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Thread: Streets of Rage 4 (Official Thread)

  1. #541
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    Quote Originally Posted by Virtua Hunter View Post
    there would be no need to comment, but let's do anyway "special thanks: team streets of rage"

    what was the narrative? Yes, developers left alone...
    Er, what is that supposed to prove? The developers of the second game thanked the developers of the first. That's called professional courtesy; it doesn't imply in any way that the developers of the first game had any input into the second.

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    counter of beans Hedgehog-in-TrainingWildside Expert Cafeman's Avatar
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    Man, I am really enjoying Streets of Rage 4! Faithful, fun, challenging, lengthy enough to enjoy completing Story Mode yet still replay over and over. With superb art, animation, and music. I'm glad we all agree!

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    End of line.. Hero of Algol gamevet's Avatar
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    You can't please everyone.
    A Black Falcon: no, computer games and video games are NOT the same thing. Video games are on consoles, computer games are on PC. The two kinds of games are different, and have significantly different design styles, distribution methods, and game genre selections. Computer gaming and console (video) gaming are NOT the same thing."



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    Quote Originally Posted by Virtua Hunter View Post
    I think instead you all want to bring another kind of misleading narrative: "things were always the same and nothing has changed", so you can enjoy more these new indie licensed games pretending they are like the real thing.
    All I've been reading from your posts in this thread is that you hate Streets of Rage 4 and have been arguing with multiple people who don't care that you hate it but you still want to argue about it as if you're trying so hard to change their minds to make them hate the game also.

    Why not just move on and just agree to disagree with people?
    05/05/15

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    ESWAT Veteran Team Andromeda's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gryson View Post
    Absurd. You're outright rejecting the words of the people that made the games to fit your imagined narrative.

    "If you cared to post the sources..." Can you understand Japanese? I just translated the relevant excerpt from the talk for you (it's from the Game Business Archive talk that I've posted about before here). Takahashi also talks extensively about the lack of support from Sega. The first thing he and Kan Naito had to do when they decided to work with Sega was create development tools - he said that Sega had NOTHING at the time. Maegawa said the same thing, and that was several years later. These are the people that worked more closely with Sega than just about any other independent developer, and they both state clearly that they were pretty much on their own the whole time (including, specifically, the promotion of their games). None of this has anything to do with Sega of America, by the way. These games were developed entirely in Japan.

    A few people here seem out of touch with the modern gaming industry. "Streets of Rage 4 should have been a super big AAA production" - the beat-em-up genre is not conducive to that kind of production. We'd end up with something completely different (think Yakuza battles reskinned for SOR) and then everybody would be complaining "This isn't SOR!"

    Sega's handling of SOR4 was well done. This kind of beat-em-up game is best left to a small team, which is how the genre has always been handled. I would much rather Sega license out their IPs to passionate third-party devs than have the IPs receive the AAA treatment, which just isn't going to work with a practically dead genre (beat-em-ups didn't make the transition to 3D well for a reason).
    I thought SEGA didn't give developer's any development libraries back in the Mega Drive days (please don't bring up the crappy sound driver);. You basically had a development kit and tech sheet with a full break down of what the system could do .At least thats what's Travellers Tails and CORE design use to say . I doubt it was much different for SNES or PC Eng development at the time

    I also don't get what the age of Yuzo sister got to so with anything too ?The main team of JSR , were all in their young 20s and Yukio Futatsugi was in his 20s and working on this 1st major project, when given the task of Panzer Dragoon.

    That'd maybe why so many loved the old SEGA,.Never mind published games, for its own In House games .SEGA Japan had a hands off approach and gave young members of its staff a chance to make their own games

    .Sega not only give the SOR 2 team one of the biggest cart on the Mega Drive at the time (shows some faith) it also paid for its development and published the game too.

    Unless I'm very much mistaken .SEGA hasn't paid for the development of SOR IV, much less published it
    Last edited by Team Andromeda; 05-05-2020 at 05:38 AM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Virtua Hunter View Post
    I think instead you all want to bring another kind of misleading narrative: "things were always the same and nothing has changed", so you can enjoy more these new indie licensed games pretending they are like the real thing.

    Sorry to ruin the party but that's not the case, Sega was different and IPs weren't handled in the poor way they are handled today, there is a reason why Sega was the leader back in the day and many of its games become timeless classics....good luck doing the same SOR4 and PD Remake.

