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Thread: "SNES has a more powerful CPU and higher resolution in games than the Genesis"

  1. #31
    End of line.. Hero of Algol gamevet's Avatar
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    There are games like Decathlete that are at a higher resolution.
    A Black Falcon: no, computer games and video games are NOT the same thing. Video games are on consoles, computer games are on PC. The two kinds of games are different, and have significantly different design styles, distribution methods, and game genre selections. Computer gaming and console (video) gaming are NOT the same thing."



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    Master of Shinobi Mega Drive Bowlsey's Avatar
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    The Sega Mega Drive was waaaay more better than the SNES cos me and all my mates had a Mega Drive, and nobody had a SNES at school except this one kid who had no friends so there! If you want a fight about it you can meet me by the side gate after school and I'll use my Streets of Rage skills on ya!

    In all seriousness are people still arguing over this?! I will always be a Sega fan boy 'til I die, but that hasn't stopped me getting a SNES in recent years and really enjoying playing games on it. I love the fact that some games of the same name are completely different on both consoles, yet both are great to play. Alien 3 is a good example of this.

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    8 & 16 bit guy Outrunner Bloodreign's Avatar
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    Ahhh Yohko, I play games to have fun, not to run myself insane worrying about which version is better. I play the games, SNES or Genesis.


    I once hated the Genesis with a passion, maybe the same way you hate the SNES, but I decided to buy a Genesis in 98, gave it a chance. Did it hurt me to try and enjoy games from a console I hated at the time, absolutely not. If anything, it opened my eyes to more games I could enjoy. I let go the hate, let it fly away, have over 170 games for each 16 bit console. I'd suggest doing the same, try and enjoy the games, quit worrying about technical mumbo jumbo that is keeping you from enjoying the games.


    I don't downplay anything, as I said, I enjoy the games (so what if one version plays a little differently from the other). Between you and that Ben Owen cat (that guy needs to chill most definitely) on Youtube, you both need to open your eyes and enjoy the games. Worrying about shortcomings for SNES, there is such a thing as being too much a fanboy of one console, and it's not a good thing, trust me. The SNES, like the Genesis, has a treasure trove of excellent games, as well as stinkers, no system has an entirely flawless library.


    We are alike, or were alike in some ways, me prior to my 1998 Genesis purchase, the only difference, I got older, and gave the Genesis it's due, and got rid of the hate. These days I have 3 Sega consoles in my home, a Genesis, an SMS, and a Saturn, I wouldn't trade them away for anything, just like my Nintendo systems, and Sony systems. I'd smack younger me behind the head if I ever got the chance for thinking that way.

  4. #34
    Master of Shinobi Mega Drive Bowlsey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bloodreign View Post
    Ahhh Yohko, I play games to have fun, not to run myself insane worrying about which version is better. I play the games, SNES or Genesis.


    I once hated the Genesis with a passion, maybe the same way you hate the SNES, but I decided to buy a Genesis in 98, gave it a chance. Did it hurt me to try and enjoy games from a console I hated at the time, absolutely not. If anything, it opened my eyes to more games I could enjoy. I let go the hate, let it fly away, have over 170 games for each 16 bit console. I'd suggest doing the same, try and enjoy the games, quit worrying about technical mumbo jumbo that is keeping you from enjoying the games.


    I don't downplay anything, as I said, I enjoy the games (so what if one version plays a little differently from the other). Between you and that Ben Owen cat (that guy needs to chill most definitely) on Youtube, you both need to open your eyes and enjoy the games. Worrying about shortcomings for SNES, there is such a thing as being too much a fanboy of one console, and it's not a good thing, trust me. The SNES, like the Genesis, has a treasure trove of excellent games, as well as stinkers, no system has an entirely flawless library.


    We are alike, or were alike in some ways, me prior to my 1998 Genesis purchase, the only difference, I got older, and gave the Genesis it's due, and got rid of the hate. These days I have 3 Sega consoles in my home, a Genesis, an SMS, and a Saturn, I wouldn't trade them away for anything, just like my Nintendo systems, and Sony systems. I'd smack younger me behind the head if I ever got the chance for thinking that way.
    Love it. It's funny that we came at this conclusion from polar opposite starting points in life, in terms of gaming, and yet ended at the same place. Whether you go for the Sega Mega Drive or the SNES, the bottom line is the same. The 16-bit era was arguably the greatest in gaming history.

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    Death Bringer Raging in the Streets Black_Tiger's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gamevet View Post
    There are games like Decathlete that are at a higher resolution.
    The Saturn, like the Mega Drive, has specific resolutions it can do. Some are way higher than CPS2 and some are lower.
    Quote Originally Posted by year2kill06
    everyone knows nintendo is far way cooler than sega just face it nintendo has more better games and originals

  6. #36
    End of line.. Hero of Algol gamevet's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Black_Tiger View Post
    The Saturn, like the Mega Drive, has specific resolutions it can do. Some are way higher than CPS2 and some are lower.
    Some are just weird. I just captured Last Gladiators from the Saturn. I saw that its output resolution (I can't see it now) was something like 407x267, which is a really odd number. The capture device decided to use 700x480 (or something like that) for the capture resolution. Capcom probably could have used that 470 resolution, but I believe that they were worried about using up video memory, so they decided to cut off the edges of the screen and display it at 320 x 240 instead.
    A Black Falcon: no, computer games and video games are NOT the same thing. Video games are on consoles, computer games are on PC. The two kinds of games are different, and have significantly different design styles, distribution methods, and game genre selections. Computer gaming and console (video) gaming are NOT the same thing."



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    Death Bringer Raging in the Streets Black_Tiger's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gamevet View Post
    Some are just weird. I just captured Last Gladiators from the Saturn. I saw that its output resolution (I can't see it now) was something like 407x267, which is a really odd number. The capture device decided to use 700x480 (or something like that) for the capture resolution. Capcom probably could have used that 470 resolution, but I believe that they were worried about using up video memory, so they decided to cut off the edges of the screen and display it at 320 x 240 instead.
    I think that some of the unconventional video specs of some consoles confuse some capture devices and monitors. My RGB monitor and framemeister run some console video with issues, sometimes only after a period of time... and some don't register at all.
    Quote Originally Posted by year2kill06
    everyone knows nintendo is far way cooler than sega just face it nintendo has more better games and originals

  8. #38
    Outrunner EPSYLON EAGLE's Avatar
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    Well, i have seen some Super Nes fanboys arguing that because the console performs transparency effects, show more colors, background layers and tilemaps, your CPU can handle more workload than Genesis CPU, and these factors often require far more calculations horsepower than any additional screen area resolution.


    That's true?

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    End of line.. Hero of Algol gamevet's Avatar
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    @EPSYLON EAGLE

    The TG-16 and SNES are using more colors, which will require more video memory. The trade-off is using a slightly lower resolution, to save some VRAM space.


    Quote Originally Posted by Black_Tiger View Post
    I think that some of the unconventional video specs of some consoles confuse some capture devices and monitors. My RGB monitor and framemeister run some console video with issues, sometimes only after a period of time... and some don't register at all.
    I do know that it is one of the higher resolution Saturn games and my capture device will not recognize anything 320 x 240 or below. I do believe that it is using something below 640 x 480, but above 320 x 240.
    A Black Falcon: no, computer games and video games are NOT the same thing. Video games are on consoles, computer games are on PC. The two kinds of games are different, and have significantly different design styles, distribution methods, and game genre selections. Computer gaming and console (video) gaming are NOT the same thing."



  10. #40
    Hero of Algol TrekkiesUnite118's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gamevet View Post
    Some are just weird. I just captured Last Gladiators from the Saturn. I saw that its output resolution (I can't see it now) was something like 407x267, which is a really odd number. The capture device decided to use 700x480 (or something like that) for the capture resolution. Capcom probably could have used that 470 resolution, but I believe that they were worried about using up video memory, so they decided to cut off the edges of the screen and display it at 320 x 240 instead.
    That's impossible. The Saturn cannot display that resolution at all.

