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Thread: PlayStation 5 (Official Thread)

  1. #391
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    Quote Originally Posted by Team Andromeda View Post
    How is it contradicting when we all know AMD have moved to Polaris for their new consoles? and so when moves to different graphics architecture you stop counting Teraflops? That would have meant we would have stopped counting Teraflops decades ago.
    We can't compare CPU's speed either now, every time we move to different architecture either?. When comparing PS 5 to Xbox Series X you're not comparing different GPU/CPU architecture's, since they're based around the same architecture! A point, which seems to elude you.
    10 Teraflops on Polaris, is not comparable to 10 Teraflops on Navi. Just like 14 Teraflops on GTX 2080 Ti isn’t comparable to the 20 Teraflops on the RTX 3070.

    They are the same architecur, btw. You haven’t done much research obviously.



    A demo and where even the demo could manage 1440p and 30 FPS overlooking how we've all seen demo's in the past that never match what happens in a real game. Like the Luminous demo or Samaritan demo's, Dawn Ultra demo, Halo 2 Lift demo or that Project Milo demo all staged with the studio in complete controls even if in so-called real-time I go what happens in-game when the player in control of the action and when the game needs to factor in player actions and movements the true test of any game and hardware

    And its not like Hellblade 2 demo didn't look any worse than Unreal's 5 own, but let's see In-game what it really looks like when the player takes control
    PS5 doesn’t do 1440p, so stop making shit up. And neither of these console will be doing Ray Tracing at 4k/60 without upscaling. They don’t have that kind of horsepower.

    The demo was using real time player movement, on real hardware. The stuff you’re talking about was more than likely running on a dev kit, or just a PC.
    Last edited by gamevet; 11-25-2020 at 04:16 PM.

  2. #392
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    fortunately for me that I found the Playstation proposal interesting, the PS5 is a more powerful console than the xbox, it is evident that, teraflops are silly things as were Bit in the past.

    the playstation architecture allows a higher fill rate and this is not related to floating point, the ssd saves a lot of memory so both consoles do not use the 16GB in the same way, the use of the PS5 makes it more practical, while xbox to make matters worse still has that bottleneck in memory.

    this xbot narrative that it will improve is just an illusion for MS to continue selling consoles and at the same time keep those who bought the Series X with self-esteem, perhaps this is the console with the most fake marketing since the Atari Jaguar and its Do the Math.

    I think Microsoft should focus on game pass and leave this matter related to '' power '' aside, as with each new game the xbox will run worse and worse generating a lot of negative advertising for the brand.

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    Quote Originally Posted by SegaAMD View Post
    fortunately for me that I found the Playstation proposal interesting, the PS5 is a more powerful console than the xbox, it is evident that, teraflops are silly things as were Bit in the past.

    the playstation architecture allows a higher fill rate and this is not related to floating point, the ssd saves a lot of memory so both consoles do not use the 16GB in the same way, the use of the PS5 makes it more practical, while xbox to make matters worse still has that bottleneck in memory.

    this xbot narrative that it will improve is just an illusion for MS to continue selling consoles and at the same time keep those who bought the Series X with self-esteem, perhaps this is the console with the most fake marketing since the Atari Jaguar and its Do the Math.

    I think Microsoft should focus on game pass and leave this matter related to '' power '' aside, as with each new game the xbox will run worse and worse generating a lot of negative advertising for the brand.
    The hilariously thing is you don't even understand 90% of the drivel you regurgitate in these posts. While it's pretty entertaining, I highly recommend making some youtube videos. I seriously need to hear you talk hahaha.

  4. #394
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    Quote Originally Posted by SegaAMD View Post
    fortunately for me that I found the Playstation proposal interesting, the PS5 is a more powerful console than the xbox, it is evident that, teraflops are silly things as were Bit in the past.

    the playstation architecture allows a higher fill rate and this is not related to floating point, the ssd saves a lot of memory so both consoles do not use the 16GB in the same way, the use of the PS5 makes it more practical, while xbox to make matters worse still has that bottleneck in memory.

    this xbot narrative that it will improve is just an illusion for MS to continue selling consoles and at the same time keep those who bought the Series X with self-esteem, perhaps this is the console with the most fake marketing since the Atari Jaguar and its Do the Math.

    I think Microsoft should focus on game pass and leave this matter related to '' power '' aside, as with each new game the xbox will run worse and worse generating a lot of negative advertising for the brand.
    From looking at the videos I don't think the SSD is the problem, other than some slightly slower load times. A faster SSD wouldn't fix the framerate issues in Devil May Cry and Assassin's Creed. Unless that memory bottleneck is really bad these might just be software issues. I'll give Sony credit where it's due however, they are off to a great start while MS looks like they should have waited a few more months to release.

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    Quote Originally Posted by gamevet View Post





    PS5 doesn’t do 1440p, so stop making shit up. And neither of these console will be doing Ray Tracing at 4k/60 without upscaling. They don’t have that kind of horsepower.