    Since you all continue to dismiss my posts and it seems quotes are valid only if posted by Gryson, I'll post some "visual" examples:

    -Lack of promotion by Sega: companies were left alone with promotion support: FALSE

    games from second parties were always given floor space by Sega in the most important shows at the time like CES or the Tokyo Toy/Games Show.

    so much for the "no promotion" statement, please explain this.


    -Lack of playtesting: FALSE

    Guardian Heroes (Treasure) has game testers from Sega
    https://segaretro.org/images/7/76/Gu..._us_manual.pdf (credits on US manual, page
    Don't forget how SEGA used to pay for Working Designs E3 both untill Bernie took over LOL. SEGA would have play testers on Gunstar Heroes , it was paying for its development and publishing the title , didn't SEGA even come up with the name Gunstar Heroes .

    I bet SEGA input was limited mind and to just bug and game difficult checking. But I've seen many Interviews with Treasure and how they loved the freedom SEGA Japan gave them.

    Treasure made RSG in part because of SEGAs request, that they should make a Arcade game . I'm sure the only support they got off SEGA was SEGA handling the publishing costs and distribution for the Arcade version .

    The good old Magic, of the old SEGA
    Last edited by Team Andromeda; 05-05-2020 at 05:35 AM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Silanda View Post
    Er, what is that supposed to prove? The developers of the second game thanked the developers of the first. That's called professional courtesy; it doesn't imply in any way that the developers of the first game had any input into the second.
    Then you simply don't know how "special thanks" works for japanese games...


    Quote Originally Posted by BonusKun View Post
    All I've been reading from your posts in this thread is that you hate Streets of Rage 4 and have been arguing with multiple people who don't care that you hate it but you still want to argue about it as if you're trying so hard to change their minds to make them hate the game also.

    Why not just move on and just agree to disagree with people?
    I suggest you to pay more attention to my posts. I said multiple times that I think SOR4 is a nice game and we got lucky with the outcome especially since the team was really on their own from start to finish, something that usually result in real disasters (like for example PD Remake)

    I'm not here to convince you to hate the game, just to remember the obvious things that many prefer to forget: this is not a real SOR, this is not the real thing.

    Pretending that current Sega would treat their classic IPs with more respect just like they treat Yakuza, should not be an heresy.

    Those who believe that these kind of licensing are destroying the Sega legacy are not heretics, they are probably the only ones that really understand what is happening.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Virtua Hunter View Post
    I suggest you to pay more attention to my posts. I said multiple times that I think SOR4 is a nice game and we got lucky with the outcome especially since the team was really on their own from start to finish, something that usually result in real disasters (like for example PD Remake)

    I'm not here to convince you to hate the game, just to remember the obvious things that many prefer to forget: this is not a real SOR, this is not the real thing.

    Pretending that current Sega would treat their classic IPs with more respect just like they treat Yakuza, should not be an heresy.

    Those who believe that these kind of licensing are destroying the Sega legacy are not heretics, they are probably the only ones that really understand what is happening.
    I have been reading them. It's still the same vibe I'm getting is you hate Streets of Rage 4.

    That's fine. It's not for everyone but a lot of people here are still enjoying it a lot.

    Leave it be at that and find something else to be angry about like maybe a lack of a Skies of Arcadia remake or something.

    None of what you're saying bud is going to change the fact that this game was really well received.

    Like Melf said before.

    The old SEGA is dead and gone. It's time to move on from the past.
    05/05/15

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    Quote Originally Posted by Team Andromeda View Post
    Don't forget how SEGA used to pay for Working Designs E3 both untill Bernie took over LOL. SEGA would have play testers on Gunstar Heroes , it was paying for its development and publishing the title , didn't SEGA even come up with the name Gunstar Heroes .

    I bet SEGA input was limited mind and to just bug and game difficult checking. But I've seen many Interviews with Treasure and how they loved the freedom SEGA Japan gave them.

    Treasure made RSG in part because of SEGAs request, that they should make a Arcade game . I'm sure the only support they got off SEGA was SEGA handling the publishing costs and distribution for the Arcade version .

    The good old Magic, of the old SEGA
    Exactly, you're right even for the Gunstar Heroes name (I think I even mentioned that in my previous posts).

    What I was trying to say is it's just unfair (and incorrect) to claims that the current no man's land situation, where Sega just give their licenses to anyone (as long they pay, no other requirements are needed) and don't care about what happen next, is the same situation where the old Sega actually cared and gave direct support, money, publishing etc to their second party studios.

