Quantcast

Page 15 of 21 FirstFirst ... 5111213141516171819 ... LastLast
Results 211 to 225 of 309

Thread: 2nd generation console discussion(Intellivision, Colecovision, 2600, Odyssey 2)

  1. #211
    Master of Shinobi Thenewguy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Posts
    1,972
    Rep Power
    33

    Default

    I believe the Super Mario C64 port wasn't made from the ground up, they ported the original source code and then optimised it.

    As such its very accurate, but not particularly impressive in other aspects, home-brew games like Sam's Journey blow it away.

  2. #212
    End of line.. Hero of Algol gamevet's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Location
    Dallas, Texas
    Posts
    8,543
    Rep Power
    123

    Default

    It appears that the Mario Sprite was changed though. You never see a smaller Mario.

  3. #213
    Smith's Minister of War Hero of Algol Kamahl's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Location
    Belgium
    Age
    29
    Posts
    8,468
    Rep Power
    139

    Default

    The Super Mario port as far as I understand is also using VSP scrolling to scroll that fast, which is fine for demos but not for a game meant to actually run on people's machines. Depending on your power supply or other random crap, VSP can randomly cause memory corruption and crash the game hard.

    There's even a tool to test if your C64 is susceptible: https://csdb.dk/release/?id=120810. Since it's random, it might happen only after 2 hours, or in the first minute of playing. I really don't think VSP should ever be used for games.

    Sam's Journey uses native scrolling (which is at least 100 times slower than VSP), which just makes it all the more impressive. It's also the reason why it needs the memory expansion for NTSC, since it can't scroll fast enough otherwise. Some games with less colorful backgrounds can manage native scrolling in NTSC pretty well, like the Metal Warrior series and Hessian: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YV4_3Yr4y7M
    This thread needs more... ENGINEERS

  4. #214
    Raging in the Streets Sik's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Posts
    3,624
    Rep Power
    65

    Default

    Looking up VSP and it's not "some" C64 that are susceptible, all of them are, it's just that it depends entirely on unlucky timing (essentially the address lines are unstable, and if it happens in the middle of the RAS cycle of refresh the RAM turns into garbage ó temperature and such only somewhat have an effect in that they skew when the unstableness happens, but it's always there). I wonder if anybody figured out how to avoid the unlucky timing, but I didn't do a very good cursory search about it lol (seems VSP discussion mostly died after that program was released).

    Also reminds me: for fucks sake, don't use the original Commodore power supplies, they're all time bombs (not just because of age but because they're outright badly designed).

  5. #215
    End of line.. Hero of Algol gamevet's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Location
    Dallas, Texas
    Posts
    8,543
    Rep Power
    123

    Default

    Some genius at Commodore thought that it would be a good idea to seal everything in a block of glue. Those things donít have any ventilation and get hot. I got a power supply from some company called Sun, back around 1988; itís been very reliable.
    A Black Falcon: no, computer games and video games are NOT the same thing. Video games are on consoles, computer games are on PC. The two kinds of games are different, and have significantly different design styles, distribution methods, and game genre selections. Computer gaming and console (video) gaming are NOT the same thing."



  6. #216
    Smith's Minister of War Hero of Algol Kamahl's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Location
    Belgium
    Age
    29
    Posts
    8,468
    Rep Power
    139

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Sik View Post
    I wonder if anybody figured out how to avoid the unlucky timing, but I didn't do a very good cursory search about it lol (seems VSP discussion mostly died after that program was released).
    Yes, but it is too limiting to be worth it: http://www.linusakesson.net/scene/safevsp/index.php

    And yeah technically all original C64s are susceptible, but on some it happens quite often while on others it happens much more rarely, to the point you might actually never encounter it during gameplay. A better power supply seems to make a big difference for whatever reason.
    This thread needs more... ENGINEERS

  7. #217
    Raging in the Streets Sik's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Posts
    3,624
    Rep Power
    65

    Default

    Yeah, I don't consider that a fix, was thinking more about if somebody had found a way to dodge the RAS cycle altogether.

    Quote Originally Posted by gamevet View Post
    Some genius at Commodore thought that it would be a good idea to seal everything in a block of glue. Those things donít have any ventilation and get hot. I got a power supply from some company called Sun, back around 1988; itís been very reliable.
    That isn't helping either, but I was thinking on a more fundamental level ó they skimped on protection so when the components start failing it will happily overvoltage the computer which will kill several of the chips (the custom ones tend to take it, but stuff like RAM is prone to die from it). Third-party PSUs tend to add some measures to prevent this scenario at least.

    It's a problem with Commodore in general, Amiga PSUs seem to be infamous for bursting in flames (I remember that at Evoke 2013 one of the Amigas caught fire out of nowhere, right before the compo isn't exactly the best moment for that to happen :​P).

  8. #218
    End of line.. Hero of Algol gamevet's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Location
    Dallas, Texas
    Posts
    8,543
    Rep Power
    123

    Default

    Thatís probably why they put a fuse in there.

    I replaced the old PSU after one of my C64s started flaming out and another day one just black screens. Havenít had any issues with the 3rd party PSU.


