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Thread: SEGA Saturn a Historical Revisionism

  1. #76
    End of line.. Hero of Algol gamevet's Avatar
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    Yeah, that's right. When Nintendo dumped the Nintendo/Sony Playstation, Ken looked at it as an opportunity to show his 3D chip concept to Sony. He still didn't have a completed chip though.


    Quote Originally Posted by Team Andromeda View Post


    It was covered years ago in Retro I've posted it before when Gamevet said the Night Trap wasn't finished before the Mega CD version

    SONY didn't publish it or bring it Mega-CD, SonyImaginesoft 1st games were on Nintendo systems, not SEGA. Its the SEGA ex that's all over the place for facts here...
    I didn't say that the game wasn't finished.

    I said that the game wasn't finished (not talking about NEMO) until Sony funded Digital Pictures and then worked with Sega to bring it to the SEGA CD. The game that was on the Nemo was just a bunch of footage on a VHS tape, with the console providing a digital overlay for the controls. DP worked with Sony to bring it to the Nintendo PlayStation, then SEGA and Sony worked with DP to bring it to the SEGA CD when Nintendo dumped Sony. Without Sony Funding Digital Pictures. Night Trap would still be a bunch of scenes on videotape How is this so hard for you to understand?
    Last edited by gamevet; 01-04-2020 at 09:16 PM.
    A Black Falcon: no, computer games and video games are NOT the same thing. Video games are on consoles, computer games are on PC. The two kinds of games are different, and have significantly different design styles, distribution methods, and game genre selections. Computer gaming and console (video) gaming are NOT the same thing."



  2. #77
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    Quote Originally Posted by Team Andromeda View Post
    Yes, So if SEGA had seen what actually SONY was working on and so the story goes SEGA Japan turned them down. Why was SEGA Japan caught so-off with the 3D spec?

    Please try and understand these 2 very simple, but very important facts:

    AT NO POINT DID SONY SHOW SEGA THE SPECS OF THE PLAYSTATION!

    SONY AT NO POINT OFFERED SEGA THE PLAYSTATION CHIPSET!


    These talks between Sega and Sony were preliminary, to see if they could work together and build a spec for a new console, Sega did not show Sony the Saturn and Sony DID NOT show Sega the PlayStation.

    Is that clear enough for you?

    Sega of Japan told Sony that they wanted to focus on 2D and wasn't interested in working with Sony. Ken Kutaragi of Sony wanted to focus on 3D and felt that 2D only was old hat, he also didn't give a fuck about working with Sega and wanted Sony to chart its own course.
    So they disagreed and any chance of a partnership went POOF!

    Had they come to an agreement and both companies signed off on a joint venture agreement, then I'm sure Sega would of seen what Sony was working on. But that never happened.

    See that's not too hard, is it?


    Quote Originally Posted by Team Andromeda View Post
    So why would SEGA look to SONY for 2D sprites then?. That's to overlook it was actually NEC who didn't 3D would be important. 3D was always going to be part of the Saturn (Core told EDGE is 3D was better was amazing way back in 1993)
    just SEGA Japan looked to do it with sprites. Even the call for the 32X was about getting better 3D from the Mega Drive. I would put to you 3D polygons was going to feature.
    What the heck are you babbling about FFS?? Sega didn't look to Sony for 2D, where the heck did you get that from?? The original spec of the Saturn was developed to focus primarily on 2D sprites, 3D wasn't a focus until Sega realised what Sony was working on. I'm not even going to bother with the rest of your post. Got games to play!!

    Now you can chop my post up in to nonsensical snippets and cherry pick your nonsensical (and largely illegible) responses like you normally do.


    Quote Originally Posted by gamevet View Post
    Without Sony Funding Digital Pictures. Night Trap would still be a bunch of scenes on videotapeHow is this so hard for you to understand?


    I know what you mean, it gets really tiresome having to explain things to TA..lol
    Last edited by stu; 01-05-2020 at 01:40 AM.

  3. #78
    Master of Shinobi Mega Drive Bowlsey's Avatar
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    I originally posted that video 'The History of Digital Pictures' in the Mega CD section a couple of years ago, and it's as clear as day that Sony did indeed help Tom Zito with the task of converting the old VHS footage of Night Trap, and presumably Sewer Shark, on to digital media. Sony had a good software partnership with Sega and produced games for both the Mega Drive and Mega CD under the Sony Imagesoft label. This does not mean however that Sony ever had any serious intention of going a step further and developing a hardware partnership with Sega. Stu is quite correct, Ken Kutaragi always wanted Sony to chart it's own course and the rest is history.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mega Drive Bowlsey View Post
    I originally posted that video 'The History of Digital Pictures' in the Mega CD section a couple of years ago, and it's as clear as day that Sony did indeed help Tom Zito with the task of converting the old VHS footage of Night Trap, and presumably Sewer Shark, on to digital media. Sony had a good software partnership with Sega and produced games for both the Mega Drive and Mega CD under the Sony Imagesoft label. This does not mean however that Sony ever had any serious intention of going a step further and developing a hardware partnership with Sega. Stu is quite correct, Ken Kutaragi always wanted Sony to chart it's own course and the rest is history.

    Thanks

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    Quote Originally Posted by SegaAMD View Post
    I myself have sent SEGA suggestions not to go in the way of the market doing and continuing its story, but I'm not sure if anyone inside has read it.
    Wait what? Who are you? Why would anyone at Sega listen to some Sega fan?????

  6. #81
    Master of Shinobi Mega Drive Bowlsey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by turboxray View Post
    Wait what? Who are you? Why would anyone at Sega listen to some Sega fan?????
    Good point. I mean I consider myself to be a huge Sega fanboy, but if the top brass at Sega had listened to some of my ideas over the years they'd probably have gone bust a long time ago!

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    ESWAT Veteran Team Andromeda's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by stu View Post
    Please try and understand these 2 very simple, but very important facts:

    AT NO POINT DID SONY SHOW SEGA THE SPECS OF THE PLAYSTATION!

    SONY AT NO POINT OFFERED SEGA THE PLAYSTATION CHIPSET!


    These talks between Sega and Sony were preliminary, to see if they could work together and build a spec for a new console, Sega did not show Sony the Saturn and Sony DID NOT show Sega the PlayStation.

    Is that clear enough for you?
    Tell that to Tom K because that's not what Retrogamer in one of his last interviews. Not just talks with his chum, but a full list of spec and breakdown of the so-called planned system, along with Joe Miller present.

    What the heck are you babbling about FFS?? Sega didn't look to Sony for 2D
    It's in one interview with Toyoda-san that was linked on facebook. but maybe it was writing mistake and meant to read 3D.

    I know what you mean, it gets really tiresome having to explain things to TA
    Next, you'll be giving credit to Nintendo for the Playstation and not SONY.
    Last edited by Team Andromeda; 01-05-2020 at 10:20 AM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by gamevet View Post

    I didn't say that the game wasn't finished.
    Who said

    Not even close. The filming was completed right around the time that Hasbro killed the project. The only playable part of Night Trap, was a 5 minute demo called Scene of the Crime. It didn't have any of the traps that you see in the game, much beyond just showing the changing room scenes. The demo was shot over a weekend.
    Panzer Dragoon Zwei is
    one of the best 3D shooting games available
    Presented for your pleasure

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    Quote Originally Posted by Team Andromeda View Post
    Tell that to Tom K because that's not what Retrogamer in one of his last interviews. Not just talks with his chum, but a full list of spec and breakdown of the so-called planned system, along with Joe Miller present.
    LOL, right then prove it. Post the FULL interview and show where he said that he had a full breakdown of specs of the PlayStation from Kutaragi or some other Sony exec. Full interview means everything, no tiny little block from where you can cherry pick.

    In all the other interviews he's given Kalinske has said the he and the Sony US execs discussed what they would like to see in a prospective joint console, HE'S NEVER CLAIMED TO HAVE ANY KNOWLEDGE OF THE PLAYSTATION OR THAT SEGA WERE OFFERED THE SYSTEM FROM THOSE MEETINGS.



    Quote Originally Posted by Team Andromeda View Post
    Next, you'll be giving credit to Nintendo for the Playstation and not SONY.
    LOL I'm not the one that thinks that just because Kalinske and Sony US execs discussed possible console specs and took those possible console specs to their respective parent companies in Japan to consider, that it means somehow he is claiming he had knowledge of the Playstation, that was being developed in secret in Japan, because he's never claimed that. You see I can actually understand context in an interview.
    Last edited by stu; 01-05-2020 at 04:28 PM.

  10. #85
    End of line.. Hero of Algol gamevet's Avatar
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    He has poor comprehension skills. Remember his comment about Pixie Dust, as if it was an actual thing?
    A Black Falcon: no, computer games and video games are NOT the same thing. Video games are on consoles, computer games are on PC. The two kinds of games are different, and have significantly different design styles, distribution methods, and game genre selections. Computer gaming and console (video) gaming are NOT the same thing."



  11. #86
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    Quote Originally Posted by gamevet View Post
    He has poor comprehension skills. Remember his comment about Pixie Dust, as if it was an actual thing?
    Was he confusing it with Angel Dust?

    Life!? ... What console is that on?



    [PSN] Segata-S //[Switch] FC-SW 3892 5228 2895 //[XBL]Dogi99


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    Quote Originally Posted by SegataS View Post
    Was he confusing it with Angel Dust?
    Someone at Sega made a joke about how they got an effect to work on the Saturn. The guy said Pixie Dust (jokingly laughs), and somehow TA took that as some code name for a programming trick.
    Last edited by gamevet; 01-05-2020 at 09:52 PM.
    A Black Falcon: no, computer games and video games are NOT the same thing. Video games are on consoles, computer games are on PC. The two kinds of games are different, and have significantly different design styles, distribution methods, and game genre selections. Computer gaming and console (video) gaming are NOT the same thing."



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    Outta reps but lol that is funny!

    Life!? ... What console is that on?



    [PSN] Segata-S //[Switch] FC-SW 3892 5228 2895 //[XBL]Dogi99


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    Quote Originally Posted by gamevet View Post
    He has poor comprehension skills. Remember his comment about Pixie Dust, as if it was an actual thing?

    LOL that's true, I'd forgot about that!


    Here's the interview.



    Basically, John Burton of TT was asked how they got the misting in effect on the game and he sarcastically answered "Angel Dust" TA thought he was serious ...lol
    Last edited by stu; 01-06-2020 at 01:31 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mega Drive Bowlsey View Post
    I mean I consider myself to be a huge Sega fanboy, but if the top brass at Sega had listened to some of my ideas over the years they'd probably have gone bust a long time ago!
    what ideas would those be?

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