    The demo was using real time player movement, on real hardware. The stuff you’re talking about was more than likely running on a dev kit, or just a PC.
    https://developer-tech.com/news/2020...5-ray-tracing/

    Graphic Demos are always staged and where the developer is in complete control of the action and camera movement. I've yet to see a Unreal graphic demo be beaten in real time for a console game .

    I really don't get your point over Ray tracing at Native 4K at 60 FPS . I never made any such claim
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    Quote Originally Posted by gamevet View Post
    [stuff]
    Still missing the point..

    I'll give you prime examples of 2 different GTX 460s that had different performance. The launch GTX 460 came with 256-bit VRAM memory, while the V.2 GTX 460 came with 192 bit VRAM. The second version was substantially slower, despite having the same amount of pixel pipelines. Even overclocked it was slower.
    What??? That example has nothing even remotely close todo with what's being discussed. Seriously, what..

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    Quote Originally Posted by Team Andromeda View Post
    https://developer-tech.com/news/2020...5-ray-tracing/

    Graphic Demos are always staged and where the developer is in complete control of the action and camera movement. I've yet to see a Unreal graphic demo be beaten in real time for a console game .

    It's lowest point is 1440p, but it is not being displayed at that resolution, because the console doesn't currently support it. Epic games has never demoed their graphics engine on a console. It's always been on PC, so expecting the much weaker console to achieve that is unrealistic.

    A quote from your article.

    “When GPU load gets high we can lower the screen resolution a bit, and then we can adapt to that. In the demo, we actually did use dynamic resolution, although it ends up rendering at about 1440p most of the time.”

    Dropping to 1440p doesn’t bode well, especially at just 30 FPS and without ray-tracing. However, Epic claims the demo was to show off Unreal Engine 5’s tech and “trade-offs” to deliver specific resolutions, frame rates, and features will be up to developers. On ray-tracing specifically, Epic Games confirmed that it was not used in the PS5 tech demo but it will be supported in Unreal Engine 5.
    That being said, the demo was doing light sourced objects much better than any sort of Ray Tracing we've seen in the current games available for both consoles. Black Ops was only doing shadow traced Ray Tracing, which a far reach from what we've seen in the likes of Control and Battlefield V.

    I really don't get your point over Ray tracing at Native 4K at 60 FPS . I never made any such claim
    You were nitpicking the resolution of the Unreal 5 engine for using (as low as)1440p resolution, as if the consoles are actually capable of doing true 4K rendering at a better fps.
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    Quote Originally Posted by axel View Post
    From looking at the videos I don't think the SSD is the problem, other than some slightly slower load times. A faster SSD wouldn't fix the framerate issues in Devil May Cry and Assassin's Creed. Unless that memory bottleneck is really bad these might just be software issues. I'll give Sony credit where it's due however, they are off to a great start while MS looks like they should have waited a few more months to release.
    you haven't understood yet. The ssd is not only for loading time, they are the ''media'' through which the game is read, do not realize, the ps5 ssd would be analogous to the cartridge and the xbox analogous to the CD ROM, the loading times are only paired with the of the PS5 precisely because it ssd is being used to move a large volume of data, data that allows the playstation to put more assets and save gpu and memory resources, resources saved on technology is the same as having more resources, because without these savings it would be necessary to spend more resources, thus requiring more gpu power , the xbox cannot do this therefore you need to run everything on the gpu,
    this partially explains the reason for the PS5 outperform xbox, there are other reasons such as higher fill rate, fill rate and geometry are clock sensitive when multiplying the ROPS numbers by the clock the PS5 gets bigger also there are chips in the ps5 for compression and decompression than in the xbox is made by cpu and many other undisclosed secrets, MS wanted to sell numbers and is therefore embarrassed.

    The xbox started very well, it is an incredible machine but unfortunately it was overcome by the genius of Mark Cerny, the narrative of the tools is just a silly narrative created by MS and vocalized by its opinion makers to maintain the self-esteem of those who bought xbox thinking that it would be more powerful than the PS5, MS made many mistakes in the communication so it will pay for each one of them, it would be more honest they lower the price of the xbox because if they keep the same price they will not sell, they want to use the narrative of tools that be, but they will be humiliated in every faceoff

  9. #399
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    Microsoft, devs and people connected to devs know that the xbox is delivering everything it can, if any dev says something positive or supports the narrative of the magic Tools is for pure diplomacy.

    They removed the phrase: most powerful console and exchanged it for most powerful xbox

    they did this a few months ago because hardware issues cannot be fully resolved by software.

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    Quote Originally Posted by gamevet View Post
    It's lowest point is 1440p.


    That being said, the demo was doing light sourced objects much better than any sort of Ray Tracing we've seen in the current games available for both consoles
    All being said it was a graphics demo to a product that will never see the light of day as a full game product and was a graphics demo to show off the Engine for developers.

    You were nitpicking the resolution of the Unreal 5 engine for using (as low as)1440p resolution
    Do you mean saying the truth?. I've not made any wild claims over console games using Raytracing effects in large parts at 4K and 60 FPS. Some PC users have to dial down effects if they want some games to run at 4K with Raytracing at 60 FPS and that's on good rigs as we've seen on the likes of Control or Metro. So sorry I'm not expecting £450 console's to outdo high PC's for effects when the GFX card costs the same just on its own.