    Iíve never had any issues with my A500 PSU. Are you sure the one that caught on fire didnít have an accelerator board and a bunch of other add-on that might have overloaded the stock PSU?
    Last edited by gamevet; 01-17-2020 at 04:36 PM.
    A Black Falcon: no, computer games and video games are NOT the same thing. Video games are on consoles, computer games are on PC. The two kinds of games are different, and have significantly different design styles, distribution methods, and game genre selections. Computer gaming and console (video) gaming are NOT the same thing."



  9. #219
    Smith's Minister of War Hero of Algol Kamahl's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Location
    Belgium
    Age
    29
    Posts
    8,468
    Rep Power
    139

    Default

    Back on topic, the ColecoVision could do this, with the memory expansion at least, definitely above an Atari 2600:

    This thread needs more... ENGINEERS

  10. #220
    Death Bringer Raging in the Streets Black_Tiger's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Location
    Vancouver
    Age
    43
    Posts
    4,675
    Rep Power
    105

    Default

    I think that the Colecovision can do pretty much any MSX game with the right kind of ram and audio expansion. If a better cpu is required it likely could be included in the expansion or game cart.

    The same company that makes the current Super Game Modules was going to produce a hardware upgrade for Intellivision for a while and even worked on several games for it (one of which was Castlevania). It was an fpga that could emulate arcade games from the 80's. Theoretically they'd incorporate a token amount of actual Intellivision assets in each game, but none of their previews did.

    It was designed for the same purpose as the SGM, to turn game production into minimal adaptation of existing games' code/assets instead of having to build games from the ground up. So that physical games could be sold as fast as the market would bare.

    Thankfully they cancelled the Intellixpander before homebrew efforts shifted to it. IntyBasic has proven how priceless an easy to pick up development kit is best thing that can happen to classic consoles.
    Quote Originally Posted by year2kill06
    everyone knows nintendo is far way cooler than sega just face it nintendo has more better games and originals

  11. #221
    Smith's Minister of War Hero of Algol Kamahl's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Location
    Belgium
    Age
    29
    Posts
    8,468
    Rep Power
    139

    Default

    Some more impressive 2.5 gen homebrew, this time something for the Atari 800 (the computer version of the 5200):

    This thread needs more... ENGINEERS

  12. #222
    Master of Shinobi Thenewguy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Posts
    1,972
    Rep Power
    33

    Default

    Was the Vectrex capable of doing a close port of Star Wars arcade game back in the day? I'm having trouble grasping its capabilities tbh.

    I notice there was a clone released for it called Star Fire, but this was homebrew released in 1999 and its missing the trench run barriers.
    Last edited by Thenewguy; 01-19-2020 at 09:40 PM.

  13. #223
    Raging in the Streets Sik's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Posts
    3,624
    Rep Power
    65

    Default

    For what's worth it, Star Fire was an actual arcade game from 1978 (or 1979? I've seen both dates), the Vectrex one seems to be a port of that.

    Anyway, I suppose it depends how good you're at optimizing the 3D math? And may or may not need to lower the detail of the models, not sure how far you can push it. The way vector CRTs work is weird, you draw line by line, and if you draw too many (to the point where the refresh rate starts getting too low) it starts flickering.

  14. #224
    WCPO Agent
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Posts
    821
    Rep Power
    18

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Sik View Post
    For what's worth it, Star Fire was an actual arcade game from 1978 (or 1979? I've seen both dates), the Vectrex one seems to be a port of that.

    Anyway, I suppose it depends how good you're at optimizing the 3D math? And may or may not need to lower the detail of the models, not sure how far you can push it. The way vector CRTs work is weird, you draw line by line, and if you draw too many (to the point where the refresh rate starts getting too low) it starts flickering.
    Not that I know much about these systems but considering both the Vectrex and Star Wars arcade are powered by a single 6809 at 1.5 MHz (my understanding is that the arcade uses the second 6809 for sound only) I would think the math and game engine would be fine. Whether or not the Vectrex vector generator is equally capable I have no idea.

  15. #225
    End of line.. Hero of Algol gamevet's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Location
    Dallas, Texas
    Posts
    8,543
    Rep Power
    123

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by axel View Post
    Not that I know much about these systems but considering both the Vectrex and Star Wars arcade are powered by a single 6809 at 1.5 MHz (my understanding is that the arcade uses the second 6809 for sound only) I would think the math and game engine would be fine. Whether or not the Vectrex vector generator is equally capable I have no idea.
    I don't know if it can. It can do a pretty decent port of Star Castle though, but the console's sound seems even more primitive than the Atari 2600.

    This guy isn't very good at Star Castle, but you can see how close the game is to the arcade. The rings move a bit slower than the arcade game though.

    Last edited by gamevet; 01-20-2020 at 01:21 AM.
    A Black Falcon: no, computer games and video games are NOT the same thing. Video games are on consoles, computer games are on PC. The two kinds of games are different, and have significantly different design styles, distribution methods, and game genre selections. Computer gaming and console (video) gaming are NOT the same thing."



Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •