you'd think.

  12. #132
    End of line.. Hero of Algol gamevet's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sheath View Post
    Alpha 2 and Street Fighter 2 Champion Edition are pretty much the only two I care about. Do you not hear the off key instruments in SNES games though? It has been long enough that I was wondering if I just thought the "right" key was just one version.
    Now and then I do, but it's not like some of that is getting drowned out by all of the noise being made by the fighters in SFII. It's not like I don't also hear it in the arcade game and on the Genesis. It's like the pot calling the kettle black, if you ask me.

    Let me ask you this. How can you not notice the broken rhythm in the arcade and Genesis versions of Street Fighter II?
    Last edited by gamevet; 09-11-2016 at 10:59 AM.
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  13. #133
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    Quote Originally Posted by cleeg View Post
    I've come to think that if the two consoles' strengths could be combined we'd have the ultimate 16 bit box. If the SNES could make games run as fast as the MD while still looking as pretty as they do (transparencies in particular enhance things I reckon) you'd have had some really great looking titles.

    Every SNES game I have played (not that many, admittedly) has sounded nice, but muffled sometimes; but it has to be admitted that it does, in general, create better sounding music than the MD in terms of all round realism. Most instruments sound more real.

    That is not to say it is intrinsically better than how the MD sounds, which generates music quite differently and personal opinion counts for a lot when comparing multiplats (MK springs to mind, SNES is more faithful to the arcade, but the MD sounds really really ace. This thread is good... http://www.sega-16.com/forum/showthr...ack-ever/page2). I think that SFII games illustrate this the best; it really does sound better on SNES, even though the MD version sounds fairly good.

    Imagine a machine that sounded as clear as a lot of MD games but sampled as nicely (most of the time) as the SNES.

    I may actually have just described the PlayStation, making all of this a pointless read!
    PlayStation and Saturn. That's why I've never considered getting MKIII for either of the 16-bit consoles, since the PlayStation and Saturn can pretty much copy any sound that an arcade machine can produce.
    A Black Falcon: no, computer games and video games are NOT the same thing. Video games are on consoles, computer games are on PC. The two kinds of games are different, and have significantly different design styles, distribution methods, and game genre selections. Computer gaming and console (video) gaming are NOT the same thing."



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    Hero of Algol TrekkiesUnite118's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sheath View Post
    The sad truth is Barone and I were friends and all of this is the worst kind of bullshit.
    You were and stilll are the one in complete control of the entire situation. Your behavior and actions in all these hardware debates is what has caused the situation. If you can't deal with the possibility of learning that your favorite systems aren't quite as amazing as you think they are, then don't participate in those discussions. If you can't deal with learning something new that changes your perception of what these companies actually did back in the 80s and 90s, then don't participate in those discussions either.

    You are the one who decided to lash out and attack myself, Barone, and others for simply replying to your statements with "Hold on, that's not right. This is the truth of the matter and here's the raw facts to back it up." You were the one who decided that after 2 years of being gone to make one of your first posts be flinging shit at Barone and I for no reason. Don't try to be the victim here.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Thief View Post
    Surprised to hear this point. We're at a point where it's a all real instruments or really well emulated. Personally, I miss the more unique one of a kind videogame sounds and music off unique console sound chips and the creativity they've inspired. Even Yuzo Koshiro misses making music like this. Seems like everything is created in a studio and streamed off the CD these days.
    I really don't agree with that at all . The Mega CD had some fantasic music thanks to the CD drive (Ecco is so much better onthe Mega CD thanks to the sound alone) and I loved the 32/128 bit generation of music where we at last started to get enough channels to really push music in games .











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