    All I've said is the Xbox Series X GPU and CPU are more powerful than the PS5 GPU and CPU, which I think is factually quite true.
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    another faceoff Digital Foundry, xbox worse again

    it's natural that MS doesn't accept that it was caught by surprise by a better engineering solution
    But the games are being launched and showing this to the public

  12. #402
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    Quote Originally Posted by SegaAMD View Post
    you haven't understood yet. The ssd is not only for loading time, they are the ''media'' through which the game is read, do not realize, the ps5 ssd would be analogous to the cartridge and the xbox analogous to the CD ROM, the loading times are only paired with the of the PS5 precisely because it ssd is being used to move a large volume of data, data that allows the playstation to put more assets and save gpu and memory resources, resources saved on technology is the same as having more resources, because without these savings it would be necessary to spend more resources, thus requiring more gpu power , the xbox cannot do this therefore you need to run everything on the gpu,
    this partially explains the reason for the PS5 outperform xbox, there are other reasons such as higher fill rate, fill rate and geometry are clock sensitive when multiplying the ROPS numbers by the clock the PS5 gets bigger also there are chips in the ps5 for compression and decompression than in the xbox is made by cpu and many other undisclosed secrets, MS wanted to sell numbers and is therefore embarrassed.

    The xbox started very well, it is an incredible machine but unfortunately it was overcome by the genius of Mark Cerny, the narrative of the tools is just a silly narrative created by MS and vocalized by its opinion makers to maintain the self-esteem of those who bought xbox thinking that it would be more powerful than the PS5, MS made many mistakes in the communication so it will pay for each one of them, it would be more honest they lower the price of the xbox because if they keep the same price they will not sell, they want to use the narrative of tools that be, but they will be humiliated in every faceoff
    I hear what you're saying but an SSD wouldn't explain stuff like screen tearing in Assassin's Creed


    This is a software issue, it looks like the game is writing to the wrong buffer or something.

  13. #403
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    Quote Originally Posted by Team Andromeda View Post
    All being said it was a graphics demo to a product that will never see the light of day as a full game product and was a graphics demo to show off the Engine for developers.
    And yet you don't seem to understand what that demo is showing. It's an engine that is doing things not possible using traditional graphics rendering through your GPU. Even at double the CU cores of what the 6800 XT has, it wouldn't be possible to do that level of global illumination using brute force GPU rendering. All of the graphica calculations and assets are stored within the files on the SSD. The GPU has very little to do with what is being displayed.



    Do you mean saying the truth?. I've not made any wild claims over console games using Raytracing effects in large parts at 4K and 60 FPS. Some PC users have to dial down effects if they want some games to run at 4K with Raytracing at 60 FPS and that's on good rigs as we've seen on the likes of Control or Metro. So sorry I'm not expecting £450 console's to outdo high PC's for effects when the GFX card costs the same just on its own.
    I've ran Ray Tracing on Metro Exodus. Even a 2080 Ti will struggle with that level of Ray Tracing, and it certainly wouldn't be doing it at 4K/60.

    Well, you're acting like (why even bring up the resolution?) because it's not being rendered at 4K/60, that it isn't impressive. When there's no way that much more powerful PC hardware wouldn't struggle with that level of graphics, doing it on its own.

    All I've said is the Xbox Series X GPU and CPU are more powerful than the PS5 GPU and CPU, which I think is factually quite true.
    No, because you can't base graphical power upon one single figure, or even 2. If the system it's on isn't balanced, those numbers won't amount to much other than cock swinging. And know how good Sony's 1st in-house development is over Microsofts, Sony will squeeze more out of what they have than MS.
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  14. #404
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    Sony and Nintendo are the absolute best out of getting the most out of their hardware. This was never a strength of MS. Ninja Theory while I think their games are bad,NT can make some very good looking games. So that maybe the studio to flex the muscle of XSX...if they didn't have XSS to deal with. This talks about how polygon budgets are no more with that demo https://www.polygon.com/2020/5/13/21...ics-epic-games

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  15. #405
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    Quote Originally Posted by Leynos View Post
    Sony and Nintendo are the absolute best out of getting the most out of their hardware. This was never a strength of MS. Ninja Theory while I think their games are bad,NT can make some very good looking games. So that maybe the studio to flex the muscle of XSX...if they didn't have XSS to deal with. This talks about how polygon budgets are no more with that demo https://www.polygon.com/2020/5/13/21...ics-epic-games
    MS is famous for producing buggy, bloated software. At least they usually fix it in the next version. I don't think we've seen the best of what the XSX can produce yet.

    Nintendo always impresses me with what they can do with their hardware but it usually takes them awhile to reach that point. I wonder what would have happened if they'd launched the Wii U with games like Breath of the Wild and Mario Kart 8, instead of bundling it with NSMBU. Which is a decent game but it hardly pushes the hardware, other than the resolution it probably could have run on the Gamecube.

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