    There is a bif difference between "creativity freedom" that is a great thing, and left third party studios alone, messing up with your classic IPs...

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    Mega Driver Hedgehog-in-TrainingMaster of Shinobi Gryson's Avatar
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    Look through Virtua Hunter's post history - he has complained in every thread about a new entry in an old Sega IP not developed by the original developers. Including Sonic Mania.

    And, apparently, he thinks Knuckles' Chaotix is underrated??

    Knuckles' Chaotix is one of the best examples of how old Sega rushed things and had inconsistent standards of quality - even in their flagship IP.

    Anyway, I suspect he's just dismissing everything outright without fair consideration. Some people are just unable to adapt to change.

    None of this is to say that SOR4 shouldn't be open to criticism - but the criticism that "It's not Streets of Rage because it wasn't developed by the original devs" is just absurd.

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    Quote Originally Posted by BonusKun View Post
    I have been reading them. It's still the same vibe I'm getting is you hate Streets of Rage 4.

    That's fine. It's not for everyone but a lot of people here are still enjoying it a lot.

    Leave it be at that and find something else to be angry about like maybe a lack of a Skies of Arcadia remake or something.

    None of what you're saying bud is going to change the fact that this game was really well received.

    Like Melf said before.

    The old SEGA is dead and gone. It's time to move on from the past.
    It's not hard to separate things
    SOR4 is a nice brawler on its own, but it isn't a real Streets of Rage game.
    I wish Lizardcube had the courage to stand on its own and to publish this same game, without using the SOR name and resorting to easy nostalgia of SOR fans.

    I would have even more respect for their work that way, as a simple tribute to classic brawlers, like many indie games do.
    But if instead I have to judge it as the "fourth" game of SOR series... no good.

    What Skies of Arcadia? Just to see another indie team, probably from the west and with no budget, taking the IP and making another imitation of a classic? No thanks, I'm done asking for the return of classic Sega IP.

    If they can't be done in-house by Sega Japan or even outside but by the original staff, it's better to leave these classic IPs in the grave and just wait for better times.

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    Hedgehog-in-Training Hedgehog-in-TrainingWildside Expert Virtua Hunter's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gryson View Post
    Look through Virtua Hunter's post history - he has complained in every thread about a new entry in an old Sega IP not developed by the original developers. Including Sonic Mania.
    What a Sega fan who only wants genuine games made by Sega? That's crazy.

  13. #553
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    Quote Originally Posted by Virtua Hunter View Post
    Then you simply don't know how "special thanks" works for japanese games...
    Evidence please.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Gryson View Post
    Look through Virtua Hunter's post history - he has complained in every thread about a new entry in an old Sega IP not developed by the original developers. Including Sonic Mania.

    And, apparently, he thinks Knuckles' Chaotix is underrated??

    Knuckles' Chaotix is one of the best examples of how old Sega rushed things and had inconsistent standards of quality - even in their flagship IP.
    .
    And to be honest, he right too and has ever right too . I'm all for SEGA its self , working on its own IP . I didnt have much time for Mania too. It looked great, amazing even .but the levels design, just seemed like a crazy miss match of the old games being tried to be joined into one.

    But SEGA can also mess up Sonic as we saw with Sonic 06

    Knuckles' Chaotix is one of the best examples of how old Sega rushed things and had inconsistent standards of quality - even in their flagship IP.
    You're better , than that example.. That was a rushed out game to try and help SEGA American out, when it was desperate for quality 32x games , while SEGA American was busy screwing up their own Sonic game and the main Sonic Team were looking to try something new .

    Still, even when SEGA does it In House ,it doesn't always work out . Daytona USA CE didn't look like Daytona or play like Daytona.

    Many fans always want the original team to develop any sequel or new game for classic IP .For some, Halo will never be Halo, unless BUNGiE make it.For many SEGA fans, any Shinning Force game will not be a true SF game, unless Camelot make it .

    SOR IV is a ok game , but it's doesn't feel it look like a SEGA Japan and Ancient made SOR game. In a very similar way to how SEGA Rally Revo didn't feel or look like a SEGA Japan Rally game and Shinobi just looked wrong on the Saturn .

    That's not to knock studios or the effort put in to the likes of Rally or SOR IV . But they didn't feel or look right .
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    Quote Originally Posted by Virtua Hunter View Post
    What a Sega fan who only wants genuine games made by Sega? That's crazy.
    We're a dying bread mate .
    Panzer Dragoon Zwei is
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