    The following are the only modes possible on an NTSC console:

    Horizontal:
    320
    352
    640
    704

    Vertical:
    224
    240
    448i
    480i

    You can do any combination of those, but you can't do anything but those fixed horizontal and vertical values. The values are determined by clockrate and hardware registers. And Capcom's CPS2 ports don't run at 320x240, they run at 352x224 because that's the closest you can get to 384x224 on the Saturn.

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    End of line.. Hero of Algol gamevet's Avatar
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    I guess it was 704 x 480 (I did say it was something like 700x480), that the capture device decided to use. 352x224 would explain why the left and right edges are cut off on those Capcom fighters.
    A Black Falcon: no, computer games and video games are NOT the same thing. Video games are on consoles, computer games are on PC. The two kinds of games are different, and have significantly different design styles, distribution methods, and game genre selections. Computer gaming and console (video) gaming are NOT the same thing."



  12. #42
    Raging in the Streets Sik's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by EPSYLON EAGLE View Post
    Well, i have seen some Super Nes fanboys arguing that because the console performs transparency effects, show more colors, background layers and tilemaps, your CPU can handle more workload than Genesis CPU, and these factors often require far more calculations horsepower than any additional screen area resolution.


    That's true?
    It's like attaching a powerful GPU to a weako CPU, the GPU is doing all the grunt work.

    Yes, the 65816 uses up less cycles than the 68000 so in terms of instructions per second it's about the same… but the 65816 also needs more instructions to perform the same tasks most of the time, which negates that (ノ_<) Now mind, it's still good enough for most 2D games honestly (we had a whole generation of action games on the NES but somehow the SNES is too weak for that? yeah, no), but it definitely poses a problem if you need to push things to the limit (see: any attempt at 3D without a coprocessor).

    On the other hand this says a lot about performance. The SNES can do all that because it's handled by the video hardware "for free" as far as the CPU is aware.

  13. #43
    Master of Shinobi
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    Quote Originally Posted by TrekkiesUnite118 View Post
    That's impossible. The Saturn cannot display that resolution at all.

    The following are the only modes possible on an NTSC console:

    Horizontal:
    320
    352
    640
    704

    Vertical:
    224
    240
    448i
    480i

    You can do any combination of those, but you can't do anything but those fixed horizontal and vertical values. The values are determined by clockrate and hardware registers. And Capcom's CPS2 ports don't run at 320x240, they run at 352x224 because that's the closest you can get to 384x224 on the Saturn.

    Add in overscan etc and it wouldn't be abnormal for his capture device to show some strange resolution. It may also default to some standard modes that come closest.

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    Outrunner EPSYLON EAGLE's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sik View Post
    It's like attaching a powerful GPU to a weako CPU, the GPU is doing all the grunt work.

    Yes, the 65816 uses up less cycles than the 68000 so in terms of instructions per second it's about the same… but the 65816 also needs more instructions to perform the same tasks most of the time, which negates that (ノ_<) Now mind, it's still good enough for most 2D games honestly (we had a whole generation of action games on the NES but somehow the SNES is too weak for that? yeah, no), but it definitely poses a problem if you need to push things to the limit (see: any attempt at 3D without a coprocessor).

    On the other hand this says a lot about performance. The SNES can do all that because it's handled by the video hardware "for free" as far as the CPU is aware.
    Yes i agree with you, the video processor does most part of the hard work, but what explains the drop frame rate in some games when doing transparency effects? This trick penalizes the CPU somehow?

  15. #45
    Raging in the Streets Sik's Avatar
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    Nope. At most it limits how you can use the layers, but that's still entirely on the video hardware side.

    The slow down probably comes from other issues (on top of the game probably already being on the limit), e.g. usually those translucency effects are combined with window clipping to give it a shape, which involves changing the shape of the windows every line. While the hardware can use DMA to automatically write these values every line, the CPU still has to compute what those values should be in the first place. If the computations are not optimized, that can drag down the game as a whole.

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